1st Credit & LCS Battle - court papers received - help

[newman]

Thanks very much for that BB.

 

I am sorry but how do I bump this? Not sure what that means.

 

Also with respect to this threatened County Court action this is now the 6th Letter since August where they have threatened County Court action so I am minded not to do anything unless I get an actual Court date and then I will swing into action with the CPR's. I am tending to agree with a lot of people on here who have clearly stated that if 1st Crappy had my signed CCA they would have taken me to court long before now.

 

From what I have read on this forum so far unless they have the actual original signed CCA I dont think they are going to take me to court. Even if they did I think I would have a very strong defence as from the very begnning they and Citi have not adhered to the correct way of doing things.

 

Having now had time to mull this over I am not going to make any decisions until they show me the whites of their eyes.

 

The last time I was taken to court over a financial matter (personal one not anything to do with CC's) the people taking me to court proclaimed to all and sundry that they were going to wipe the floor with me and sue me for thousands, however, on the day we went the judge threw them out as they had no case whatsoever. I had prepared a very detailed defence and as it was a contractual matter they stood no chance as they had broken my contract with them in so many places they stood no chance.

 

So if this lot do take me to Court I will go there with a hugely well prepared case.

 

This may all be academic in the New Year anyway as I had some very good news earlier today. I received an email saying that a company I have been working with for the last 12 months to try secure a huge contract for one of my parters have now agreed to the terms we have been discussing. This is excellent news and means that the legal teams now just have to agree the finer points of the T's & C's. As soon as the contract is signed we get paid and this would mean that we would be able to pay off all of our unsecured debt and pay off our house mortgage too and be totally debt free. If however this doesnt work out we just keep working hard to try to move forwards.

[newman]

Hi Newman,

 

just read through your thread, keep resiliant mate and just ignore the letters, basically, how many chances do you honestly think they would give you if they knew they had even a reasonable chance of getting 100% of the alleged debt repaid or even a smaller percentage?? It would have been before a judge a long time ago if they did.

They realise, they have no chance of getting any judgement enforced (not that they will ever admit that point!), so will try to wear you down by all means possible in order to secure a payment. Don't crumble, just wait for the postman to drop the court summons onto your doormat, but don't hold your breath, you'll be waiting for an eternity, believe me!

 

Hopefully your "good news" will bear fruit and allow you a passage out of financial debt misery.

 

Chin up mate and keep the phrase, "I'm made of mettle not stone and I do not crumble" to mind

 

Best wishes

 

Swisstoni

 

Swiss Toni

 

Thank you so much for your very encouraging post, which has come at a very good timing as I have received another threatening letter from 1st Crappy this morning.

 

Its another "County Court Proceedings" one which states " I regret the sum remains outstanding, we now intend to issue possible Court Litigation against you. We are however prepared to offer you one last opportunity to settle your account at a VERY generous amount

 

YOU PAY 70%

WE PAY 30%

 

Isnt that nice of them and at Christmas too - how thoughtful they are to offer me such a bargain at Christmas. They must be Christians to have such a generous heart at this time of year!!!!!

 

This is now about the 4th " one last opportunity" they have given me.

 

Laughable really.

 

Well this has gone on the file with the rest of the other letters.

 

On the business side things have accelerated forward since my last post and we now have moved to the point where we are looking like the contract I mentioned may even close by the end of the year. Detailed negotiations have taken place between my development partners and the funders we introduced them to and agreements have now been reached and we are working to a date of 31-12-10 for signing of the contracts and funding of the projects at which point we get paid!!!! We also have three other partners where we have signed contracts too and I just heard this morning that the term sheets for two of these projects for the funding are going to be issuied on Monday.

 

So its all fingers, legs and arms crossed here at the moment as we steer the big ship of contract negotiation to its final destination.

 

1st Crappy are going to have to sing for their supper.

[newman]

Well I thought it was too good to be true. I think I need some help now chaps - what do I need to do from here

 

I received a letter this morning from Connaught Collections which I note is a trading style of 1st Credit (or is it mary at the next desk?)

