Hutchison 3G Debt and Default

[DawseyY2K]

Well As the title would suggest I have a debt and default from Hutchison 3G that I need to do something about. I think the last time I attempted to do anything with it was in 2008 and I've been ignoring the problem since Hutchison and the collection companies had stopped bothering me. I'm getting older and its getting to that point where I need to start thinking about credit for a house etc. Time to get it removed.

 

The debt is for £501.54 that I strongly dispute. This was for a phone contract I took when I first went to university. The contract end date was 30th November 2005. Yes that's right almost 10 years ago.

 

Where to start, basically I had this phone contract and like all young youth going to University there was many a merry day socialising all hours of the night. As a result one evening I lost my phone on a night out. If memory serves me right I may of left it a day or 2 to see if the bar had the phone handed in, unfortunately not.

 

Next port of call was to phone up three and report the phone stolen and get it bared. Now As I mentioned the end of my contract was the 30 November 2005. I also lost the phone in November 2005 so like any sane person I had the phone bared, blocked and contract cancelled. This gave me the benefit of taking up a new contract with potentially a new phone company and getting a brand new phone I wouldn't have to pay for to get replaced.

 

So that was that, no further correspondence with them at all. I moved on and forgot all about it... till that frightful day. Some time in 2007, yes that's right 2 years after reporting the phone stolen and "cancelling" my contract I receive a letter from my first credit collection company demanding the debt of £501.54. Well you can imagine my reaction, what the hell is this debt? After working out who Hutchisons 3G was I think I remember phoning them up and arguing with them till I was blue in the face. Well they wouldn't listen so I tried to ignore them.

 

All Went quiet for a period, victory I told myself... wrong! Wesscott credit services were the new bad guy on the block. After getting a letter from these guys I decided I'd go on the attack and not ignore them. Armed with my silver tongue I phoned them up. I disputed the fact I didnt owe the money and they told me it soundly like there was an error on Hutchisons side and that they would investigate the matter. At last someone was listening.

 

27/08/2007 - I receive a letter from wesscot.

 

Thank you for your patience whilst we investigated the enquiry that you raised with regard to the above account.

What was the outcome?

We can confirm that as a consequence of the query you raised, the above account has been retuned to our client.

What does this mean?

We have closed the debt on our computer and returned the account to our client.

No further action will be taken by Wescot credit services to recover the above account

 

Victory! or so I thought.

 

22/02/2008 - Creditlink account recovery solution (CARS) credit collection agency number 3. Well at this point I'm banging my head against the wall. Several letters from them. And references from wescot.

 

01/05/2008 - Yes you guessed it, Courtlink UK. Agency number 4. There trying to scare me now with 'court action' and 'ccj's'. I'm shaking.

 

23/06/2008 - Is this legal? feels like harassment Scotcall Debt collecting services, agency number 5! At this point I'm beyond angry. After emailing the latest credit collection company I was in correspondence with a rather rude individual named Matt who told me.

 

You are simply missing the point I am making here.

 

I will not correspond with you any longer unless it is to discuss a repayment plan or if you have actually have a valid dispute.

 

Apparently I'm missing the point. the point all but one credit collection company (wescot) seems to understand and that is Three failed to close my contract and instead choose to incur me monthly debts for a phone that doesn't exist for 2 years before deciding to try contact me through a credit collection company.

 

And there's more

02/07/2008

 

I finally get a reply from three in writing.

 

Hi Adrian

 

I’m sorry to know that you had to write to us again about the cancellation and the balance on your account.

 

I can understand how upsetting this has been for you. We sent you an email on 31 May addressing all your concerns but I believe you haven’t received it. So for your convenience, I'm explaining the details once again for you.

 

Your contract end date was 30 November 2005. To cancel you need to give us 30 days’ notice. It looks like the confusion was caused by the fact that we have no record of you cancelling in November 2005, when you reported your phone stolen. Because of this your contract remained active and you were charged for monthly line rental, even though you haven't used the services since then. However your account was closed on 19 January 2007 due to non payments and this is the only account, I was able to find with your details.

 

You called us on 13 May 2005 to change your billing address to 45 ****** Road, ******, Staffordshire, ******. But on 26 September 2005, your monthly bills were returned to us. So due to the security reasons we stopped sending you bills. As we were unable to send you bills and also there were no payments made on the account, your account was passed to debt collection agency.

