"Ouch"

[bobbielee]

Hello,

 

The hounds of hell are closing in on me!

 

There might be a chink of light for me on the horizion. I have been arguing with a debt chaser for about a year and this has been passed to the chaser's solicitor. If I tell this solicitor it is black, he will respond by saying its white. If I agree it is white, he then tells me it is black - and he has me running in circles.

 

1: a 4 year old personal loan,

2: £126.67 monthly instalment over 48 months

3: £19.51 PPI monthly instalment

 

The PPI was to be paid in arrears.

 

Five months into the contract and I was diagnosed with the big "C" which was followed by a heart attack.

 

I had a lot on my plate and I moved to my Daughter's. I informed the original lender and assumed that the PPI would boot in. It did not.

 

The arrears mounted. I receieved the mandatory Default Notice with arrears of £1535.08. The issue is, contained in the arrears are the PPI instalments.

 

 

Please advise.

 

Bobbie

[fuzzybobble]

Can you post up the Default Noice after removing personal info? Leave the dates intact on it though. Also have you sent them a CCA request to see if it's enforceable? Also if the PPI didn't pay out, then go after them for miss-selling it.

[the_shadow]

Hi Bobbie, you say you assumed the PPI would kick in but it didnt... did you actually make a claim and was it turned down with a reason?

 

S.

[bobbielee]

Hi the_shadow,

 

I was very poorly! My Daughter wrote to the original lender and explained the position about my health and work. She assumed the PPI would kick in.

 

Bobbiee

[bobbielee]

Hello,

 

Can the arrears on a Default Notice contain instalments for a PPI?

 

 

Bobbie

[robinredbreast]

Hi ...

 

Agree with Fuzzy .. you need firstly to request or post up a copy (minus personals) of your loan agreement, and default notice.

 

So in the first place it can be established whether they have a correctly executed credit agreement, and then if the default notice is legally compliant.

 

When you took the loan, how was the PPI sold ..

 

• Did you ask for PPI ?
  
• Were you told, or led to believe, it was mandatory to the acceptance of the loan ?
  
• Did the terms of the PPI policy suit your needs and requirements ?
  
• Were the premiums affordable ?
  
• Was the PPI charge added as a lump sum up front ... or charged monthly ?
  
• Did you have any issues health or work wise, which you told the loan company about, which would have prohibited you from enjoying any benefit offered under the PPI policy ?
  

Notwithstanding the aspects relating to the execution of the agreement and Default Notice, if the PPI element was mis-sold you have a claim for all premiums & interest to be refunded - if they refuse off to FOS you go.

 

But, in the first place get scanning ... and you;ll get more specific advice and help from all ..

 

Robin x:)

[bobbielee]

Hi Robin,

 

1: It was mandatory

2: Yes, it suited my circumstance

3: Premiums were affordable

4: £126.67 monthly for the loan, and £19.51 for the PPI

5: I had angina, and I informed the loan company, the big "C" came out of the blue.

 

I am sure the Default Notice arrears should not have included the payments for the PPI - do you agree?

 

 

 

 

Bobbie

[the_shadow]

Normally as soon as they put you in default they stop the PPI and say its null and void, however if your daughter contacted them and advised them of your situation they should have instigated a claim or at the very least sent the claim forms to you.

 

I do think its worth pursing why the PPI failed to get actioned as this would be paying your debt for you now and you would be in a non-default situation for at least 12 months after claiming, some policies even pay off the debt completely.

 

If it was me I'd send off a subject access request to the original lender ASAP, this costs £10 and should show you the letter your daughter sent to them and all other correspondence. Unfortunately this takes 40days so you may want to pre-empt this by asking the solicitor why there client failed to initiate the PPI when they were advised you had a terminal-class illness as this would at the very least mean payments would have been met for the previous 12 months.

 

S.

[bobbielee]

Hi Shadow,

My Daughter told me she had written to the original lender! In the Subject Access Request there is no evidence that my Daughter wrote to them.

They Defaulted me during May of last year and stopped the PPI last October. The DN stated that if I did not remedy the wanted full payment. The arrears quoted in the DN contained 15 months @ £19.51 =£292.65 which obviously made the DN invalid. Am I correct?

 

Bobbie

[the_shadow]

arrghh just typed in a load of stuff and it disappeared

 

... did the subject request just come back as statements or did they send other documents with it?

 

If they have no copy of the letter and you have no proof of posting i think its going to be difficult to claim they should have repaid the debt from the PPI. It all hinges on your daughters letter imo.

 

If you cant prove this then Fuzzys suggestion of a s77 request from the original creditor would seem the way forward for the moment.

 

S.

