CL Finance court claim

[Yog sothoth]

Back again.

 

I had a debt with HSBC which I made an arrangement to pay off at £10 a month. Unsurprisingly they sold it on, and it ended up with CL Finance. They had to honour the agreement which I had adhered to, and sent me new account details for payment, to which I amended the standing order accordingly. This was in February of 2009.

 

All went well until March 2010 when I got a letter, stating that I had not maintained payments and that I must pay £10 within 10 days of the date on the letter, and maintain payments thereafter for the agreement to continue.

 

I checked my account and payments had been made as agreed every month, so I ignored it.

 

Then, got a looong letter from their solicitors Cohen & Co, (dated 25th March) saying I had not been honouring payment so they were going to take legal action. It did not specify what the supposed breach was or in what way I had not honoured the agreement.

 

This was followed by a Default Notice, dated 6th April, which came from CL Finance themselves. This stated that the letter of 25th March had incurred an admin charge of £5 and that I was now in default of that £5. It didn't say anything about being in breach of payment on the agreement, any remedy, or dates by which...etc etc.

 

I again checked my account and it showed that payments had been going out as agreed every month. I wrote back and pointed this out, and sent them print-offs of both the standing order details and the record of payments made on it. Heard nothing in reply (this was sent 3 weeks ago).

 

Today I have a court claim from them, without any reply to my letter or chance to resolve the issue!

 

I have been to my branch and had them look in depth at the payments. They confirmed that the payments have been going out without fail, BUT, the payments have been returned for some reason. I had no idea this was happening but it was not due to any fault on my part. The money was there, the standing order was as originally set up, and many payments had been made on it previously.

 

It seems that, for some reason at their end of things, from December onwards, they have not been accepting my monthly payment and have been returning it to my bank. As nothing has been changed at my end, it must be to do with them. I will write to them and point this out. In the meantime I need to think about a defence.

 

I think I also need to re-send them the "missed" payments (totalling £80! ) so that removes one of the sticks they are trying to beat me with.

[harrassed senior]

Firstly we need to know what the debt was for, ie. Credit Card, overdraft etc.

[Yog sothoth]

OK cheers. It was originally a HSBC loan I got into difficulty with, dating from 2002, I think.

[count orlok]

They've closed the account that the money has been paid into, thy should have sent you details of the new account, I had this done to me and i thnk it may have been CL finance. You need to ask them why they changed the account number for the account you where paying it into.

[Yog sothoth]

OK will do. I can show them and the court if need be, that I made payments in good faith, to the account I had been given. My only mistake was in not realising they began being rejected from xmas onwards.

[harrassed senior]

Have you been down the CCA request route yet?

[Yog sothoth]

Not with CL. I did it with HSBC when they got heavy and they instantly produced a perfect copy of the original CA with T&C etc. Undisputable, hence the agreement I had with them.

[harrassed senior]

Having re-read above, am I mis understanding or are you saying that each payment went out, and was then returned to your account, if so I believe a Judge may ask why over a period of months you did not notice this?

 

Not trying to be picky or unhelpful, but you will need to cover that point if it goes to Court.

[Yog sothoth]

I didn't notice it because I don't go through my statements with a fine tooth comb every month. It's only £10 so hardly makes a noticeable difference.

[PGH7447]

Makes no odds whether the OP noticed or not, the payments were made to the account details given, that had until that point worked.

 

If ClueLess cant manage their own in house admin that is their look out and to take the OP to court for their ineptitude stinks.

 

Acknowledge the claim and put down you intend to defend all their claims, also send them a cpr and put down you want to know why they were refusing your payments, you will soon see the morons squirm

[Yog sothoth]

cpr?

[PGH7447]

CPR31.x once a court claim is recieved you can send that and demand all info they are going to rely on in court, saves you a tenner on a sar, send it to both clueless and cohen

[Yog sothoth]

OK, there's a job then. Will get that off this weekend. In meantime I'll get my acknowledgement in.

 

One thing though, would it be to my advantage to bring the payments up to date? (assuming I can get their real account details)

[PGH7447]

If you can then yes, it shows that you have been more than fair to these morons

[Yog sothoth]

OK. Acknowledged service on MCOL, and also notified intent to contest jurisdiction, as I have not been served a DN in the prescribed form (worst I've ever seen!) and the alleged DN doesn't even pertain to the alleged breach!

 

Also written similar letters to both HC and CL.

 

I'll copy and post the docs on here if it will be helpful?

[Yog sothoth]

I think I've had a fast one pulled on me! (or been stupid)

 

Other than acknowledgement of service, I didn't reply to the claim, and tried to sort it out with Howard Cohen, CL's colicitors. As I had been making payments and still was, even though they were being returned, I thought it would be easily sorted out.

 

I had a letter from Lewis Debt Recovery (CL alter-ego) dated 10th Sept, telling me that the claim was on hold for a further week and I had to send them details of the sort code and account number to which I'd been paying my £10 a month, giving the impression they were trying to sort it out. I had already sent this info twice, so sent them again, in a very terse letter, and expected them to sort it out.

