Cabot/Morgans/Morgan Stanley CCJ Help required

[oneahead]

Just received letter from Morgan solicitors on behalf of Cabot. They say i am obliged to reply by virtue of Practice Direction. In short, i have been down the usual route for documentation pursuant to Civil Procedures. I have only received the following.

 

A very poor copy of an application with no prescribed terms.

 

A copy of a credit agreement with no personal details - just a generic copy.

 

A reproduction letter "welcome to Cabot" with no personal details.

 

Cabot response - legibility of document was clear at time of entering agreement, copies of NOA's are not retained on record and was sent to last known address, ( i have no such letter ).

 

No payment has been made since Feb 2009 when account was put in dispute. I have no default notices but may have received one.

 

What should my next step be? Should i now SAR?

 

Thanks in advance.

[Pinky69]

Ha! It may have been legible at the time but it certainly isn't now! Chancers. I wouldn't waste my time on them. Send them the Account in Dispute letter then ignore them - they clearly don't have an agreement.

[oneahead]

I have a claim form from Northampton for a Cabot debt, Morgans are the solicitors. Details are as follows:-

 

Debt above 5,000 and below 10,000

Originally Morgan Stanley

Requested agreement early 2009, received Sept 2009

CCA does not contain prescribed terms

Requested again pursuant to CPR and same copy provided

My agreement is signed and dated by both parties

 

They state the prescribed terms are contained in a seperate page which would have been page 2 of the CCA. They have sent a copy of the supposed 2nd page. There is nothing to indicate that this belongs to my agreement.

 

I have acknowledged claim online and will defend. If anyone can help it would be greatly appreciated.

[Pinky69]

Is this a loan or a credit card?

[citizenB]

Can you let us know the date of issue of the claim form. As you have acknowledged service, you will have 33 days from the date of ISSUE to enter your defence.

 

Have you sent a CPR 31.14 request for documents mentioned in the claim form .

 

Can you let us know exactly what it says on the claim form removing any values, account numbers and other personal identifiers.

 

Meanwhile, have a read of the following threads.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/241827-legal-action-how-start.html

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/255329-cpr-18-cpr-31-a.html

 

There are a lot of Cabot claims in the legal forums, might be a good idea to have a read of some of them.

 

As a claim has been issued against you, I have moved your thread to the legal issues forums where you will get lots of advice.

[citizenB]

More questions:

 

Have you at any time received a Default Notice from the original creditor.

 

If so, can you please remove any personal information, but leave dates on, scan it in and post it up using an image hosting site such as

 

Image hosting, free photo sharing & video sharing at Photobucket

 

thanks

[oneahead]

Debt is credit card. Issue date of claim form is 14th June. Yes CPR used to request documentation.

 

"The Claiment is the Assignee of a debt from Goldfish Bank. Notice of Assignment having been given to the Defendant in writing. Despite demand for payment ****>** remains due. The Claimant claims ****>** and interest under s.69 County Courts Act 1984 and costs"

 

They have sent me a representation letter of a Notice of Assignment. I have no default/termination letters although these may have been sent. Do i need to SAR? and if so whom?

[citizenB]

Debt is credit card. Issue date of claim form is 14th June. Yes CPR used to request documentation.

 

"The Claiment is the Assignee of a debt from Goldfish Bank. Notice of Assignment having been given to the Defendant in writing. Despite demand for payment ****>** remains due. The Claimant claims ****>** and interest under s.69 County Courts Act 1984 and costs"

 

They have sent me a representation letter of a Notice of Assignment. I have no default/termination letters although these may have been sent. Do i need to SAR? and if so whom?

 

If you are going send a SAR, then it needs to go to the original creditor. It will cost you £10.00. Sadly, I doubt you will receive the information in time to be of any value as they are allowed 40 days to provide it.

 

The POC is vague and doesnt really give you sufficient information to submit a fully particularised defence.

 

Did you ever receive the original Notice of Assignment ? This is important because it should have been sent to you via recorded delivery post. It also has to be accurate in every respect.

 

You will need to see a copy of the original Default Notice. It is as statutory requirement in order for the creditor to take the next step ie final demand, then court. If the DN was dated after December 2006 then it will have needed to have given you 14 clear days to remedy the breach. Allowing either 2 working days for 1st class post or 4 working days for 2nd or UK Mail/TNT post on top of the 14 calendar days. The amount requested on the DN needs to be accurate as well.

 

I see they are claiming s69 interest, which isnt permitted.. sigh... !!! And........ they dont plead it is an agreement regulated under the Consumer Credit Act 1974...

 

 

 

The Claimant fails to plead that this claim concerns an agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act, 1974. However, the Claimant claims interest pursuant to section 69 of the County Courts Act, 1984 which the Claimant should surely know they are not entitled to by virtue of the County Courts (Interest on Judgment Debts) Order, 1991 (SI 1991 No. 1184 (L. 12)) in particular section 2(3)(a), which clearly prohibits such an award:

 

· The general rule

 

2(3) Interest shall not be payable under this Order where the relevant judgment - (a) is given in proceedings to recover money due under an agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974;

 

 

So what information did you ask for in your CPR 31.14 ?

Reading the claim, I would say you could ask for the

assignment

default notice

Final demand/termination notice

agreement

statements in order to establish if the sum they are claiming for is accurate.

 

If you didnt ask for all the above, send a further CPR31.14 letter asking for what you missed off first time.

Oh, and I work out your defence would need to be submitted by 17th July 2010. But as that is a saturday, would suggest it was filed by the 16th.

If you dont receive the information requested in time then you should ask for and extension via CPR15.5.

[oneahead]

Many thanks. I only requested the credit agreement but will now request the other documentation.

[Pinky69]

MSDW cards are application forms which have been cut and paste with the "Financial Particulars" pasted on the bottom or at the side on the back. The T&Cs are usually Goldfish's, not MSDWs. There are examples on site for you to compare with. Desperate Daniella is the expert on this. When I complained to Cabot that what they sent me was a cut and paste, they sent me a different type of cut and paste! (idiots) and I never heard from them again. Is it possible for you to scan and post yours so we can have a look? Cover over your personal details.

[oneahead]

I have just received a CCJ. Claim was admitted by myself and expenditure form completed. The court has decided that i should pay over £200 a month on a £5,500 debt until cleared. I offered £15 a month on the expenditure form. I am challenging the amount and believe this will be held at my local court. My questions are :

 

Will i have to take proof of income/outgoings?

 

What are the chances of getting the amount reduced?

 

There is no way i can afford this monthly amount and i am afraid i will lose my home. Can anyone, from experience, tell me what the likely outcome will be?

[wycombe]

It may help you if you have income and expenditure forms completed using CCCS or Community Legal Advice (or both) - it depends how much time you have left.

 

If time is short and you have to do it yourself - you will have to prove your income and outgoings with copies of bank statements, bills etc. It would help if you had access to a template for doing this. CAB should also be able to assist here.

 

The Court should only make you pay as much as you can reasonably afford.

 

It is highly unlikely you will lose your home. If the Claimant were to go down this route they would first need to get a Charging Order against your property.

[oneahead]

I was given a date by which to pay the first installment on the original judgement but because this is impossible to pay (hence my redetermination hearing) no payment was made. Can they now apply for a charging order even though i have appealed?