[bobbielee]

the_shadow

 

Evey document sent was reconstructed, created and air-brushed. My Daughter's letter was not present.

 

I have been hitting them on a continual basis, and three weeks ago, I was offered a truce by the chasing solicitor if I ceased my pursuit.

 

You might think that this is strange behaviour and that I ought to grab their offer and run! I have sent them a letter and told them to stuff the truce right up their 'arris, and that I am coming to get you!

 

Shadow, I could relate to you some issues this debt chaser has got up to, and it would make your hair curl. The chasing solicitor knows it, and has told me that he will not communicate any more.

 

If I can prove that the Default Notice's arrears should not contain PPI instalments I would de delighted.

 

Bobbie

[unclebulgaria67]

 

I don't know what your circumstance are financially in regard to engaging a solicitor to act for you. But it might be worth you enquiring with Community Legal services, if you live in England or Wales. In Scotland there are other community legal groups.

 

http://www.communitylegaladvice.org.uk/

[robinredbreast]

In my opinion the amount of arrears to remedy the default should be in respect of the loan only as that is the sum of monies regulated by the CCA74.. the PPI is a seperate stand alone insurance policy- the arrears of which IMHO should have been dealt with seperately.

 

Mandatory PPIs from what I know are not allowed ... you can not be forced to take one out .. is there proof in the docs that says the loan will only be granted if you also take PPI ?

 

That being said, if the amount reqd for remedy is incorrect in the DN yes you have a defective DN ... which means that legally they can only claim the genuine arrears at the time of default.

 

But what I find odd is that if you had PPI, and after your Daughter wrote to them telling them you were ill, that when the policy cover wasn't initiated i.e payment of your loan was taken over by the PPI policy, it wasn't chased up ... even when you recd a default or arrears letters chasing ...

 

Leaving the DN to one side ... what about the CCA .. you say its reconstructed .. have they admitted they don;t hold a copy of (or indeed the actual) original agreement then ?

 

You really need to post up what you have recd, as its difficult for peeps on cag to give correct advice if they haven't been able to review all the info....... having said all this .. are you taking them to court or the other way round ?

[bobbielee]

Hello Uncleblgaria,

 

Today, I received a letter of confirmation from Community Legal Sevices cnfirming that my income is too high; and I cannot afford a solicitor. I have been provided a free 30 minutes with a solicitor who states, "you will win hands down, but I cannot assist you further."

 

My problem is that I am too ill to conduct my own case and present it in Court.

 

 

Bobbie

[bobbielee]

Robin,

 

I only purchased a printer on Wednesday! I am climbing the learning curve of the mysteries of the printer, scanning et al. I take your point about posting the agreement up - I will do that as soon as I can.

 

When my Daughter contacted the original lender, I was extremely ill and our attention was not with debts.

 

My opponents are refusing to talk to me. After a year of continual attacking they are now in a position where they cannot do anything in terms of enforcement. Hence their offer of a truce.

 

 

Bobbie

[bobbielee]

Robinredbreast

 

Can you provide a citation for this..?

"In my opinion the amount of arrears to remedy the default should be in respect of the loan only as that is the sum of monies regulated by the CCA74.. the PPI is a seperate stand alone insurance policy- the arrears of which IMHO should have been dealt with seperately."

 

Thanks

 

Bobbie

[unclebulgaria67]

Hello Uncleblgaria,

 

Today, I received a letter of confirmation from Community Legal Sevices cnfirming that my income is too high; and I cannot afford a solicitor. I have been provided a free 30 minutes with a solicitor who states, "you will win hands down, but I cannot assist you further."

 

My problem is that I am too ill to conduct my own case and present it in Court.

 

What about checking to see if a local no win no fee company will take this on or look for someone to take this on as a pro bono case. There are many solicitors around the country who will take on cases, without their fee meeting running from the start. If they win, then they would get their fees from the other side.

 

http://www.barprobono.org.uk/

 

It is worth looking into and making a few phone calls.

 

Even local MP's have been known to put their constituents in touch with pro bono solicitors, as there are loads of people that can't get legal aid but need representation.;

[bobbielee]

Unclebulgaria67

 

Thank you so much. Some months ago, I did write to Pro Bono in London; I received all the paperwork and the had a relapse and ended up in hospital. I will try again.

 

You have also given me food for thought about my MP - he is non other than Kenneth Clarke.

 

Thanks again, Uncle...

 

 

Bobbie

[bobbielee]

Hello,

 

Robinredbreast has stated the following for my consideration:

 

"In my opinion the amount of arrears to remedy the default should be in respect of the loan only as that is the sum of monies regulated by the CCA74.. the PPI is a seperate stand alone insurance policy- the arrears of which IMHO should have been dealt with seperately."

