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    • Amex as with any creditor must help you the FOS should go with you and make them remove all interest charged from the very 1st time of asking for help. the FCA regulations actually almost dictate it, they most certainly clearly state that if the are FCA registered they must help.   it's very telling they have no marked your credit file....almost as if they know they are wrong. it's also telling that an irresponsible lending complaint might well be in order hear too, they can just keep upping the credit limit without checking you can pay. and ofcourse covid plays its part here and they've already admitted as they allowed payments holidays until october in line with the rest of the industry and they should be continuing that. you problem is you keep using the phone, no paperwork no record of things discussed. i'd get an SAR off to them. and get the comms/account log and all the statements from day one and go nail them.
    • Hello CAG, Bit of a long post, may want to get a cuppa before starting reading... 😁   after being a lurker for many years and trying never to get into a mess with credit cards like i did 20 years ago, i've got myself into a mess with Amex... I've tried being open and honest with them, but now getting the feeling they are messing me around.    Its not a chargecard, but a Nectar Credit Card with them. TAKEN out 2016. Balance is just under £15k as of today, was almost at £17k.  Debt still owed by Amex, not been sent to NCO/Arrow etc - YET...    Background (short version): Was all fine with more than min. payment (£500 or so), being made until April 2020 when a number of things reduced my monthly salary from work (mainly, take a pay cut or be made redundant), so I soon quickly realised i needed to tighten my belt quickly. Phoned Amex, advisor said nothing they could do except Payment Holiday. Was put onto that for 3 months, told that Amex will be in touch at the end to restart payments. I asked about interest being stopped/frozen/reduced - not possible. So agreed to payment holiday to give me breathing space. 3 months came and went, no contact from Amex... No payments made, interest still racking up at around £300 a month...    Rang Amex back (July 2020), we cant do anything today because your in the middle of the statement cycle call back next week. Called back week after, no solution yet (i asked about things i seen on Amex US website = Regain program - basically freeze card, lower interest rate and pay a set amount for 12 months - more about this later) > Not available in UK yet.   Want to stay on payment holiday Mister B? I asked if there was any way interest could be stopped as this is making the balance increase and increase. No. Do you want to stay on Payment Holiday? Ok. (Bear in mind, if i came off Payment holiday. Minimum Payment was around £570 per month.  So, stayed on payment holiday... Didnt hear anything from Amex again. Called back up in September 2020. Please call back in October after 10th and we can assist.   Called back after October 10, went through loads of stuff, different options etc, was warned that Payment Holiday might not be extended much longer, but now have a program. Worked out with Amex woman that i could pay around £200 per month. But please stop interest - no we cant but we can reduce this down to 9.9APR instead of 23%... . Amex woman said she needed to submit details to 'Seniors' at Amex, please call back next week for update.   Called back week after, advised that first Amex woman was wrong and had made mistakes, shouldn't have told me what she had told me, £200 is too low, minimum would be £389 per month for 12 months or account will default. Told Amex woman 2 that couldn't afford it, went through this last time, etc etc. Amex woman 2 went off, came back, £329.74 is minimum they can possibly accept, 12 months at that amount per month and interest would be lowered, but not stopped. If you dont take out this 'Program' then account will default and will be passed to NCO or Arrow (I hate them both).  Went off, tried to get loans etc, all refused. Rang Amex back, reluctantly agreed so i can keep credit rating at 'good'.  So, been paying since Nov 2021 @ £329.74.    Letter arrived in December - due to out mess up with moving accounts around whilst on payment holiday, we are going to give you £3074 back. Logged into account, only £30.74 refunded, not £3074. Phoned Amex cos thought it was a joke/mistake - Spoke to some bloke - Oh dont worry, the rest will be applied to account automatically in 7 days. he advised was genuine but then got cut off during call. Called back, spoke to some other bloke, yes, looks genuine but please hold... Came back 10 minutes later. Oh, its a mis-print, you are not the only customer to receive one of these. Each should have been £30.74 not £3074. Me = Gutted.    