 

"Dear sir

RE IST CREDIT - Citifinancial £XXXX

 

We have been instructed by 1st Credit Ltd - Citifinancial to recover this debt.

 

You are invited to settle this account immediately or provide us with a good reason for non payment, within the next seven days.

 

Credit Bureau data shows that you have sufficient assets to settle our debt.

 

Should we not hear from you within the time frame suggested this matter will be passed to our BANKRUPTCY DEPARTMENT for the immediate issue of a STATUTORY NOTICE under the insolvency act 1986

 

Yours faithfully

 

ENFORCEMENT DEPARTMENT

 

Our company has the sole control of your account. Payment must be sent to this office. DO NOT PAY A DOORSTEP COLLECTTR without first gaining our authority.

-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0

 

Can anyone suggest what my next step should be please - do I continue to ignore them or ask to see everything they have on me on file? - if the latter option is the one to go for can you please give me an idiots guide to what I need to write to them and ask them for.

 

Many thanks in advance.

Edited January 25, 2011 by ScarletPimpernel
Remove potentially identifying information

[Loser4u]

You can either chose to ignore or you can have some fun replying to them.

If you chose to reply head all the letters with the "I do not acknowledge any debt to your company"

 

Something all the lines of

Dear ****

Can you please clarify which account you are referring to as the account details you have supplied are vague and misleading.

Can you also confirm who you client is and when you were instructed, as I haven’t received any correspondence from either of the two companies you list that they have instructed you to act on their behalf.

 

I draw your attention to the OFT Debt collection guidelines July 2003 (Updated December 2006) which make it quite what action is and isn’t permitted when an account is in dispute. Your demand for me to contact you with 7 days of a letter dated the "insert date" and received the "Insert date" is a breach of these guidelines.

 

Below is an example of just some of the Guidelines which I believe you and your client are in breach of

Examples of unfair practices are as follows:

2.6 d. not ensuring that an adequate history of the debt is passed on as appropriate resulting in repetitive and/or frequent contact by different parties

2.6 e. not informing the debtor when their case has been passed on to a different debt collector

2.6 f. pressurising debtors to pay in full, in unreasonably large instalments, or to increase payments when they are unable to do so

2.6 h. ignoring and/or disregarding claims that debts have been settled or are disputed and continuing to make unjustified demands for payment

 

By return please send me a copy of your complaints procedure and the complaint reference you have assigned to this formal complaint.

 

I reserve the right to report your activities to any such regulatory authority as I see fit.

You have 14 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter.

[newman]

Loser 4 u ., Nikki & Baby Bear

 

Thank you all so much for your replies. I am really hacked off to put it mildly that they have now got very heavy and I think the time has come to give them as many problems as I can and I think I need some help from those that know a lot more than I do.

 

I am definately in the mood to complain but my questions are to whom do I complain and do you have an example of a letter I can modify?

 

I can of course write directly to these jokers but I want to give them as much work as possible now and I want them to send me eveything they have on file on which they intend to use against me. Can you please help me in this process? I asked in an earlier post if I should

A) still ignore this - not an option now I think but I dont want to give them the impression they are scaring me!

B) SAR them

C) CPR 31.14 them

D) Ask them very nicely to take me to court and let a judge decide on he legality of the case

 

Do I take option B or C and if so what is the correct procedure?

 

Very unhappy now.

 

Many thanks again in advance.

[ScarletPimpernel]

1st Credit are certainly very tedious, but you will see from the way they always use words like may and potential belies their lack of teeth.

 

If they thought that litigation was likely to bring them the result they want, they'd have gone to court already. They are no more than bullies who are full of pish and wind; you may want to send them a formal complaint about their non-compliant actions, but on the other hand you may feel that letting them continue to willy-wave in the hope that they'll scare you into submission will provide you with a satisfying demonstration of their impotence without dignifying their drivel with an answer.

[Loser4u]

I used to enjoy writing back to them with the the contents of your recent letters are noted and nothing more headed with I do not acknowledge any debt to your company.

I think I also thanked them in one letter for the action they took.

