Hfc Refuse To Hand Over Documents Obviscating As Usual

[patrickq1]

sent CCA last month 7 july

HFC sent back a form to fill in this form and the wording on it is spurious to say the least ,they are oviscationg as usual, so i sent a reminder 1 aug , now i await their response i also had to remind the just what obvicating means sent them two e mails to explain obvuscating ,

now i for one will not fill in that form and a warning to anyone who does , each question has a double meaning ,so do not fill in the form,i have lived here at my home for almost 30 years we sent a signature that is tottaly different from my own ,i hope they use it lol

now the reason i want my information is because i took out a loan in 2001 and paid it of in 2005 i paid the loan off with a second loan ,now the first loan had almost 5 years PPI, and i was refused PPI on the second loan due to illness , so ive been wondering about and decided now its time to take to task another problem seeing as all my defaults from HFO have been removed under instructions of the FOS,and i am debt free cept to sat a little left on my HFC Loan,so i aint got any worries financially ,so my 1st letter was nice to HFC ,and they do not know what i am asking for but they prob suspect its the PPI,

so whats best way going forward

patrickq1

[Somebody Told Me]

Send them a SAR request via recorded delivery asking for all the records they hold on you and include a £10 cheque to cover any admin costs.

 

My parents had a poor experience with these guys years ago which only got resolved due to my dad keeping every single bit of paperwork which really pleased them

[dx100uk]

hfc are the pits when it comes to ppi and customer service

 

they will pull any stunt to delay the issue.

 

do you have the agreements?

 

with those you will be home free and they will cough

the FOS are getting VERY tired of HFC and their tactics

see my threads for more

 

get that SAR off and include the line and all agreements i have held with you org.

 

the questionaire is part of the FOS process but HFC like everything they do, has produced one to have the maximum frustration rating with customers in the hope they will give up.

 

dx

[patrickq1]

already SAR on july the 7th not cca as i put on the earlier thread...so they have a couple of weeks yet, anyway i wont be filling in the form as the questions are not on,unanswerable some of them...so i wait the results from the sar, yes i have the origional contracts, the second contract their copy i have written on it not to disclose my information to any third party lol..so lets see what happens huh, because they will have noticed this by now, i am not strugling to pay them nor in any debt all i asked them for was the list of repayments made on the first contract and i can simply work out the PPI as it states 16% to each payment of PPI.. patrickq1

[patrickq1]

HAMILTON DIRECT T&Cs

Terms and Conditions

 

1. You authorise us to contact you by letter, telephone (including automatic calling

unit,), recorded message or otherwise regarding the operation of your account.

2. You request us, if we are willing to do so, to issue you with such credit tokens as

we may from time to time make available for the obtaining of services.

3. You agree:

(a) to pay to us the Total Amount Payable shown in the Schedule by the Monthly

Repayments shown in the Schedule on the Monthly Repayment Dates referred to

in the Schedule;

(b) that should any Monthly Repayment or part thereof or any other sum due

under this Agreement remain unpaid after the date when it is due for payment,

then any such outstanding amount shall bear interest from its due date at the same

APR as charged on the Amount of Credit as specified in the Schedule, calculated

from day to day and debited to your account on each Monthly Repayment Date

and running after as well as before any judgment we may obtain against you.

4. If any of the following events occur:

(a) you fail to pay any Monthly Repayment or part thereof for more than 14 days

after it has become due;

(b) a statutory demand remains unsatisfied by you in whole or in part for more

than 21 days or any composition, agreement or arrangement is entered into by

you with your creditors or a bankruptcy order is made or execution or distress is

levied against your property;

© you breach any of the terms and conditions of this Agreement;

then we may (subject to service of any notice required by the Consumer Credit Act 1974) require you to pay immediately the Total Amount Payable shown in the Schedule together with any other sums due from you under this Agreement, less the amount of the Monthly Repayments and any other repayments which you have made and less any rebate of interest to which you may be entitled under the Consumer Credit (Rebate on Early Settlement) Regulations 1983.

5. You may immediately at any time settle this Agreement by the payment of the

Total Amount Payable shown in the Schedule together with any other sums due from

you under mis Agreement, less the amount of the Monthly Repayments and any other

repayments you have made and less any rebate of imprest to which yon may be

entitled under the Consumer Credit (Rebate on Early Settlement) Regulations 1983.

