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    • Yes, I did write before I offered to accept £1775 without prejudice,   I'm presuming I can withdraw the offer of settlement if he does not agree to be let off so lightly,     see further up for my correspondence today from TS, not only had he commuted a crime by omitting required pre contract information,  the dealer told me in an earlier email he had no idea of the legislation etc.   I pretty much answered that it wasn't my problem he didn't know, and as a trader he should be well aware of any and all legislation.    Pretty fed up with the whole situation at the moment to be honest, I can pm the email received by the trader for more insight of what I'm dealing with.
    • Aton - I see you've reacted to my post.  Note I've edited it since you read it.  I added the bit in asterisks about reasonable timescale.  Like I say don't just rely on me - see what others say too
    • i will guess it says exchange witness statements by 14 days before court date too?   dx  
    • thank you now he sits on his hands until you get the NTK which must arrive between 29-56 from date of windscreen Ticket   no harm in reading threads here mind    
    • So it's cost you 1850 + 361 = £2211   Yes - he's getting off lightly with 1775  and he wants to knock you back to 1700?   Unless you are happy to accept 1700 to make it go away, I think I'd go back to him, remind him that it's cost you over £2200 and that Trading standards in Scotland agree you have a valid case.  Tell him you are doing him a favour by offering to settle for 1775, and that if he doesn't except it within the next (I don't know - 48 hours? - by midnight saturday?*) you'll withdraw that offer and it goes up to £1850.  If he doesn't accept that you'll withdraw that offer too and go to ADR for the full £2200 that he's cost you.   If he argues that it was your decision to incur the £361 transport costs, remind him that you only had to do that because his quoted delivery costs were extortionately high, and that he could have avoided all of this by giving you the necessary pre-contract information in the first place, as required by law.   That's what I'd now do - but it's easy for me to say because it's your money not mine!  Wait and see what dx100uk and any others suggest.  If I were you, I certainly wouldn't do the above just on my advice.  In particular, I'm not sure how risky going to ADR is from your point of view, but I assume you're sort of committed to that now as you've offered it, and he accepted ADR I think?  (And if it does get to ADR it might be helpful to know if you are allowed to indicate during that process that his potential criminal offences have been reported to TS.  I don't know if you'd be allowed to do that or not.)   The dealer does seem to have given away quite a bit of ground, but at the end of the day you may be happy with £1700 just to get over it and move on, and may not want to push him any further.   Don't just rely on me.  See what others think.   *I've no idea of appropriate timescales.  48 hrs?  72?  five days?  A week?   But if you make this threat - you have to carry it through...
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    • Dazza a few months ago I discovered a good friend of mine who had ten debts with cards and catalogues which he was slavishly paying off at detriment to his own family quality of life, and I mean hardship, not just absence of second holidays or flat screen TV's.
       
      I wrote to all his creditors asking for supporting documents and not one could provide any material that would allow them to enforce the debt.
       
      As a result he stopped paying and they have been unable to do anything, one even admitted it was unenforceable.
       
      If circumstances have got to the point where you are finding it unmanageable you must ask yourself why you feel the need to pay.  I guarantee you that these companies have built bad debt into their business model and no one over there is losing any sleep over your debt to them!  They will see you as a victim and cash cow and they will be reluctant to discuss final offers, only ways to keep you paying with threats of court action or seizing your assets if you have any.
       
      They are not your friends and you owe them no loyalty or moral duty, that must remain only for yourself and your family.
       
      If it was me I would send them all a CCA request.   I would bet that not one will provide the correct response and you can quite legally stop paying them until such time as they do provide a response.   Even when they do you should check back here as they mostly send dodgy photo copies or generic rubbish that has no connection with your supposed debt.
       
      The money you are paying them should, as far as you are able, be put to a savings account for yourself and as a means of paying of one of these fleecers should they ever manage to get to to the point of a successful court judgement.  After six years they will not be able to start court action and that money will then become yours.
       
      They will of course pursue you for the funds and pass your file around various departments of their business and out to third parties.
       
