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Brother got this in the post last week. No1,he 's convinced

that there was no PCN on attached to his vehicle when he returned to it

although the pics do not comfirm this.

2. he's parked at that location many a times on a sunday and has had

no problems.

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NTO4.jpg

Ticketphotos-1edit.jpg

Ticketphotos-2.jpg

Ticketphotos-3edit.jpg

Ticketphotos-4edit.jpg

Ticketphotos-5.jpg

Ticketphotos-7.jpg

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bumpytee bump!

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The sign is non compliant it should seperate the paid for hours and free hours for coaches although it probably has some kind of approval but I'd check before paying.

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Its simple..

 

The top half of the sign shows coach parking fees in action for 8.30am-midnight and no parking for coaches midnight -8.am in the lower section.

 

the middle sections shows parking restrictions in action for the monday to friday and the saturday. at no point does the sign show no car parking.

 

on these grounds incorrect sinage should get you off the ticket.

 

if the appeal is refused but the council escillate it to the higher. as the sign can easily be misenterprated

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There does appear to be a PCN on the car. Speaking as an ex-coach driver, this is one of the few coach parking facilities in this area of London and is strictly enforced and has been so for many years. I would of thought that if the signage was wrong, it would have been picked up by now. As far as I know, cars have never been permitted to park there and there is an underground car park near by. I know what it's like to try and find somewhere to put a 12 metre long coach when cars are occupying the coach bays. Sorry, I think the PCN(s) is deserved.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

Please click my reputation button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.


Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

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There does appear to be a PCN on the car. Speaking as an ex-coach driver, this is one of the few coach parking facilities in this area of London and is strictly enforced and has been so for many years. I would of thought that if the signage was wrong, it would have been picked up by now. As far as I know, cars have never been permitted to park there and there is an underground car park near by. I know what it's like to try and find somewhere to put a 12 metre long coach when cars are occupying the coach bays. Sorry, I think the PCN(s) is deserved.

 

 

How can the PCN be 'deserved' if the restrictions do not appear to apply on a Sunday?

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How can the PCN be 'deserved' if the restrictions do not appear to apply on a Sunday?

 

Because they are coach parking bays. They are free on a Sunday to buses and coaches, not cars.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

Please click my reputation button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.


Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

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Because they are coach parking bays. They are free on a Sunday to buses and coaches, not cars.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

Please click my reputation button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

 

thats all well and said. but its not clearly marked as a COACH only bay on the signs

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Sorry, I think the PCN(s) is deserved.

 

I thought we were here on CAG to assist motorists who may have been victimised when information signs etc are either misleading or inaccurate?

 

Strange how the moment the "error" may have encrouched on an area you may wish to park in as opposed to the OP, you immediately claim it is "deserved".

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thats all well and said. but its not clearly marked as a COACH only bay on the signs

 

I can only repeat what I stated in my previous post (#5). I havn't been there for a few years now but it is certainly coach only parking and there must be signage to the effect. (as it shows in the last pic of the OPs post). Park Lane is really a hot spot and as far as I am aware there is no on street car parking permitted there. Also Park Lane is a red route (apart from the coach bays).

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

Please click my reputation button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.


Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

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I thought we were here on CAG to assist motorists who may have been victimised when information signs etc are either misleading or inaccurate?

 

Strange how the moment the "error" may have encrouched on an area you may wish to park in as opposed to the OP, you immediately claim it is "deserved".

 

So we can't assist coach drivers either? Park Lane does not have on street parking for cars at any time, it's as simple as that. Yes, the OP can appeal the ticket but I think he will be waisting his time. Unlike a car, You can't just park a coach just anywhere. If you have spent as long as I have trying to find a parking spot for a coach when cars are occupying coach bays, you may think differently!

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

Please click my reputation button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.


Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

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So we can't assist coach drivers either? Park Lane does not have on street parking for cars at any time, it's as simple as that.

 

But that doesn't appear to be clear on the signs. You only seem to know this because you have a specific need to know, yet because of that you have concluded the signage is clear in this case when many would disagree.

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But that doesn't appear to be clear on the signs. You only seem to know this because you have a specific need to know, yet because of that you have concluded the signage is clear in this case when many would disagree.

 

Crem, they are obviously coach parking bays and have been for many years. I would of thought that this has been tested before. There are clearly marked long bays on the road surface and there are signs on the posts stating 'buses and coaches only' although they have the appearence of 'pay and display' signs. Maybe the signs should be different and more obvious but don't forget we are talking about Park Lane in London. All I can say is for the OP to contest but I would be extremely surprised if he is successful. My opinion (for what it is worth) is that it is quite obvious that the bays are not intended for cars and as such, cars should not pasrk there.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

Please click my reputation button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.


Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

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I'm a resident and pay for a residents permit does that mean everyone that parks in a permit bay by mistake deserves a PCN?? The sign is non compliant, confusing and should have the legend 'buses' on the road.

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I'm a resident and pay for a residents permit does that mean everyone that parks in a permit bay by mistake deserves a PCN?? The sign is non compliant, confusing and should have the legend 'buses' on the road.

 

If they have no permit then yes. I have resident bays in the street outside my house and this frequently happens. As I said, I would find it strange that the signage issue has not been tested before but in any event, the OP may contest it (I believe I have said that before as well). Here is the location concerned.

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Park+Lane,+London&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=14.327693,46.362305&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Park+Ln,+London,+United+Kingdom&ll=51.510853,-0.157456&spn=0,0.045276&z=15&layer=c&cbll=51.510233,-0.15726&panoid=h8QHEC258ZU-HFTENwViXg&cbp=12,305.8,,0,-1.65 It is fairly common knowledge that there is no onstreet parking permitted for cars along Park Lane.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

Please click my reputation button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

Edited by sailor sam

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The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

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It is fairly common knowledge that there is no onstreet parking permitted for cars along Park Lane.

 

ahh! Well that makes it OK then. Sod having to bother putting signs up at all, never mind them having to be correct and clear, we'll just apply parking restrictions and issuee PCNs based on what we think is "common knowledge".

 

Now why I living in Sunderland, or millions of other people throughout the country would know what is "common knowledge" regarding parking restrictions in Park Lane London would be without the signage being clear and unambiguous at that location is beyond me!

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ahh! Well that makes it OK then. Sod having to bother putting signs up at all, never mind them having to be correct and clear, we'll just apply parking restrictions and issuee PCNs based on what we think is "common knowledge".

 

Now why I living in Sunderland, or millions of other people throughout the country would know what is "common knowledge" regarding parking restrictions in Park Lane London would be without the signage being clear and unambiguous at that location is beyond me!

 

For a start its a red route... except for the coach parking bays. If you read the signs on the posts it states 'bus and coach parking only' which gives it away a tad. You could also do some research on the relevant websites (TFL ect). As for the signage, well lets hope the OP appeals on those grounds so we can get a definative answer.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

Please click my reputation button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.


Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

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I would question the legality of ANY PCNs issued by Westminster Council in Park Lane! A Council is only permitted to issue PCNs in its SPA Special Parking Area the A4202 was removed from this area in 1994 as its now Red Route unless its been reinstated any PCN issed there is unlawful.

 

http://www.statutelaw.gov.uk/legResults.aspx?LegType=All+Legislation&PageNumber=2&NavFrom=3&activeTextDocId=3119584

  • Confused 1

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I would question the legality of ANY PCNs issued by Westminster Council in Park Lane! A Council is only permitted to issue PCNs in its SPA Special Parking Area the A4202 was removed from this area in 1994 as its now Red Route unless its been reinstated any PCN issed there is unlawful.

 

http://www.statutelaw.gov.uk/legResults.aspx?LegType=All+Legislation&PageNumber=2&NavFrom=3&activeTextDocId=3119584

 

Well i'm sure they must of issued a few over the years since then. You would of thought someone by now would of put a challange in. By the way, they do also ticket coaches (but only UK ones!)which haven't paid to park when required.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

Please click my reputation button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.


Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

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For a start its a red route... except for the coach parking bays.

 

Most Red Route is Mon-Sat so thats totally irelevant as are most of the sanctimonious comments you have posted on this thread.

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Well i'm sure they must of issued a few over the years since then. You would of thought someone by now would of put a challange in.

 

Not everyone has the benefit of my extensive knowledge!! lol

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Not everyone has the benefit of my extensive knowledge!! lol

 

You ought to have a weekend down there and offer your advice for a fee! You would make a mint. Seriously though, speaking as an ex-coach driver, some form of restriction needs to be maintained there as there simply aren't many other places to park a coach in that area.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

Please click my reputation button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.


Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

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Most Red Route is Mon-Sat so thats totally irelevant as are most of the sanctimonious comments you have posted on this thread.

 

Only just read this one... we arn't talking about 'most red routes', we are talking central London. Fine, if you think my comments are irelevant then advise the OP to appeal. This is a real hot spot so may be it needs a case to clarify it.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

Please click my reputation button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.


Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

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lots of assumptions in this thread

 

good facts from G&M

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lots of assumptions in this thread

 

good facts from G&M

 

Dunno how you can come to that conclusion... the OP hasn't won his appeal yet.

 

Please Note

 

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

I would always urge to seek professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

Please click my reputation button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.


Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

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