6. Subject to the provisions of Clause 7 below, all payments made by you shall be

applied first in the payment of any Monthly Payment Protection Insurance Premiums

payable, second in the payment of any interest and third in repayments of the Amount

of Credit.

7. Where you have more than one agreement with us, then subject to your right under

Section 81 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 to appropriate payments, we may apply

any payment made by you to us to the sums outstanding under any of such

agreements.

8. You authorise us to set off and deduct from any sums due from us to you or held

by us for you or your benefit, whether in a savings account, current account or

otherwise, any sums due to us under this Agreement which are not paid on their due

dates.

9. No relaxation or indulgence which we may extend to you shall prejudice our rights

10. This clause applies only if you have elected to take Payment Protection Insurance:

(a) you understand that Payment Protection Insurance of the balance outstanding in

the event of death and/or certain minimum monthly repayments in the event of

accident, sickness and unemployment is optional and is not required by us as a

condition of entering into this Agreement;

(b) you acknowledge having received full particulars of the Payment Protection

Insurance and you may request further information at any time;

 

© where the Agreement is made with two or more persons you acknowledge

that the Payment Protection Insurance shall apply only to the first named

customer ("the Insured");

(d) the Insured proposes to Hamilton Life Assurance Company Limited and

Hamilton Insurance Company Limited ("the Insurers") for insurance under

their usual terms and conditions;under this Agreement.

(e) you agree to pay to us the Monthly Payment Protection Insurance

Premiums which will be calculated as shown overleaf and payable by you on

each Monthly Repayment Date under this Agreement;

(f) if you fail to pay the Monthly Payment Protection Insurance Premiums on

their due dates, the Credit Protection Insurance may be allowed to lapse;

(g) you authorise us to remit the Monthly Payment Protection Insurance

Premiums payable to the Insurers as appropriate;

(h) the Insured authorises the Insurers to pay to us the proceeds of any claim

and authorises us to apply such proceeds in or towards the payment to us of the

balance payable under this Agreement;

(i) you agree that we may at any time by written notice to you vary (i) the date

of the month upon which the Monthly Payment Protection Insurance Premiums

are to be paid (ii) the amount of the Monthly Payment Protection Insurance

Premiums;

(j) you consent to the Insurers seeking information from other insurers to check

the answers you have provided and you authorise the giving of such

information for such purposes.

11. If you the Customer are more than one person, your liability under this

Agreement will be joint and several. This means that each of you are liable for the

Customer's obligations under this Agreement.

12. All notices demands and statements given to you in person or sent to or left at

your present or last known address shall constitute good and sufficient service and if

sent by prepaid first class post shall be deemed to be received by you within 48

hours of posting.

13. This Agreement shall not be secured by any charge on land which has been or

shall he granted hy you or any other person to us

14. You agree to pay and authorise us to debit your account with our costs incurred

or reasonable charges in writing any letter or making any telephone call in respect

of any breach of this Agreement and/or in enforcing our rights or remedies under or

in relation to this Agreement, including all tracing, collection agent's and/or legal

costs on a full indemnity basis.

15. All payments to be made under this Agreement shall be made by such method

and/or to such of our offices as we shall from time to time direct in writing. Any

payment by post shall be at your risk.

16. In so far as is permitted by law you agree that we may at any time transfer:-

(i) our rights and benefits, including your liability to us, under this Agreement;

(ii) our duties and obligations under this Agreement;

to any person without having to give you prior notice. Any such transfer will be without prejudice to you continuing to meet your obligations under this Agreement and shall be without prejudice to your statutory rights, including your rights under the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

17 .Any notice to be given by us to you under this Agreement may be given in

writing or by such other means as may be permitted or required by law.

18 .If at any time any provision, or part thereof, of this Agreement becomes

invalid, illegal or unenforceable, the remaining parts and/or provisions shall

continue in full force and effect.

19 .In the interpretation of this Agreement in Scotland, words and expressions

shall bear their nearest equivalent meanings. Subject to this, the Agreement

shall be interpreted in accordance with English law and you consent to the

non-exclusive jurisdiction of the English courts, although we shall be entitled to

take proceedings in any competent jurisdiction.