      Your response is that you should treat it as a hobby.  I have numerous files of correspondence each faithfully organised showing the various letters from different DCA;s , solicitors etc with a mix of threats, inducements and offers.   It is like my stamp collection and I show it to anyone who is interested!
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Amex - Settlement Offer


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Hi

Firstly, I hope that the attached letter helps anyone who is in a similar position.

 

Background

I sent a CCA request to Allied Int'l (DCA) who were chasing the account in May 2K10. No reply but confirmed as received by Royal Mail. AND they cashed the postal order.!!

 

Follow up letter after 12 days and again after 30 days - No reply to either but Royal Mail confirmed as received.

Basically the account became unenforceable on July 15th 2K10 as they did not respond to any correspondence regarding the CCA.

 

Received a standard letter from Allied Int'l on 21st July threatening legal action so fired off a letter requesting info under Pre Action Practice Directions. Received a reply, suggesting that Allied wanted to settle amicably without recourse to the courts on 3rd August. I followed this up with the attached letter which was confirmed received by Royal Mail Tracking Service.

 

Today

Received a letter from Amex suggesting that they had been contacted by an outside debt collection agency - interesting that Amex have not confirmed that they instructed Allied Int'l.

 

Bottom line is that I have been offered a 21% reduction on my account to settle. IS THIS A TACTIC ?

 

1) Given that the account is clearly in dispute by the actions of Allied, the agreement is now unenforceable. ( I accept that the debt is still on the book but not recoverable by Amex)

 

Q - Is there a standard template letter that I should use to reply to their offer ?

 

Q - What should be my opening counter offer and final offer in % terms off of the account.

 

I have to say that without sight of any statements, I cannot assess how much interest and charges have been applied. They just won't send to me this information.

 

Again hope the letter helps and look forward to comments and suggestions

 

SLDAllied-AmEX .doc

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if anyone offers a 'discount'

i usually means one of two things:

 

1, there is no CCA or not one that is enforceable.

2. the unlawful charges or mis-sold PPI far outweight the outstanding balance.

 

pers i'd ignore them

 

no cca = no pay

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

 

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

 

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

 

 

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Hi Thanks for the heads up. I am a bit concerned that if I do not reply it could be deemed as refusing their offer and possibly opening the gate for Amex to have a crack at me again.

 

Clearly - there must not an enforceable agreement if they are offering any discount.

 

Should I send Amex a copy of the letter that I sent to Allied, stating my position in relation to actions of Allied and them placing the account into an unenforceable position. At some point I want to get rid of this default on my credit assessment. Is there a template letter in the library that I could use that sets the record in place from a legal position if Amex get heavy.

 

SLD

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give us the history of the debt please

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

 

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

 

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

 

 

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HI

The card was offered to me in late 2007 / early 2008 - not sure of the exact date. Application form was on line. Never any paperwork.

Had to stop paying the card off in mid 2009 due to work drying up. Offered £150 through a DCA. That DCA was changed by Amex to someone else. Excess charges were mounting up. Decided to request a CCA after finding this forum in April and new DCA contacting me regarding the account. Following a series of letters and requests - the DCA will not send me the info to see if the online form exists in hard copy. I think will no signature, it is not enforceable. I did read that the Act had been updated to reflect Internet forms ??

 

Hope that this helps

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well that confirms things then.

no cca = no pay

 

and pers i'd ignore everyone.

 

as for the unlawful charges, don't forget you can reclaim all those + int and their cash/purchase rate.

might that well lnockdown the balance?

 

the debt still exists, even IF the cca is un-en, just means they cannot go to court.

 

and what about poss missold PPI? too

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

 

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

 

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

 

 

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Hmm couple of key dates to do with this issue:

 

December 2004, After which online agreements come into force... that is.. they no longer need a paper copy of your signature.

April 2007, CCA2006 in force which rescinds s127(3) so even if the agreement (online or paper) doesnt contain prescribed terms its enforceable just by showing a signature.

 

The "signature" can be a tick in a box for an online form I'm afraid. If they dont seem in a hurry to take you to court then you could reason from this that there is some good reason why not, amex are not normally slow in coming forward to court.

 

S.

Are You as Anonymous on CAG as You Think You Are? *Link*

 

The CAG is a free help site,should you be offered help that requires payment,please report it to site team.