 

I was obviously naive and their letter was just a delaying tactic as Judgment has been awarded for the full amount plus costs, by default! AAAGH!!

 

My fault for trying to sort it out without going to court because I knew I hadn't done anything wrong. I could kick myself (or worse)!

Is there anything I can do? I made payements to their account without fail, as per the original agreement (see earlier posts for details), so other than not submitting a defence, I have done NOTHING WRONG!

 

I think I can apply for judgment to be set aside, can't I? If so, does this cost me anything?

 

God, I feel such a fool now!

Next thing I expect is an interim charge on the house.

Edited October 7, 2010 by Yog sothoth

[Yog sothoth]

Incidentally, I acknowledged service on the same date the claim was issued (just checked on MCOL).

 

Doesn't the court have to set aside if I acknowledged service within the time limit, even if I did not submit a defence?

 

Also, does anyone know what the time limit is for submitting an application for set aside? If it's successful, can I claim costs against CL?

[Huff&Puff]

According to this, you should be OK about getting a Set Aside, as you put in an acknowledgement. It seems to be saying that you must be granted one:

 

http://www.bdl.org.uk/images/12_how_to_set_aside_a_judgment_in_the_county_court.pdf

 

It will cost you £75 as far as I know, but you can get that back if you win, I think.

[Yog sothoth]

So if I apply for set aside on the 18th (payday) that should be OK? On your link it suggests there's no time limit for application.

 

I did acknowledge service but failed to submit a defence, and as I adhered to my agreed payments throughout, The court should surely grant a set aside!

 

So would I be able to claim back my £75 from the court if I win the set aside, or would it come under costs?

[Yog sothoth]

Just bumping this as I could do with some advice. I need to know if there's a time limit to apply for set aside, as none of the sites I've looked at are very clear on that, and I don't have £75 to spend right now!

[Huff&Puff]

All the advice I've seen here on CAG is that you should apply for a Set Aside as soon as possible. There may not be a time limit in the sense that people sometimes don't find out about CCJs until years later, so they can still apply. But that's not the same as knowing about a CCJ and then sitting on your hands and doing nothing for a while. I really think you need to find the £75. Or you may be exempt - have a look at the EX160A PDF here:

 

http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/HMCSCourtFinder/GetForm.do?court_forms_id=484

[Yog sothoth]

OK but I get paid a week on Monday. I wouldn't think a week would be an issue. In the meantime I need to get the form N244 I think, so it'll probably take a few days for the court to send me that anyway.

[Yog sothoth]

Righto, got the N244 form and am filling it out. There's been a delay because I didn't have £75 to pay the fee!

 

Could someone advise me on filling in the form?

 

In section 3: What order do I want and why, I've said the following:

 

I am requesting a set aside on the Default Judgment made on XXXXXX. My reasons are that I can comprehensively show that I, for my part, adhered strictly to the terms of the payment agreement between myself and the Claimant, and that any discrepancy leading to non-payment was entirely due to omission or error on their part. Aslo, that I endeavoured for several months prior to the judgment being awarded, to rectify the problem with the Claimant, to no avail (the problem being 'at their end' so to speak). Further, that at no point did I receive a formal Default Notice, containing the prescribed terms, which is a statutory requirement prior to court action, and that the Claimant took advantage of my inexperience in these matters to gain a judgement in their favour. All of this is supported by documentation including letters between myself and the Claimant, and statements from my bank, showing clearly that payments were made, as required, each and every month, to the account details provided me by the Claimant.

 

Is that OK?

 

I've left section 4 blank.

 

In section 5 I've asked for a hearing, but left the time estimate blank.

 

No idea of the level of judge s left that blank.

 

In section 9, named the Claimant to be served with the application.

 

In section 10, I have listed all the documentary evidence I intend to use.

 

And that's it?

 

The only thing is, I believe I can get this transferred to my home court (Sheffield). How do I do that? Do I send this form to the Northampton Court, or to Sheffield? It's not very clear.

 

lastly, if I do get a set aside, would I be able to claim costs, including my fee?

Edited October 19, 2010 by Yog sothoth

[Yog sothoth]

Talk about timing! After posting the above post this afternoon, I got home to find a leter from Howard Cohen Solicitors, for CL Finance, confirming that thet have not received a payment from me since December (a lie: they received it and returned it), and that I should continue to pay £10 a month, but bring the arrears up to date! That's all I wanted anyway! They didn't need to pursue me through the court for that!

They've included (new) account details for payment. If they'd given me that 2 months ago all this mess would have been avoided.

 

I'm still going for set aside because not only has their under-handedness resulted in me getting a CCJ against me, it's cost me £325 in costs and fees, PLUS the £75 the set aside application will cost me!

[Yog sothoth]

Anyone? I know you're all really busy but CL have given me until the 20th to pay the arrears, in a letter which only arrived today (the 19th)! Plus, I have the N244 on screen and need to get it printed and sent if it's OK.