 

The charges applied on your account are correct, so I’d ask you to contact CARS to make payment of £501.54 as soon as possible. After this amount is cleared, we’ll be happy to update your credit file. But the payment history shown on the file will be a true reflection of how the account was managed. I’ve also arranged to send you a letter via post with the same details. You should receive this letter within five working days at your billing address.

 

I hope I’ve explained you clearly the details about the cancellation and the balance on your account. But if you still have any more questions, just ring us on 333 (free from any 3 mobile) or 08707 330333 (national rate) from any phone.

 

Your views and opinions are important to us. Please take two minutes to complete our short survey at http://www.three.co.uk/responsesurvey. Your feedback will help us deliver a better customer experience.

 

 

Regards

 

Did you read that!

 

Your contract end date was 30 November 2005

 

we have no record of you cancelling in November 2005, when you reported your phone stolen

that's convenient.

 

contract remained active and you were charged for monthly line rental

 

However your account was closed on 19 January 2007 due to non payments

It took them 2 years to work out non payment!

 

You called us on 13 May 2005 to change your billing address

Plenty of time for them to update there records to the correct address.

 

But on 26 September 2005, your monthly bills were returned to us. So due to the security reasons we stopped sending you bills

Now that's even more convenient. A month after reporting my phone stolen they stop sending me letters for a "security risk".

 

If I received a letter in September or any time for that matter after reporting the phone stolen I would of realised there mistake and chased to make sure they cancelled. At the moment it feels like they had gross employee negligence when not cancelling my account when asked. Then purposely sent a letter to my old address to fake a "security risk" and have a reason to keep on charging me. I wouldn't be surprised if there was commission involved somewhere.

 

Any ideas how I can fix this? They have also defaulted my credit history, It needs to be removed.

 

Kind Regards

 

p.s. sorry for the essay.

Edited September 6, 2010 by DawseyY2K

[harrassed senior]

Sadly, not an unusual case. Most, if not all mobile companies do in fact continue billing past the end of Contract on a monthly basis, and it is up to you to cancel giving 30 days Notice. I have learned this both by personal experience and from the many users with this problem on CAG.

 

I am afraid that it will be difficult to get mention of this on your credit files removed, as, in their opinion at least, it is a true reflection of the history of the account.

 

I am fairly sure that Statute Barring can be applied to mobile phone contracts, so when was the last time you made payment on this account, it will clear from your files 6 years (5 in Scotland) from that date.

[DawseyY2K]

Sadly, not an unusual case. Most, if not all mobile companies do in fact continue billing past the end of Contract on a monthly basis, and it is up to you to cancel giving 30 days Notice. I have learned this both by personal experience and from the many users with this problem on CAG.

 

I am afraid that it will be difficult to get mention of this on your credit files removed, as, in their opinion at least, it is a true reflection of the history of the account.

 

I am fairly sure that Statute Barring can be applied to mobile phone contracts, so when was the last time you made payment on this account, it will clear from your files 6 years (5 in Scotland) from that date.

 

are they under no obligation to notify me? Logic seems to go out the window here, how can I pay for something I don't know about? And what about the default itself, it popped up at some point during this whole ordeal. They never contacted me or anything to say it was going on?

 

I am fairly sure that Statute Barring can be applied to mobile phone contracts, so when was the last time you made payment on this account, it will clear from your files 6 years (5 in Scotland) from that date.

 

well thats a savoring thought. The last time I made any form of payment was in 2005? Surely this default shouldn't even be on my file? Luckily I've never paid anything at all as I've disputed it from the start. Looking at my credit file the actual date they defaulted me on was the 19/01/2007. Thats was months before receiving a letter from the first credit collection company.

 

I'm sure I read somewhere they have to give you a final notification? Obviously I never got this since they stopped sending me letters due to a "security risk".

 

Which would be the best method for removal, get them on the technicality (if true) or that fact I've made no payment since 2005?

[harrassed senior]

Well morally of course, I do agree, they should notify you, but the reality is that is the way that many company's choose to do business, its what they call opt out and really it should for fairness be called opt in. There are many things on the internet, Experian to name but one where you get a 'free months' credit' file, have to give your CC details, and then, after the first month they continue to bill you, until you opt out - that is the way that many 'try free for 30 days' etc. work now.

 

I do understand where you are coming from though, I have often recomended the following e-mail for 3 and they do seems to deal with your problems with speed. Unfortunately it is not always the response that you hope for, but the do seem responsive and open to listen to what you have to say. All I can suggest is to give it a try.

