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MBNA credit card debt

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Please can someone advise on weather or not I have to give details of my income and outgoings over the phone?, I have explained to MBNA that for the first time in over 22 years I am out of work due to my company closing the London office, I am now on job seekers and have written and told MBNA that all I can afford at this time is 5.00 per month, I have sent the first payment by postal order, and have also asked for the cca, today I received a phone call from them, they did not ask any security questions, they explained that unless I told them over the phone what my outgfoings were then they would not freeze the interest, I explained that I would put the details in writing to them only (do I have to supply this info to them) they then said that unless I also contacted them by phone and discussed it with them, then they would not freeze the interest or consider any reduced payment, I explained that I have requested the cca and not yet received, they said their T & C's were sent out to me on the first of September (I have received nothing yet) I explained that it was not the T & C's I requested and until I recieved what I requested I was not discussing it further, (I recorded the call with Truecall) I really cannot see what can be gained by discussing it over the phone, it wont change that fact that I only have 64.00 a week income, down from 550.00(nett) a week before I lost my job of 22 years, so there is a vast shortfall in my income, I have made cut backs where ever I can especially with food as this is one compromise I can make without hurting anyone, I find that 4 tins of beans and and a loaf of bread has to last me the week now, if I have to pay anything more to them, then what goes the beans or the bread?, this is truly the stage I am at, it is very hard to think there is no help out there for someone that has paid their taxes and worked all their life since leaving school and asked for nothing from anyone (sorry to get sad but it is a very difficult time for me and I am sure I am a lot better off than some others out there) I look forward to any replies :-)

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Hi,

I am truly sorry that you are going through this at the moment. Hopefully your circumstances will improve.

 

While there is no requirement for you to give MBNA any financial info, it can be useful to do so but in writing only.

 

As to the phone call, I would make a transcript of the call (you can't use the actual recording unless you informed them they were being recorded), make a formal complaint to MBNA, Trading Standards and the Information Commissioner offering a copy of the transcript should they require it.

 

If you feel the phone calls are getting too much, you can send a letter to stop them calling

 

Did you do the CCA request in writing?

Once you get a reply, post up the agreement and let the experts have a look


If you are asked to deal with any matter via private message, PLEASE report it.

Everything I say is opinion only. If you are unsure on any comment made, you should see a qualified solicitor

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Firstly dont tell them anything about your finances, they have no right at all to that information. Well done for recording the call, I would now report them to the office of fair trading, the FOS and the Data Commisioners office. I trust that you sent in your CCA request recorded delivery so once the 12+2 days are up then send them the dispute letter found in the templates section of this website.

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Thanks Woody and Silverfox for your replies, I sent the request off for the cca by recorded delivery with a one pound postal order, please could you also help me with a cca I have recived from Tesco, I posted it on here yesterday under thread: gem100 Tesco cca (I think) and as I attached the cca to the post it can be viewed, I really need to know for sure if it is enforceable, I have had some response but no one is a hundred percent sure, I would really appreciate if some one is more an expert in the field of cca's and can advise accordingly as I do not want to go the route of it not being enforceable when it is, look forward to your replies.

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Your income is just that YOURS. YOU decide what you can pay them, only a judge has the right to request and receive this information. Tell them, in writing, that you have used a Court Supported I & E calculator to record this information, and that you have, according to the 'Poverty Rules' of the Dept of Work and Pensions, no disposible income. As such, remind them that if they tried to enforce this alleged debt in Court, with the information you have, then a judge would, in all probability order you to pay £1 per month, assuming that they could produce an enforceable Agreement.

 

If they call again, just say, everything in writing, I will not enter into any conversation, and put the phone down. If they persist in calling, buy a loud whistle and blow it down the phone each time they call!


Every journey begins with a single step :):)

 

Please note: I have no qualifications in this area - my advice is learned from the wonderful members of this Forum. Thanks to you all for your help.

 

If you have found my post helpful please leave a short message by clicking the star to the left of my profile - Thank You

 

The only person entitled to your Personal Finance details is a Judge not a DCA

 

Move all banking activity to another banking group if you have a dispute - your funds can be used to offset debts within the same group.

Be careful with Banking details (card/account numbers) as these can be used to take unauthorised payments.

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Hi Harrassed Senior, and thanks for your reply, like the whistle idea, I know I am jumping the gun a bit here, but what about the threat of them not stopping the interest unless I comply with their demands to discuss this over the phone?, I know it is best to wait and see what the cca request achieve's as until I know if it is enforceable or not then I suppose I should not worry too much about their demands, but I am concerned about the interest being added on each month as I will be fighting a losing battle, so any advice as to what to do regarding this would be greatly appreciated.

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Since JSA is intended to cover essential living expenses only, you have no disposable income. MBNA can therefore either freeze interest and get what you're prepared to pay or keep adding interest and get nothing.