This helped me to find the relevant help and that the debt was unenforceable. Instead of paying them regular payments until the account had been settled.

Like others I told them if they disagreed with the points I raised then they would need to take me to court and I gave them the address of my local court.

 

If they thought they had a case you would have been in court a long time ago.

Go through the complaints process and once you have their response report them to the OFT

If you SAR them they will get £10 of your money so go down the CPR route on the basis that they are threatening you with court action.

They will respond to your letters but not to the points you raise so you have to keep pushing them about the points you raise and be as annoying to them as they have been to you

[newman]

1st Credit are certainly very tedious, but you will see from the way they always use words like may and potential belies their lack of teeth.

 

If they thought that litigation was likely to bring them the result they want, they'd have gone to court already. They are no more than bullies who are full of pish and wind; you may want to send them a formal complaint about their non-compliant actions, but on the other hand you may feel that letting them continue to willy-wave in the hope that they'll scare you into submission will provide you with a satisfying demonstration of their impotence without dignifying their drivel with an answer.

 

Thanks very much ScarletPimpernel. I totally agree with you - tedious is one word to describe them thats for sure and I can think of a few others that are not repeatable on a public forum. What got me concerned this time is that they have changed theoir language from "we may/possibly" etc to "Should we not hear from you within the time frame suggested this matter will be passed to our BANKRUPTCY DEPARTMENT for the immediate issue of a STATUTORY NOTICE under the insolvency act 1986"

 

I take your point about them not taking me to court already and I can see the attraction of not responding but there is a part of me that wants to make things hard for them by going down the lets make them work a bit harder route.

[newman]

I used to enjoy writing back to them with the the contents of your recent letters are noted and nothing more headed with I do not acknowledge any debt to your company.

I think I also thanked them in one letter for the action they took.

This helped me to find the relevant help and that the debt was unenforceable. Instead of paying them regular payments until the account had been settled.

Like others I told them if they disagreed with the points I raised then they would need to take me to court and I gave them the address of my local court.

 

If they thought they had a case you would have been in court a long time ago.

Go through the complaints process and once you have their response report them to the OFT

If you SAR them they will get £10 of your money so go down the CPR route on the basis that they are threatening you with court action.

They will respond to your letters but not to the points you raise so you have to keep pushing them about the points you raise and be as annoying to them as they have been to you

 

Hi Loser4u

 

I like that approach - thank you for your letter and the contents are noted! Excellent as that is exactly the way they responded to my complaint letters at the beginning and then took nearly three years to come back to me.

 

Do you think the complaints process and the CPR request should be done at the same time or should I make them work first on giving me the relevant details for the complaint and then CPR them?

 

Oh and just to clarify so I am in no doubt my question is - is the request for a CPR 31:14 the right one to make or is there another one?

 

Thanks again for all your help! It is hugely apprecaited.

 

Well its now 7 days since the date of their last letter and so we will see after tomorrow whether they are going to do now what they have stated categorically they are going to do so I may wait a couple of days before writing to them. It will be interesting to see what the next letter has to say.

 

I dont want them to have the impression they have scared me into action but I think enough is enough now - time to fight back i think -

Edited January 26, 2011 by newman
spelling mistakes

[newman]

CPR, in my opinion because they threatend court action is the best route done in tandom with the other letter Not sure which section of CPR though so best to wait for someone with more knowledge than me to pop by

 

Thanks again BB. I think that is a good strategy.

 

So is there anyone thayt can give me the exact details for the correct CPR number please?

[babybear39]

If you don't get guidance today we'll flag to the site team

[newman]

BB

 

Thank you so much - this is hugely appreciated.

 

As much as I am trying to not let this get to me, the truth is that it is really affecting me - I am only human after all. This constant pressure from this bunch of muppets is beyond a joke and I guess I am now feeling I want to take this lot on because as has been said many times on this thread if they really had something against me they would have had me in court a long time ago.

 

All of our other creditors have either gone away because they havent produced the correct paperwork or are happy with the small amount money we can afford to pay them each month. This lot are like a dog with a bone that has long since had all of the marrow sucked out of it!!

 

Once again - massive thanks for everyones help.

