Yorkshire Water 50 GBP charge on 75 GBP Bill

[jimbo45]

Hi there

These Water Companies are as bad as the Banks.

 

I work away a lot so I missed a 75 GBP water bill. Next I know is that they have issued a CCJ and added 50 GBP " Solicitors costs".

 

First usiing the County Court procedure for a very small amount (almost trivial some might say) of debt is GROSSLY OVERKILL

 

secondly how on EARTH can they justify 50 GBP "Solicitors Fee" when issuing a CCJ via the Northampton Bulk court procedure is an online "service" that takes less than a minute to do and thirdly the amount of "Collection Charge" added to the debt is TOTALLY DISPROPORTIONATE to the amount owed.

 

I am prepared to pay the 4 GBP or so "Court Fee" but have totally disputed the "Solicitors costs" and am writing both to OFWAT (complaining about the use of the CCJ system for ludicrously small amounts of debt) and to the OFT for being charged "LOANSHARKING RATES" where the "Fee" of collection is almost as much as the debt itself.

 

I really don't care about credit : credit references etc etc as I don't use or want credit cards etc but I AM NOT whatever the court says going to pay this rediculous 50 GBP "Solicitors fee".

 

I know in any case Yorkshire Water CANNOT cut off services if the payment for WATER SUPPLY has been made -- Utilities CANNOT discoonect services for non payment of other "Fees" such as Solicitors costs.

 

I have a feeling that if you apply to a county court for money owed the Creditor is actually only allowed to charge for the amount owing plus the court fee.

 

I can't remember it but hopefully some cagger can point out the relevant rules here as to what "charges" if any can be legally applied when a CCJ is requested by a creditor.

 

Yorkshire Water must be really hurting if they are going to court for these trivial debts and needing to add "Solicitors Fees" on top.

 

Cheers

jimbo

[loopinlouie]

Think you could ask for judgement to be set aside due to you being out of country and unaware of case come to court.

[Bookworm]

Wooooahhh.

 

The water people can't have issued a CCJ, that's for the court to give AFTER the case has gone to court (or if they got judgment in default, MCOL could have done that).

 

Are you sure what you got is a CCJ, or is it maybe a court summons? Please confirm and we can take it from there, as your next step will depend on that.

[jimbo45]

Hi there

I've got one of those things from Northampton with the demand

 

75 GBP for Water Bill

I think 10 GBP or so court costs and 50 GBP Solicitors costs

 

The case hasn't actually gone to court yet -- I think I've still a few days to dispute the claim but the papers are definitely from the Northamton County Court.

 

I only saw this because I went home last weekend -- I'm trying to save money at the moment so I don't go home that often currently.

 

I'm working in France at the moment -- I'll see if I can dispute the claim online -- I certainly have NO INTENTION of paying 50 GBP costs on a 75 GBP debt - especially when I see what HUGE salaries the heads of these companies get.

 

The County Court should only be used for "serious" debts -- I'm sure the water Co could easily have just added the 75 GBP to my next bill.

 

Anyway I am SO SICK of getting RIPPED OFF by these companies and woe betide whoever sends me another threatogram with words like "Unless XX Days full payment etc etc".

 

It's been HARD trying to get a job in the recession -- and its always those who can least afford it who seem to get stung with "Totally UNFAIR and extortionate" charges;

 

Anyway I'm not giving in to this type of blackmail.

 

Cheers

jimbo

[Bookworm]

Ok, as I thought.

 

What you have is a court claim form, not a CCJ.

 

You need to acknowledge the form in the times prescribed or you'll lose by default.

 

I am actually not sure what's the best way to proceed. If you admit the debt, MCOL will give judgment by default. If you dispute it, it gets transferred to your local court, but with you being away, it's going to be a right pain for you to defend.

 

Did they send previous letters, reminders, final demands, which you wouldn't have seen because of piling up whilst you were away? How far back? How old is the disputed bill? I'm trying to get an idea in my head of how unreasonable their behaviour would be seen in a court.

[jimbo45]

Hi there

It's just a standard quartely bill __ probably 4 weeks late and the amount is certainly very small -- I am really amazed that Yorkshire Water would have taken this route rather than just bang on the 75 GBP to the next bill with say a reasonable late payment charge

 

To add a 50 GBP "Charge" on to a 75 GBP bill seems grossly extortionate and out of all proportion to the amount actually owed - especially when the "Solicitors time" couldn't actually have taken more than 20 secs and to get a CCJ form from Northampton doesn't require the services of a solicitor at all.

 

What would happen if I admit the 75 GBP plus court fee costs but dispute the 50 GBP so admit only part liability. Could I also ask for a "Breakdown" of "Costs" to see how they actually arrive at this fee.

 

What could happen then -- I can't get the water disconnected as I would have paid the water service fee.

 

Cheers

jimbo

[Kryt]

Silly question, slightly off topic.

 

Why a court summons from Northampton CC from Yorkshire Water? YW don't supply any properties in Northamptonshire.

[Bookworm]

MCOL are based in Northampton.

 

Jimbo, I don't know the answer. I'm really sorry, I don't know what to advise here.