 

If this is so, and I am hoping it is, I will be able to pitch into some very nasty opposition.

 

Thank you,

 

Bobbie

[bobbielee]

Hello,

 

Could anyone provide an answer to Post 19, please?

 

Bobbie

[robinredbreast]

Hi there ...

 

I don't have a citation for my thoughts as they are just that my own thoughts .. it is just my opinion I;m afraid .. but if it were me this is a point I would argue in my correspondence ..... Payment Protection Insurance premiums are to pay a monthly insurance policy,

 

What does the actual policy document for the PPI policy say regarding arrears and coverage ... i.e was your particular condition covered by the policy (as sometimes it depends on the type of C you have, there are some exclusions like non-invasion melanoma which as non-life threatening are excluded from ASU, Criticall Illness, PPI policies ..)

 

You've said that you have approached legal bods, who have stated that you have a case .. and have also said that the other side can;t do anything in respect of enforcement ... so I'm a bit at a loss what you're looking to achieve if they aren't pursuing you for the os monies ....

 

Do you want them to retrospectively honor the PPI policy, which (depending on the terms of the policy) will pay the ongoing premiums, or repay the balance in full and then have the default removed ?

 

Have you complained in writing to the company involved ... have they issued you a final response... if so why not refer it to FOS .... they are dealing with hoards of PPI complaints and although rubbish at CCA stuff, from what I can gather your complaint is not CCA related, but an insurance related issued regarding the company's negligence in not implementing repayment of your loan from your PPI policy when advised of your illness ....

 

Your ill health will go someway to explain why you didn't bring this situation up at the time it occured ... as FOS wil probably ask why you have delayed in raising this, so be sure to include this in any complaint you make to them ..

 

Hope this is food for thought .....

[robinredbreast]

PS ... when I say delayed raising this .. I mean didn't raise this problem at the time with the loan company, from which you would have been able to provide another copy of what ever docs they needed to process the claim under your PPI

 

Robin

[the_shadow]

Perhaps it would be benificial if you told us exactly what you are aiming to achieve here? We all assumed (well I did) from the first post that the OC was chasing you for payment via their solicitor.. it now transpires they are not and even their solicitor will not converse with you.

 

S.

[robinredbreast]

Exactly Shadow ... I'm a bit confused with what the OP is after advice on ....

 

The issues over not chasing implementation of the PPI policy at the time of claim, by either the OP or Daughter is a bit odd to me .. but never the less ....

 

if PPI was a condition of the loan, and the OP or the docs received prove such, then the agreement is wholly unenforceable due to unfair relationship

 

The agreement docs (which appears the OP has a reconstitued version of from a SAR) should note the total charge for PPI over the period, but this must be excluded for the Total Amount of Credit stated, but included in the Total Charge for Credit ... so notwithstanding the compulsory aspect of the case which deems the agreement unenforceable, if the charge for PPI is contained in the Total Amt Of Credit, this is wrong (even if its also in the TCC), and is another issue to look at as a defence/claim - whichever side he's on .

 

Now we know that the OP has already been told by the OC that the agreement is unenforceable .. so he isn't making payments, nor legally bound to do so, and they aren't going to initiate court proceedings for payment ... and if his recollections of the "sale" of the PPI are correct, then in any event, the agreement wouldl be cited as unenforceable by any presiding Judge ...

 

So ... based on the above ... should the OP be wanted to take this to Court .. any fee free Solicitor would accept this, if what has been discussed regarding the PPI mandatory sale is accurate ... also if the figs in the agreement don't accurately reflect the amount of credit, and total charge for credit .. its another no brainer for a fee free Sol.

 

Other than this not sure what other advice can be given ..

[bobbielee]

Hi Shadow,

 

I do believe you are gravitating toward my particular mindset.

 

The original lender obtained their Judgment by default. I didn't even know that a hearing was upcoming. I had never been in debt at and the effect of a CCJ was devastating.

 

After obtaining the Subject Access Request I was horrified at what I found. Six months ago, I had a telephone conversation with one of their "goons". The upshot: I went to their Office, found the "goon" and the Police were called.

 

Shadow, I am a very ill man, but these "animals" have given me a purpose. For a year, I have racked up their costs, and as they are in dispute they canot do a thing to me, so I am taking bits an pieces out of them.

 

Three week ago, I received a letter suggesting a "truce!" I have, so far, identifed 26 specifications against these cretins. Three involve theft. I have told them, "I am not going away."

 

Soon, I will begin the Court process in a very slow peicemeal fashion. The Solicitor has realised the situation, and has closed the door on me.

 

Does this make sense? Yes, it is a vendetta.

 

 

Bobbie