[babybear39]

My pleasure I have a 'soft spot' for 1st crud

[newman]

If you don't get guidance today we'll flag to the site team

 

Hi Babybear39 - I forgot to check back on progress - How do i go about contacting the site team for some assistance?

 

I would like to start the ball rolling with letters although its been 10 days since the date of their letter so the threatened 7 day deadline has come and gone with nothing through the post!

 

Thanks

[babybear39]

I've flagged a message to the site team for you...

 

If you need to do so in future click on the triangle at the bottom of the post

[spamheed]

You could (at this stage) use CPR18 to request further informationon their potential claim.

 

ie not requesting copies of the documents, but whether they are actually in possession of the original agreement, the default notice, the notice and deed of assignment and in what format, electronic, paper, microfiche etc.

 

As they are required to provide this along with a signed statement of fact it would be acceptable as evidence in a court and could be used to form part of any defence

[newman]

I've flagged a message to the site team for you...

 

If you need to do so in future click on the triangle at the bottom of the post

 

Thanks very much BB - much appreciated. I had seen the traingle but thought it was there only to report dodgy posts!

[babybear39]

No worries lol...

 

Regards, BB.

[newman]

You could (at this stage) use CPR18 to request further informationon their potential claim.

 

ie not requesting copies of the documents, but whether they are actually in possession of the original agreement, the default notice, the notice and deed of assignment and in what format, electronic, paper, microfiche etc.

 

As they are required to provide this along with a signed statement of fact it would be acceptable as evidence in a court and could be used to form part of any defence

 

Thanks Spamheed - Northumberland eh? Thats my neck of the woods - well not quite - I am originally from Shotley Bridge.

 

Am I right in thinking that with the CPR 31:14 is requesting all of the documents and if this is the case, what would the advantage be of using CPR 18.

 

Also do you have a copy of or a link to an example letter I could have a look at?

[IdaInFife]

cpr 31:14 is for requesting docs that the claimaint has metioned in pleadings.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?255329-CPR-part-18-vs-CPR-31.14-Confused-well-read-here

[Happyhippy1959]

I have followed this with great interest Newman. Good on you, don't let them drag you down. BR me Ass,,,, I can't wait to see what they throw at you next,,,, they have used up all there weapons surely, unless capital punishment has been re-established for debt?????? Have I missed some thing on one of my trips!!!!!

 

Supporting you all the way.

[newman]

Thanks Idain FIfe and Happy Hippy.

 

Ida - I started to look through the thread you suggested and it does look interesting. Thanks very much for that.

 

Happy Hippy - thanks for the encouragement - much appreciated although there was one bit of the message I dont understand -"BR me Ass"?? - Sorry am I being totally thick here?

[Happyhippy1959]

There threat of Bankruptcy,,,,,, It's all wind and gas my friend that is what I meant. With that bad-boy out of the way what else can they threaten you with. A 6ft 6inch gangster !!!!!!!!!!!!! doubt it very much. What I am saying is that was there last weapon to frighten you with. There is nothing left in there armoury bet your bottom dollar you get a we can save you *%" % off your bill malarkey, If the threat of BR doe's not move you to pay what is left for them. They are as many have said blowing the proverbial out of there Ass.... They would have taken you to court long ago... Just now ignore them and see what they have left.

[spamheed]

Thanks Spamheed - Northumberland eh? Thats my neck of the woods - well not quite - I am originally from Shotley Bridge.

 

Am I right in thinking that with the CPR 31:14 is requesting all of the documents and if this is the case, what would the advantage be of using CPR 18.

 

Also do you have a copy of or a link to an example letter I could have a look at?

 

As Ida says, the CPR31.14 is a request for documents mentioned or referred to in the particulars of their claim, since they haven't actually issued a claim then we can't rely on that.

 

CPR18 can be used to request further information.

 

The link posted here goes into far greater depth over the purpose of each CPR and will help you gain a better understanding.

 

The key here is not simply copy/pasting and using templates, but understanding the processes available and using them correctly against them

[nikki1982]

Any updates for us newman?

x