 

PS Whilst your cost cutting is admirable, you can't live on 4 tins of beans and a loaf of bread forever.


RMW

"If you want my parking space, please take my disability" Common car park sign in France.

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They are in no position to demand anything, much less your I/E, or" telephone interview"...what!!??...thats a new one on me.:evil:

 

Pay them nothing while you await the CCA, then post again on here, so that we can look at it.

How old is the MBNA account, roughly


Please note i have no legal training any advice i give comes from my own experience and from what i have learned on this site

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Since JSA is intended to cover essential living expenses only, you have no disposable income. MBNA can therefore either freeze interest and get what you're prepared to pay or keep adding interest and get nothing.

 

PS Whilst your cost cutting is admirable, you can't live on 4 tins of beans and a loaf of bread forever.

 

I second that! You have to think of your health before paying these bar stewards. If they took you to court while you're on JSA they would only get £1 per month. Don't worry that they wont freeze interest, wait to see what they produce regarding your CCA request. Even if it is enforceable, at some point further down the road they may offer a full & final settlement, a percentage of your total debt.

 

Just take it one step at a time, remove personal info from the documents they send you using microsoft paint and post the scanned image on this forum where people can advise you.


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Just some experience from me with MBNA:

 

They tried everything with me (except the telephone interview... ha) I produced I/E in writing and offered £1 for 6 months and a review.

 

They got all tough and said £125 per month. I decided to ask for help on here, and now they have sold produced and unenforceable agreement, invalid DN and sold the debt inside the remedy period (£13k!!!).

 

You are not dealing with a clever bunch here and the Cagger's have a wealth of info, help and support that outways the so called institution.

 

Unemployement is not a crime and MBNA are not the judge and jury. You are protected by the law and usually MBNA's non compliance of it.

 

I'll help where i can, i'll keep an eye out for your requests but do me a favour... a loaf and 4 tins of beans?? You need to speak to someone mate.

 

Citizens Advice to make sure you benefits are right and maybe thats the start of the improvement for your situation.

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Hi all, thankyou so much for your replies, they do cheer me up, really mad woman just to let you know that I have decided to have a more varied diet, and I now alternate the beans with spaghetti hoops so life is now more enjoyable. MBNA said they had sent me something on the 2nd of September but were not sure what, I have received nothing to date, the card is at least six years old could be more, as was Abbey before and that is who I signed with, so I wait and see, I have had Tesco's cca and to date still have not had any confirmation on here if it is enforceable or not, it has been suggested that as there was no option to cancel (as was done through the post) then it might not be, but it is a 2004 agreement, will post it here again later today as I have to download it again, but I posted it on thread: gem-100 Tesco CCA a few days ago, so I will be on here again later today to post it again on this thread, once again thanks to you guys, it is really appreciated that you offer your help, guidance and cheery words of reassurance :-)

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Just a bit of support here, hope you don't mind. Have you worked out your own I & E. You have to put yourself first. If you are on Benefits, then you are at Poverty Level. This means in effect, that you have no 'disposible' income and as such can make no payments towards any debts other than your priority bills (Mortgage/Rent: Council Tax: FOOD/an living expenses.

 

You should not be offering and/or paying anyone else more than £1 per month.

 

Most of the DCAs will try and play on your conscience that you owe the debt/spent the money/went on holiday etc. so you MUST pay what they think you owe. Do not let that concern you, a change in circumstances does not make you a bad person, and if they (the DCAs) took a look at themselves, they would find that they are beneath contempt and have no rights at all to sit in Judgement of fellow Humans Beings (I use that term loosly when applying it to DCAs).

 

soapbox.gif


Every journey begins with a single step :):)

 

Please note: I have no qualifications in this area - my advice is learned from the wonderful members of this Forum. Thanks to you all for your help.

 

If you have found my post helpful please leave a short message by clicking the star to the left of my profile - Thank You

 

The only person entitled to your Personal Finance details is a Judge not a DCA

 

Move all banking activity to another banking group if you have a dispute - your funds can be used to offset debts within the same group.

Be careful with Banking details (card/account numbers) as these can be used to take unauthorised payments.

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Hi all, have been busy investigating further as I know if I have to challenge anything I and lost, then I would not be able to cover any costs, so have been looking to see if I should seek legal advice regarding my Tesco agreement and then found this: http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/credit-and-loans/credit-cards/article.html?in_article_id=496875&in_page_id=53936

 

it looks like the courts are now not being sympathetic about missing/rejigged agreements, it looks like things are more difficult than I thought in this process so was wondering if there is any no win no fee help out there that could look at my agreements without charging me hugh sums of money for doing so only to find they are [causing problems] me, as another report have read just now has stated, it has been found that some 1500 firms are offering help, charging fees of 1k plus, only for the claiment to find that down the line they are still to pay the outstanding debt, plus being out of pocket to the adviser, any thoughts on this I would really appreciate, I know that at the very least so long as I keep them informed and keep paying the only amount I can afford then I should be ok, but what I dont want to find down the line is that I have challenged these companies only to find I am deeper in debt and that they could then prob take my house, help!