Wrote a letter to Amex saying how dissatisfied i was with general customer service and felt they were incompetent, blah blah etc. Final response received, Complaint partially upheld, heres £150 credit because we were a bit silly, but thats it. IF your still not happy, go to FOS. Opened a case with FOS... Have sent them the complaint letter to them and have had a call from them about this... FOS are backlogged though and will take another 3 months for complaint to be looked at by them.   Let me make this 100% clear, fully admit to owning the debt, yep, ive spent this money (wish I knew what on, cos having got much to show from it - just general stuff and holidays)... Not trying to shirk out of it, trying my best to keep up with re-payments but im really struggling. After I got paid on 1st April, after paying all outgoings i had £9.83 left in current account so am having to go into overdraft each month which is just a vicious circle.  I would really like to NOT have to down the default route and trash my credit rating and then have to deal with the morons at NCO / Arrow etc.    Meanwhile, this is where I need the advice of the CAG experts... - Credit Limit increases... These were coming every few months and it was just being upped and upped and upped. Credit limit eventually was stopped at £15,400. Some of the increases I never even received letter for, just noticed when I logged into account. >>>> Would this be a case for irresponsible lending?   - Stopping interest - I've read something on FCA site that they recommend (not policy) that if a customer is put onto a payment holiday then they recommend freezing interest for customer so the debt doesn't continue to build. I've asked time and time again, Amex just refuse.  >>>> Any tips on how to get Amex to play ball?    - Full & Final/Short settlement I've rung Amex today, told them I might be able to pay it off. Initially they said full balance, i then pushed, they then said they would accept 80% of balance, pushed them a bit more, got it down to 70%. >>> Surprised, and then very surprised they would accept 70%, anyone else think this is a bit odd? Normally they wont budge, or they wont budge from their first offer... Could their be something wrong on account (missing CCA etc?), or do they want rid of me and account as much as I do with them?   - Cant really keep going at these £329.74 repayments. Something is going to have to give somewhere. I believe they wont go any lower and they will just default it i send £100 instead of £329 and send it out to NCO/Arrow. This might not be a too bad thing though because this would stop the interest right? Anyone thoughts on this?    Anyone think of anything else I could try with them? Again, its still with Amex, not defaulted or anything yet, yep, its all my own fault, i've spent the money, dont deny that, just feel Amex have took advantage etc.   Many thanks for reading. Any advice is greatly appreciated.   Kr, Mista B.     
    • Ok so we have complained to HMRC but were still no further forward with getting the P45/P60. We need this as DVLA has said they need more proof of who he is before giving him a provisional license.  What more can l do. 
    • Hi All   just looking for some advice. I bought a used Porsche Boxster from one of Marshall motor group’s Audi dealers (can I name them?) recently and was assured that it received a major service in October 2020 in line with the manufacturers requirements. The service book confirms this. The dealer also told me on the phone that they have a 6 month rule with any mot or service being done if due within this period which assured me when making an offer over the phone on the car that it wouldn’t need anything doing for a while as I recall saying that.   However, digging through the receipts post delivery I saw that the service was in fact minor and after calling the specialist who serviced it in Oct both they (Sheepishly) and the invoice confirmed that the car did not receive new spark plugs, an air filter, brake fluid replacement or a new fan belt which have now all fallen due and hence the major service due warning light. Had I not investigated this then the car would have potentially gone another 4 years, so 8 in total without some of these items being done.   i emailed the salesman to ask what they would propose to do. The matter is complicated by my living 450 miles away in Scotland, and 200 from their nearest branch, a Mercedes dealer in the Lake District, so I suggested getting my cheapest local specialist to do the works that have fallen due, however I have received no response.   Whilst I am still within my 30 days i don’t want to reject the car, which is otherwise perfect, but the fact remains that the Audi 150 point check only asks for upcoming mot’s to be checked and not services and surely you wouldn’t buy an approved used car and expect to have the service light come on 2 weeks later and have to spend almost £500 putting it right.   i would really appreciate some advice on next steps and perhaps who to escalate this to. Meantime the car is booked in for 2 weeks time to get the work done at the cheapest reputable place I could find.   Many, many thanks in advance
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RBS Interest rate swaps- cap/collar