 

[email protected]

[Surfer01]

Surely if you report your phone as stolen to the company effectively common sense should prevail and the contract is cancelled by the supplier as you no longer have the phone and are unable to use it? Cancelling it will also prevent any one else using it. The mind boggles and they walk amongst us!

[Bazooka Boo]

Yes please send your complaint to the email address HS posted, this will get results quicker than using their antiquated complaints procedure, IMO I wouldn't pay them a single penny, contract or not, peoples circumstances change, how can you possibly know what or where your going to be 12 months in the future?

 

As for your credit file, you can put a notice of correction on there stating that this is diputed and is all charges, in the meantime email the CEO and state that the phone was stolen yet they insisted on continuing the contract and billing, therefore have racked up their own charges and debt.

[harrassed senior]

Just a point to answer your question about the loss of your phone - most contracts actually stipulate that this in itself is NOT a reason to cancel the Contract, there was much about this fact in the press a while ago, people losing i phones (stolen etc.) where finding out that they were still locked into their contracts (hence the hard sell on insurance).

 

Obviously, I am not condoning any of this, but just pointing out the hard facts of life - No, it is not fair, but much in life rarely is these days!.

 

A point concerning your credit files. If your last payment was 2005, then the account should have been defaulted within 6 months of the last payment. You can certainly query why this was never done until 2007. If the default had been noted correctly, ie some time in 2005, then this would be SB sometime in 2011 which would go some way towards making this 'go away'.

 

You do not need to make any payments now, this would just re-start the clock.

[DawseyY2K]

Just a point to answer your question about the loss of your phone - most contracts actually stipulate that this in itself is NOT a reason to cancel the Contract, there was much about this fact in the press a while ago, people losing i phones (stolen etc.) where finding out that they were still locked into their contracts (hence the hard sell on insurance).

 

Sadly I agree this is the way things are done etc.

 

The big problem I have is the fact that as far as I was aware the contract was canceled as requested. Backed up by the fact who would keep a contract that was at the end of its 12 month period and phone stolen.

 

Then they conveniently stop sending me mail. Its like they have done this on purpose.

 

A point concerning your credit files. If your last payment was 2005, then the account should have been defaulted within 6 months of the last payment. You can certainly query why this was never done until 2007. If the default had been noted correctly, ie some time in 2005, then this would be SB sometime in 2011 which would go some way towards making this 'go away'.

 

You do not need to make any payments now, this would just re-start the clock.

 

I think I'll just probably do this, 2011 ain't exactly far away and I've put up with the problem perfectly fine fore 5 years. A few more months wont make much difference.

 

I'll trying contacting the Email given though... you never know. Although I think that is who I had a written response from in the past. Maybe still worth a punt though, different person dealing with the case etc.

Edited September 8, 2010 by DawseyY2K

[harrassed senior]

Good luck hope all goes well, let us know with an update.

[Bazooka Boo]

At the end of the day it is only an mobile phone contract/bill you will not be put in jail for it, and there is nothing these fools can do..they may threaten fire and brimstone, but in reality they're the only ones who will get burnt..

[DawseyY2K]

You will never believe me when I say I'm still being chased by these imbeciles. This is more then a Joke now.

 

Latest company tracking me down is Advantis Credit.

 

I've never admitted this debt and always disputed it. Would I be right in saying that if last payment was made before November 2005, which would make it October 2005 that this debt has been statute barred since October 2011.

 

Would I also be correct in saying that...

 

The last telephone calls made is not acknowledgement of debt

Default is not an acknowledgement of debt

Disputing the debt is not acknowledgement of debt

 

The only thing that would count is If I or a person acting on my behalf, make a Payment or acknowledge the debt IN WRITING?

 

What would be the best way to deal with this, I'm inclined to ignore them? Also now the debt is barred could I also get the default removed from my credit history? Cant get anything on credit because of that.

Edited March 22, 2012 by DawseyY2K

[DawseyY2K]

well they sent another letter today

 

Notice of intent to commence debt collection action

 

failure to take action by 04 April 2012 will involve either debt collectors or ccj.

 

Anyone know if I'm right in saying the debt is statute barred since October 2011?

[brokebutnotbeatn]

If last payment was before Nov 2005 then it is well and truely SB'd. Suggest to write with teh SB letter and send recorded. Default dates and SB dates are often different; when is your default date?