[jimbo45]

Hi there

 

The Northampton Court is usually the one used for starting CCJ processes since it is a "Bulk Auto" Court system and the CCJ demands can be done in a matter of seconds online.

 

I think about 99% of CCJ requests originate from the Northampton Court -- it's nothing to do with "Properties in Northampton" etc.

 

Cheers

jimbo

[the main man]

Also interested in any answers Jimbo as I'm in the same boat with YW.... recently received the same from Northampton BC, missed 3x £25 instalments and now they are demanding the full yearly amount to March 2011 with costs via Northampton.

 

I have offered the arrears and a payment plan to them however they will not accept this

 

Can they actually claim for sevices that you have not fully recieved?

 

And will the Courts look favourably on a company that continues with a CC claim despite written offers of a payment plan and arrears?

[jimbo45]

Hi there

just pay them SOMETHING -- Don't pay solicitors costs etc as these ARE NOT ALLOWED

 

You CANNOT have your services disconnected provided you have paid for them -- you CANNOT be disconnected for not paying the "extra charges" such as solictors costs in any case the amont charged is TOTALLY DISPROPORTIONATE to the amont of money owed.

 

I'm going to compmain to OFWAT and the OFT -- Using the Country court system for really trivially small amonts of debts (my mobile phone MONTHLY bill is bigger than 75 GBP) could really be considered as HARASSEMENT AND VEXATIOUS.

 

In any case County court or not I'm NOT going to pay the 50 GBP "Solicitors fee" -- especially without a proper invoice with breakdown of costs.

 

I'll just tell YW to "Go and make a sexual move with a duck" if they try and collect the 50 GBP.

 

Cheers

jimbo

[Gothicfairy]

Sorry the reply is late but I read this with an opened mouth.

I know we are all about consumer rights and being fair but the above is slightly silly.

Solicitors costs are allowed to be included( as far as I am aware with utilites as I have seen hundreds of accounts with fees attached.) as part of the process for debt recovery before court is : bill, reminder, red reminder, solicitors letter x 2 then court ( there can also be a black reminder and tele reminders as well depending on the company).

All this is set by the system and other then tele reminders the process is little touched by human hand so the amount outstanding is not really relevant either.

One of the letters or reminders would have explained the fees if no payment was received. It is hardly their fault you were not in the country to read those letters.

I can't really see how it is harassement as they sent a bill and you didn't pay it, how where they to know you would pay it next time or when you got back.

The computer system works for a reason and that is to make sure all accounts that fall into arrears are treated the same : IE recovery action then court.

 

Also: Water companies do not disconnect domestic customers at all. Debt or no debt as agreed with OFWAT and the government, (water act ) they can however disconnect commerical properties even if some payment has been made.

 

Finally, complain to OFWAT by all means but it is them that argreed the process and charges to begin with.

They are the ones that control what the water companies can make and how much profit they can claim etc.

 

 

I honestly can't see why you don't call or write to Yorkshire water and see what they can offer. They might accept your payment and set up a direct debt to make sure it does not happen again.

[compilerz]

Hello Guys

I am in the same boat as jimbo and i searched the whole website looking for any similar case with Yorkshire water county court claim form i received.

 

Is it too late to try and setup an arrangement with Yorkshire water at this stage? as i am willing to pay to avoid the CCJ but i cant just pay the full amount in one go.

 

When i looked for their reminders i only found one letter only threatening with county court..is that enough?

 

So if to avoid the CCJ if i asked for a repayment plan (including sols fees £50) will that still means i get CCJ?

 

Many thanks guys

 

Morgan

[pelham9]

They cannot disconnect water.

[pelham9]

If you offer a reasonable repayment plan they will not go to court. If they were to do so they would most likely receive lower repayments from the court and would certainly not get any solicitors costs.

[compilerz]

Thank you Pelham9

So i should just fill in the admission form offering a repayment plan?

i was hoping for 5 months plan and not sure what is reasonable but CCJ means termination of my employment

[pelham9]

CCJ means termination of my employment

 

Then you acknowledge the claim saying you wish to defend - this can be done online - you do not need to give your defence at this stage. The case will be transferred to your local court and you will have plenty of time to write to Yorkshire with a dispute letter.

 

Upto the actual hearing of the case their is nothing to stop you from negotiating wirh Yorkshire who I am sure are not anxiuos to go to a local court to put their case. Once you have settled with and paid Yorkshire they will withdraw their court claim so no CCJ.

 

The reason that the utilities use the Northampton online facility is that most people chicken out and pay what they ask and it costs very little (certainly not £50). As soon as people say they are going to defend then the costs for them rocket and they will be happy to negotiate.

[pelham9]

CCJ means termination of my employment

 

Then you acknowledge the claim saying you wish to defend - this can be done online - you do not need to give your defence at this stage. The case will be transferred to your local court and you will have plenty of time to write to Yorkshire with a dispute letter.

 

Upto the actual hearing of the case their is nothing to stop you from negotiating wirh Yorkshire who I am sure are not anxiuos to go to a local court to put their case. Once you have settled with and paid Yorkshire they will withdraw their court claim.