 

IMPORTANT - YOU SHOULD READ TfflS CAREFULLY YOUR RIGHTS

The Consumer Credit Act 1974 covers this agreement and lays down certain requirements for your protection which must be

satisfied when the agreement is made. If they are not, the creditor cannot enforce the agreement against you without a court

order.

The Act also gives you a number of rights. You have a right to settle this agreement at any time by giving notice in writing

and paying off all amounts payable under the agreement which may be reduced by a rebate.

If you would like to know more about the protection and remedies provided under the Act, you should contact either your

local Trading Standards Department or your nearest Citizens' Advice Bureau.

 

Hamilton Direct Bank, a division of HFC Bank pic. An authorised institution under the Banking Act 1987. Registered office: North Street, Winkfield, Windsor, Berkshire SL4 4TD. Registered in England No. 1117305.

 

Hdbppltc/12-.%

 

got another form and they say they will send my 10 quid back as i am not complying with there request to fill in this damm form ggggrrr

[patrickq1]

Beneficial Finance

Member HSBC Group

 

HFC Bank Customer Services 0870 010 0453

Monday to Saturday 9am - 6pm

O

p •~?

 

 

 

 

Sheet 1 of 2

9,236.70

- 2.497.99

11 2923 1489 00000

1.692.89

0.00

-

 

 

you talk we listen

About your account

Opening balance

(Including fees - see below)*

Payments and other credits

Interest charges, fees and other debits

Insurance payments

 

 

 

Your annual statement for your

Beneficial FinancaJoaiL -

About this statement

Account number:

Statement number: i

Period covered: 01 Oct 2008 to 11Sep2009

Annual rate of interest at start of period: 20.832%

About your transactions

 

 

Closing balance

(Including fees - see below)*

About your credit agreement

Loan type: Personal Loan

You borrowed: £10,000.00

Payment Protection Insurance: No

Date of agreement: 9th Aug 2007

Duration of your agreement: 84 months

 

8,431.60

 

 

 

Date

01-Oct-08

";i5-oct-08

15-Oct-08 i5-Nov-08 15-Nov-08

|:15 dec-08 15-Dec-08 15-Jaft-09 ; 15-Jan-09

;;i4-Feb09-14-Feb-09

14-MAR-: 14-Mar-09

: 15-Apr-09 15-May-09

 

Description

Opening Balance

Payment thank you

Interest

Payment thank you

Interest

Payment thank you

Interest

Payment thank you

Interest

Payment thank you

Interest

Paymen

Interest

Payment thank you

Interest

 

Payments

£ (Credit)

227.09 227.09 227.09 227,09 227.09

227.09 227.09

 

Interest/Fees

£ (Debit)

158.15

162.20

155.86

159.80

158.48

142.03

155.89

 

Insurance paid

£ (Debit)

 

Loan balance

£ (exc. fees)*

9,236.70

9,009.61

9,167.76 8,940.67

9,102.87 ::8,875.78

9.031.64

8,804.55

8,964.35

8,737.26

8.895.74 8,668.6S

8,810.68

8.512.39

8.739.48

1 5-May-09 Interest 149.64 8.662.03

 

l5-Jun-09 Payment thank you 227.09

227.09 227.09 8,434.94

15-Jun-09 Interest 153.26 8,588.20

 

Carried forward

 

8,588.20

 

New regulations require all lenders to provide customers with an annual statement. Please refer to the enclosed leaflet. This explains to you why you have been sent this statement. It is important you read this to answer any questions you may have.

Please be aware that the regulations only require lenders to show transactions from the 1st October 2008 onwards,

Irrespective of when the account was opened.

The regulations also stipulate that each signatory on an account must receive a statement unless written authorisation is provided from one of the signatories to only issue one statement per account.

You can exercise this option by writing to us at the Coventry address detailed overleaf.

[dx100uk]

???????