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Hi Aggi / all,


I am both a commercial business which I know is against the rules, and at the same time I am an individual trying to help in this overall situation. I don't / won't sell my business on here - but this sort of forum is important for everyone to understand and communicate what they are seeing and how they are going about this matter. I trust this will be taken as it should be. In fact much of what I do is look at whether people have a case (from a regulatory / FSA angle) and actively do reject cases that are not "mis-selling."


Aggi - were you put under any confidentiality clauses in the settlement through the FOS? There was a case last July that hit the Internet but was retracted after a confidentiality clause - part of the acceptance of more than the £150k that the FOS can legally bind.





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Hi All

Not sure if anyone can help me I have a swap have been arguing for some time now im just before issuing in the courts I think as I am outside FOS compensation limits

I do not bank with Barclays just borrow and I am in a tight fix I may miss this next quarters payments for the swap I will make sure my loan is paid direct to the account as what they do is take the swap then normally threaten to take the loan out of terms

Has anyone missed a rate swap payment and can they tell me what the consequences were or might be

I see James Ducker is in this forum would be very pleased to know your thoughts as well

Certain you have all seen it but Telegraph are doing a great job and nice to see that the Treasury may look into it sad that Vince cable didn’t do his job properly

Hope someone can advise

Many thanks fellow victims

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You should really try to find some way to talk to this individual as she seems to have interesting info that’s not been gagged

I have one of the top three companies in google search working on my case and it is slow

I think I will not be able to make this quarters payment any ideas what Bar Cap will do?? Its in my personal name

Be good if you can help

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Hi AnonBarcap,


I'll be at my desk for a while yet finishing some work if you would like to call. Happy to talk over with you.

I've had a really useful chat with Aggi as well - thank you Aggi!

I'll be arranging a gathering for everyone in this situation shortly so we can share thoughts and experiences. I don't want there to be a hard-sell or fear of turning up so any and all ideas / comments / thoughts welcome.


In terms of missing a payment, I'm not a solicitor, but in my opinion the bank should have the loan and hedge tied up either through an ISDA, a TMA (Treasury Master Agreement) or a long form confirmation. At worst they have "implied ISDA" (ie. never got one signed but assume it to be agreed. What these documents in effect do, is tie together the loan and the hedge for breaches and for security - so if you miss a hedge payment they can call a breach on the deal, and "call-in" the security (usually property). This would of course more than likely put the loan in breach etc. etc.


I have outlined the hard and fast rules, and in reality the bank may well act differently, but if you can avoid breaches at the moment I would suggest doing so. Each situation is different and each breach different, indeed the security may not be there or may be worth less than the loan - a perverse extra problem for the bank to consider. Due to each case being unique it's difficult to talk generally, but I hope that helps in some way. As these are legal documents I'd also ask for a review from a solicitor with regards to the ISDA etc.


Can I ask which firm you are using from the "Google search" - I wrote recently in a blog that there are sharks already in these waters and some are using Google Adwords quite extensively. I wouldn't publish which firms I believe these to be openly, but happy to talk honestly and openly about any and all firms that I know.



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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi we believe that we too were mis-sold our cap & collar and were not told at the time that it was a 'condition' of the mortgage that we took it out. we have sought council on this matter which cost us quite a lot but we were told back in 2009 that the contract was valid. we have had a couple of law firms ask us if they could act on our behalf to take legal action agianst the HSBC banks but we are just a small company employing 3 staff and cant afford the court fees. It has made my husband very ill with all the worry and we have paid out in fees about £40.000 so far. We thought we were being protected by the banks but we feel we have been 'sold down the river' If anyone out there has any news that could help us fight this case in the courts I'd love to hear from you

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi Aggi,


Did you have a cap and collar or a dirivitive rate swap ?


A solicitor who contacted me said that most of the recent cases in the telegraph related to the Dirivatives rather than the cap & collar that we took out.





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Hi All,


I was told to take a rate swap in 2007. I was told by RBS that it was in my best interest!!. They told me that interest rates never come down and will be going up. I never asked for a loan swap. I wanted a normal repayment loan but that was not possible without me signing the swap papers. They faxed over to me the paperwork I had to sign so they could release the monies.

Each month I am paying over £4000 back to the swap. I called the number on the swap papers last week and asked them for statements to see what I have paid upto date, but the guy on the phone was rude and said you are ringing the wrong department and this is risk management (Nigerian accent). When I said your number is on the statements and take my reference number he said ring me when interest rates go up!!!!. Then we can talk business.

Half the numbers on the paperwork I received from RBS do not work anymore.


Another thing you have to remember is that when you have a business and someone offers you money you would do basically anything for them until you repay them back. These are the laws of nature and every hard business person knows this. We are all afraid that to go to our banks and complain, this could jeopardise our relationship with them. Everyone is afraid that they could ask for the loan back. The banks KNOW this and have everyone over a barrel. I was even advised by the bank to use a different solicitors to the one I have been using for the past 10 - 15 years to do the deal. They recommended one in their own area a firm that I never knew existed. This was another condition of the loan.