 

Deal with your debts:

STEP ONE - Dont Panic! | STEP TWO - Priority & Non Priority Debts | STEP THREE - Personal Budget Sheet | STEP FOUR - A SAFE bank Account | STEP FIVE - Dealing with Priority Debts | STEP SIX - Non-priority Debts | STEP SEVEN - Non-Priority Debt-Repayment Opt1 | STEP EIGHT - Non-Priority Debt-Repayment Opt2 | STEP NINE - Perils of Consolidation | STEP TEN - RE-Evaluate Frequently

 

***** SERIOUSLY IN DEBT, DONT KNOW WHAT TO DO, TRY NationalDebtLine's MoneySteps *****

 

 

IMPORTANT: Please take my advice in the spirit it is given and on the basis that I am expressing my opinion, These opinions are not endorsed by CAG in anyway and are offered informally without prejudice or warranty of any kind. These opinions are solely based upon the knowledge I've gained from this fantastic site and life in general. I have NO legal training.

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Hi

Could it be that the doc was not executed correctly. I received a letter today with a copy of the agreement purporting to bare my signature. The T&Cs state YOUR RIGHT TO CANCEL - Once you have signed this Agreement, you will have a short time in which to cancel it. The Creditor will send to you exact details of how and when you can do this - I have not received any copy information on this from Amex.

 

It also state - ADDITIONAL RIGHT TO CANCEL - Once this Agreement is made you will have the right to cancel it before whichever is the later of either (a) 14 days after you receive your card, or (b 14 after the day on which you receive a copy of the agreement signed by us) The Agreement that I have been sent only purportedly bares my signature. The "Official Use Only" box underneath my purported signature is empty. This is all framed in one box. However, this copy document is stamped - dated 17 Feb 2008 with; what looks like a signature underneath. It looks like a pre cut rubber stamp job.

 

Am I right in thinking that to execute this document correctly, both mine and the authorised Amex representative signature, must be within one framed box on the left hand side of the Agreement.

 

SLD

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Hi

Could it be that the doc was not executed correctly. I received a letter today with a copy of the agreement purporting to bare my signature. The T&Cs state YOUR RIGHT TO CANCEL - Once you have signed this Agreement, you will have a short time in which to cancel it. The Creditor will send to you exact details of how and when you can do this - I have not received any copy information on this from Amex.

 

Ok, I'm not good on the distance selling act and the mixing of this with the CCA but it sounds like they dropped a clanger... technically... I'm certain a judge would look to see how you were affected by them NOT sending these details.. and the answer will be not in the slightest as you obviously used the card.[i say this as you need to be aware that the judiciary appear to be clamping down on Technical complaints/cases]

 

Am I right in thinking that to execute this document correctly, both mine and the authorised Amex representative signature, must be within one framed box on the left hand side of the Agreement.

SLD

Fraid not, They can sign the document anywhere I believe...and a rubber stamp job is sufficient... in online applications they normally show two tickboxes, one for you to tick to show you have read terms/conditions and agree to the application and underneath a preticked one which goes with an authorised bankers name and the date. At least that was on my amex online application screen.

 

S.

Are You as Anonymous on CAG as You Think You Are? *Link*

 

The CAG is a free help site,should you be offered help that requires payment,please report it to site team.

 

Deal with your debts:

STEP ONE - Dont Panic! | STEP TWO - Priority & Non Priority Debts | STEP THREE - Personal Budget Sheet | STEP FOUR - A SAFE bank Account | STEP FIVE - Dealing with Priority Debts | STEP SIX - Non-priority Debts | STEP SEVEN - Non-Priority Debt-Repayment Opt1 | STEP EIGHT - Non-Priority Debt-Repayment Opt2 | STEP NINE - Perils of Consolidation | STEP TEN - RE-Evaluate Frequently

 

***** SERIOUSLY IN DEBT, DONT KNOW WHAT TO DO, TRY NationalDebtLine's MoneySteps *****

 

 

IMPORTANT: Please take my advice in the spirit it is given and on the basis that I am expressing my opinion, These opinions are not endorsed by CAG in anyway and are offered informally without prejudice or warranty of any kind. These opinions are solely based upon the knowledge I've gained from this fantastic site and life in general. I have NO legal training.

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