 

if you think anyone can understand that you're mistaken

 

post them as pdf atts

 

scan your sheets/agreements

remove all pers info inc barcodes etc but leave all figures and dates.

goto one one of the many free online pdf converter websites

convert the image to pdf format.

open a new msg box here

hit go advanced below the msg box

hit manage attachments below that box

browse to your pdf file and upload it

hit close this windows at the bottom below upload it box

 

dx

[patrickq1]

will do it on monday at my daughters flat lol haha even i could nt understand that lot was done in haste last night i blame my dementure DD

patrickq1

[patrickq1]

now i gotta do my daughters PPI claim against barclays all six years ,she was a student for four years and was getting charged an average of 12.88 per month so charges also increased...gggr so she has a few grand to come back

patrickq1

[patrickq1]

thanks mod

[patrickq1]

payments, note the intrest wrongly equated this has been going on for 9 years from the last contract

so i got something to say ,but reported it to FSA because they will not send contracts

photobucket

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt260/patrickq1/HFC23.jpg[/url]

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt260/patrickq1/HFC12.jpg

Edited August 16, 2010 by patrickq1

[dx100uk]

we cant see them

post as pdf as advised before please

 

you're on to something and i need to understand it.

 

dx

[patrickq1]

try now any better on the links ?

[patrickq1]

yes links work dx

[dx100uk]

right so's what have you found out ........

 

dx

[patrickq1]

the charge of 227 does not equate to 20.832% it works out at 22.832 % so i have been paying 10 per month for over three years, secondly the old contract was quoting 8 % and when we borrowed of them it jumped up to the above, but also the PPI of the old account they were charging 16% of the total monthly figure i have that in writing just found some old documents ,,,,

so i have written to the FSA as they are 40 days today are up

patrickq1

[Sparkie1723]

Hi Patrick,

 

Sorry mate just used the Best calculator there is and your APR is spot on ...in fact you are underpaying by 5 pence a month.

 

sparkie:mad:

Edited August 22, 2010 by Sparkie1723
wrong calculation

[patrickq1]

yes i thought that and considering they bumped me for a higher rate of intrest when we took out the second agreement, and on the first agreement we have simmallar intrest mis calculations ,they will not send any agreement, especially the second agreement because i scored out at the bottom where it says they can share my information etc.. i wrote in do not share my information with any company whatsoever..they accepted that lol

[Sparkie1723]

The calculator I use is American............ it uses dollar signs instead of pounds.............. but is is accurate to the 4th decimal point...and it does 2 calculations before it gives you the APR and use the OFT/ world wide APR calculator formula....it is spot on mate ...that I can assure you Sorry agin for the bad news.#

 

sparkie

[Sparkie1723]

yes i thought that and considering they bumped me for a higher rate of intrest when we took out the second agreement, and on the first agreement we have simmallar intrest mis calculations ,they will not send any agreement, especially the second agreement because i scored out at the bottom where it says they can share my information etc.. i wrote in do not share my information with any company whatsoever..they accepted that lol

 

That one they cannot get out of ...Use my favourite the Law of Estoppell!!!

Thats a breach of the contract on their part

 

sparkie

[patrickq1]

i used the OFT CALC so looks like there is a possible dispute lol

[Sparkie1723]

Estoppell

 

Where one person (‘the representor’) has made a representation of fact to another person (‘the representee’) in words or by acts or conduct, or (being under a duty to the representee to speak or act) by silence or inaction, with the intention (actual or presumptive) and with the result of inducing the representee on the faith of such representation to alter his position to his detriment, the representor, in any litigation which may afterwards take place between him and the representee, is estopped, as against the representee, from making, or attempting to establish by evidence, any averment substantially at variance with his former representation, if the representee at the proper time, and in proper manner, objects thereto.

 

sparkie

[Sparkie1723]

You use the above in case they btried to argue that they did not notice at the time that you had altered the agreement if they had they would not have agreed to it........That's their lookout they accepted it as you said

sparkie:cool:

[patrickq1]

yes i did alter the agreement i have been doing that since the morgan stanley fiasco i swore then never again will i agree to another contract that asked me to agree to an open ended clause concerning data, my feelings about the right to share data with any source they please as well as it meaning that experian and others then have the right to use it is just not on , i always come back to the REPUGNANCY RULE this tells me i am right (in my own mind lol) but to agree to the right to share data is an altogether other contract i have never given experian the rights to share my data why because i have never signed a contract with them .I HAVE NEVER SHOWN CONSIDERATION TO THEM SHARING MY CONTRACT REGARDLESS...there has never been any reality of consent

the repugnancy rule just look it up