What happens now is in the hands of the FSA. Who pays the FSA?.......

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  • 2 weeks later...

There is a meeting of MPs in Committee Room 14 on Tuesday 24th April.


Please contact your MP as soon as possible so that he/she attends what will amount to a seminar educating them in the area of Swaps.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Have you all signed up with Bully Banks ? If not email them. I cannot give the address as I do not have enough posts to my name. They instigated a meeting of over 35 MPs in Parliament on 24th April. Sign up with them and they will keep you informed and advise on action to take. It might help

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Anyone who has a potential legal claim against the bank has only 6 years in which to lodge the claim so they should seek out a decent law firm which offers true no-win no-fee service, all too often they charge hefty fees.


There are major problems for those who have been bankrupted as a direct result of unsuitable advice.

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This one used to work at the FSA in enforcement and then at SRB Legal but has moved on to a much more substantial firm which happens to be one I have used for many years and can vouch for their track record.

Give her a call.


For the record I do not benefit from referrals as the practice of payment for such referrals was banned last year.

Clare Harries


Clarke Willmott LLP

1 Georges Square

Bath Street Bristol BS1 6BA

tel: 0845 209 1346

fax: 0845 209 2519

international tel: +44 117 305 6346

international fax: +44 117 917 5594

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  • 4 weeks later...

I have just sent this to a lawyer on the Bully Banks site,

I had an IRSA product covering £2.43m of debt, which indeed has now been wound-up as a result of a complaint to the Ombudsman. The product was with RBS, cap at 6.2% collar at 3.75%, this was ‘linked’ to a loan at 1.225% over base. The terms of this variant were such that when rates fell to below 3.75% the full 6.2% was charged. My point here is that RBS/Nat West did not then lower the payment due on the loan itself, so we were still being charged at the agreed amount in the original mortgage deed-when interest rates were higher. In theory this should have reduced the term of the loan, however as they never sent statements it is difficult to tell. So your clients are probably facing a double charge, certainly I did ask RBS to reduce the pay rate on the loan and they refused, I asked them for a refund of the extra capital we had repaid, they refused. You can easily check what they should be paying, (a least a good ball park figure) on a capital repayment loan at the Council of mortgage lenders web site


If indeed they are doing this, and I suspect RBS is, then the whole reason for selling the product in the first place is a sham.


Apologies if you are already on top of this, but it’s not something I have seen in the press about these products and I know RBS were adamant that the loan pay rate would not be reduced!.

Edited by Aggi
Didnt mean to include my name
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What's Best for You?



The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.


Alliance & Leicester Moneyclaim issued 20/1/07 £225.50 full settlement received 29 January 2007

Smile £1,075.50 + interest Email request for payment 24/5/06 received £1,000.50 14/7/06 + £20 30/7/06

Yorkshire Bank Moneyclaim issued 21/6/06 £4,489.39 full settlement received 26 January 2007



Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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  • 8 months later...

Hi Ive just registered as I was looking for a forum such as this, My brother who owns a care home in Surrey has a swaps product and Barclays has put his business into Administration, taken £160000 from his account, I have been trying to get more info and any group of businesses looking to take out a class action against the banks. As has been said a group action would have more clout and cost less.

We are aware of the current action against Barclays by Gardian Homes

Any help or guidance would be of great help

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Hi Kibsey,


You have to join Bully Banks, over 1,000 of us are now involved. Just google them, they are amazing. They have, with the help of Harry Wilson from the Telegraph, been responsible for the FSA paper published today. The findings were that over 90% of the products were mis-sold.

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We were old a interest rate swap in 2007 and still paying this today.


Everything was arranged by our business manager who had previously arranged other borrowing (no previous swaps). We are a small restaurant and bought our property which we were previously renting.


We have complained to the bank only are now going to review accounts as per FSA announcement but cannot provide timescales.


We are looking to start court proceedings we are sure of our case(mainly due to our history with our banking manager) and want to go it alone. I know we have to send in a LBA and then issue court papers but wouldn't know where to start with the particulars of claim.


Any help would be appreciated




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The legal system is a minefield even for supposedly competent lawyers. Do you have legal expenses insurance? I always insisted clients added it to their policy.


You have to make a commercial decision, personally I would allow the bank to do what the regulator has told it to but make sure you have a second opinion on the suitability of the product and of course the level of redress if it is forthcoming.


AND, watch what you say on the telephone or in writing. Cunning they be.

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