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Here is a further link regarding debt loopholes:

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The Carey case has clarified that the court has the power to declare whether there has or hasn’t been a breach of section 78 and each case will be considered on its own facts. It has clarified that a mere breach of section 78 will not of itself create an unfair relationship but that is not to say that such a breach is never going to be capable of creating an unfair relationship.

 

The emphasis in the Carey case on section 78 appears to have obscured the real claim that exists under section 61(1)(a) and 127(3) of the Act. These sections dictate that a creditor must be able to produce a signed document (not necessarily the credit agreement) that contains the prescribed terms. The document must include the credit limit, the interest rate and details of how and when a debtor is to discharge his payment obligations. A failure to produce such a document is still capable of rendering the agreement irredeemably unenforceable.

 

In addition the case of McGuffick v RBS [2009] EWHC 2386 may have also put many debtors off the idea of challenging their agreements. It’s true that this case has confirmed that enforcement does not include normal collection activities such as reporting to the credit reference agencies or even issuing court proceedings.

 

However consumers should remember that should a creditor issue court proceedings against them, without first locating a signed document, they would have a defence to that action. Without a signed document the creditor will have to convince the court that on balance a document signed by the consumer containing the prescribed terms would have been produced at the time of execution. The onus is on them to prove this.


Anthrax alert at debt collectors caused by box of doughnuts

 

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Hi Cerberusalert, thankyou for your reply, I have posted my Tesco agreement on here and have been told that it is in order, and also been told that as I signed it at home, there should have been a cooling off period in the agreement, I will scan it here and if anyone could guide as to if it is enforceable or not I would very much appreciate the help, I look forward to any replies.

IMG.pdf

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See page 6 3. Consumer Credit (Cancellation...cuments) Regulations 1983..pdf

 

I'm not 100% certain but normally that agreement would not be covered by CCA 1974 because it was over £25K, however because they've added into the header that it is then CCA 1974 can be applied. No doubt someone will be able to confirm.


Anthrax alert at debt collectors caused by box of doughnuts

 

Make sure you do not post anything which identifies you. Although we can remove certain things from the site unless it's done in a timely manner everything you post will appear in Google cache & we do not have any control over that.

 

Vir prudens non contra ventum mingit

 

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

17 Port & Maritime Regiment RCT

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Thanks for the reply, I was told that as it was just 25k and not over, that it would be covered by the act, I really do not understand enough to know for sure though if the agreement itself is enforceable even by reading through the criteria, so still need expert guidance I guess?

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I was told that as it was just 25k and not over,
As I said I'm not 100% certain but with the added interest on the onset of the loan it puts it over the threshold at that time.

Anthrax alert at debt collectors caused by box of doughnuts

 

Make sure you do not post anything which identifies you. Although we can remove certain things from the site unless it's done in a timely manner everything you post will appear in Google cache & we do not have any control over that.

 

Vir prudens non contra ventum mingit

 

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

17 Port & Maritime Regiment RCT

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just my opinion, i think you will find it hard to convince a judge that thats unenforceable


Please note i have no legal training any advice i give comes from my own experience and from what i have learned on this site

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Hi Creditcardmug, thanks for your reply, can you please elaborate? I have been told several things on here you see, that the t & c's have to be on the same page I have signed, that there is no option to cancel as was signed at home, so would like to know what your comments are as would be most helpful.

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The T&Cs don't have to be on the same page, but they should make up part of the agreement. Often T&Cs run to at least a couple of pages. There is usually a statement about a "cooling off period" of around two weeks, but I don't think that's a requirement.

 

If you've submitted a CCA request, then you need to make sure that not only the Credit Agreement is compliant, but that all other aspects of the request have also been fulfilled.


Please note, I am not professionally qualified in legal matters. Should you have any doubts, you should contact a legal expert.

However, I can and will help with matters regarding payroll as I am fully qualified.

 

If I've helped in any way, you're welcome to click on my "star" and thanks, but I gain the most satisfaction simply by helping/reassuring :O)

 

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Guest Cartaphilus

Okay, well I am getting seriously confused - not hard these days TBH - about this because I have read an awful lot about 'the four corners' rule and that it all had to be within the same page. From posts here and from MSE.

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It has been said that they KEY terms should be within the 4 corners of the document. Additional T's&C's can be in a separate document

The KEY terms

APR

Credit limit (or a statement saying one will be set)

Repayment terms

Cancellation rights (dependant on the type of agreement)

Edited by silverfox1961
ye gods, I can't spell :)

If you are asked to deal with any matter via private message, PLEASE report it.

Everything I say is opinion only. If you are unsure on any comment made, you should see a qualified solicitor

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Guest Cartaphilus

Thank you.

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