dodgy default - now with Lewis group

[susiemac77]

I have an unsecured personal loan with Welcome

I called in December to advise i would need to make reduced payments due to my partners redundancy

 

Long story short, in March they threatened default and I tried (again!) to make a repayment arrangement. Never confirmed in writing as requested and refused to freeze interest

 

At the end of April I received a DN dated 24th April saying i had 14 days to clear arrears or default. No dates etc so I knew it was faulty

 

A couple of weeks later I got a letter from the Lewis group demanding full balance (more than the amount I borrowed despite over a years payment AND different from amount on DN)

 

I wrote back explaining that I had attempted to make payment arrangement but had been ignored

 

I then noticed that my credit file had been changed to default

 

I then received another letter lat week from Lewis accepting the original proposed repayment arrangement

 

I asked for advice on my original post as to whether I should offer to repay the monthly amount to Lewis but only for arrears listed on dodgy DN or whether they would just issue a corrected DN as I have never had a termination notice

 

I have just checked my credit file again today and noticed that the default was listed in MARCH when the DN wasnt even posted until the 24th APRIL!!!

 

Can I send a letter accepting the entries on my credit file and the demands from Lewis as effective termination of the agreement and negotiate to only pay the arrears listed??

 

I really want to get this sorted but dont want to give Lewis group the info they need to be able to issue a new DN and demand the full balance

 

HELP!!!???!!!

[hoogie32]

I also have had a default added to my credit file, prior to receiving the DN and termination letters, which they have now decided not to pursue as they have reset my DD back up.

[Sand-Dancer0191]

I would send a letter putting the account in dispute..that should stop interest etc adding up.

I also think that the final demands could be classed as a termination.The dodgy DN wouldn't stand up in court.It seems to me that they have scored two own goals,so I personally wouldn't pay anything...let them sort the mess out and make an offer to YOU

[postggj]

The dodgy DN wouldn't stand up in court

 

MAY I ASK HOW YOU CAN MAKE THAT STATEMENT

 

IME NOT BEING CRITICAL BUT THE DEFAULT AND TERMINATION REGS ARE QUITE SPECIFIC AND GIVE THE CREDITOR NO ROOM FOR ERROR

 

IF YOU HAVE A DUFF DEFAULT NOTICE AND COURT ACTIONS FOLLOW,

 

ALL THE DEBTOR WOULD BE LIABLE FOR ARE THE ARREARS UP TO THE DEFAULT NOTICE

 

THATS ALL

[postggj]

Woodchester v Swayne & Co [1998] EWCA Civ 1209 (14 July 1998)

[beyondhope]

Being in dispute means nothing when dealing with welcome as they dont subscribe to the banking code it doesnt stop interest, it doesnt stop charges and it doesnt mean you can stop payment. They will still chase the debt (rightly or wrongly)

[Sand-Dancer0191]

I can make that statement because of the points you have highlighted postggi,its not enforceable for the debt its self.

and my advise was that I personally wouldn't pay.That is based on the FSA debt collection guidelines (the same FSA who's powers are to be transferred back to the Bank of England)Which is the course of action I have taken and insisted W/F abide by..

[Sand-Dancer0191]

Section 87(1) of the CCA 1974 says:

 

87.--(1) Service of a notice on the debtor or hirer in accordance with section 88 (a default notice) is necessary before the creditor or owner can become entitled, by reason of any breach by the debtor or hirer of a regulated agreement,--

(a) to terminate the agreement, or

(b) to demand earlier payment of any sum....

Section 88 says that the DN must be in the prescribed form and the associated regulation say what that form is.

 

Thus, if the DN is not in the prescribed form, it is invalid and, under s87, the lender has no right of action.

 

CPR3.4(2)(a) says that the court may strike out a statement of case if it appears to the court –

 

(a) that the statement of case discloses no reasonable grounds for bringing ... the claim

[susiemac77]

thanks for all the replies but i must admit to still being confused!

 

My plan was to write to Welcome and Lewis accepting the payment demands and default as termination of the account. I was then going to follow that up with a letter to Lewis stating that as the account has been terminated with a dodgy default notice that they are only due the arrears listed on the DN and offer a payment arrangement to clear the arrears only and that I wont pay a penny until I have their agreement in writing

 

Will this work and do I have to write in prescribed terms?

[postggj]

the problem you have is not to tipp them off

 

a dodgy default notice only works in court

 

i would keep quiet for the time being

[susiemac77]

the problem you have is not to tipp them off

 

a dodgy default notice only works in court

 

i would keep quiet for the time being

 

how do i stop them hounding me for payment then?

[susiemac77]

how do i stop them hounding me for payment then?

 

should i still send a letter accepting termination of the account?

[postggj]

Send Them Nothing

 

Welcome Will Just Sell The Account To Another Dca

 

Do You Have Your Agreement With Your Signature On

[susiemac77]

i have the agreement somewhere but the account is post 2007 so cant dispute

 

only argument with them was when i tried to reduce my payments due to my partners redundancy. no help whatsoever then the dodgy default

 

to be honest i was happy to negotiate payment on the balance after default as at least then i wouldnt be chucking good money after bad on interest. but after reading all the threads on here if i can just pay arrears (less than 1/5th of balance) it would really help my finances

 

but i really dont want to go to court or be hounded daily by debt collectors

[susiemac77]

I have now recieved a letter from Howard Cohen & cO solicitors stating that they have been instructed to prepare court papers unless I pay the full amount

 

I am planning on sending the following to them, Lewis Group and Welcome

 

Dear Sir/Madam

I have received your letter dated 18th June (received on 24th June)

 

Please be aware that the account in question was terminated by Welcome Financial services following issue of an invalid Default Notice which did not allow for the specified time period for the breach of the account to be remedied by as specified by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (amend. 2006) s88(1) & s88(2), nor did the Default Notice contain the prescribed terms as laid down in the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (amend. 2006) s88(1) & s88(2) therefore should Lewis Group or its appointed legal representative pursue legal action, then only the arrears of £xxx.xx as stated at the time of the Default Notice (dated 20/04/2010) would become liable.

 

Notwithstanding that the default notice failed to give me the required statutory time in which to seek legal advice and/or remedy any alleged defect, as laid out in s87 of the CCA 1974. Welcome Finance's actions resulted in insufficient time for me to even obtain an appointment with a solicitor let alone remedy the alleged default. This lead to unlawful rescinding of the agreement demonstrated by a default being listed on my credit report (before the default notice had even been issued), passing of the account to Lewis Group and their subsequent demands for full payment

 

I accept your unlawful rescission of the agreement I note that you are now entitled to claim those arrears genuinely due at the time of the termination (not including any unlawful charges ) and I would be obliged if you would advise me of the exact amount of those arrears, against which will be a claim for unlawful rescission.

 

I look forward to your response

 

All opinions gratefully received as dont want to post the letter and mess the whole thing up but dont want to be taken to court either!

[Sand-Dancer0191]

My thoughts are:- IF they agree to this and you pay the arrears..there is a poss. that they may sell the debt on as it is still there...

IF you went to court and produced the contents of your letter as your defence YOU would recieve a judgement (unlawful or struck out)killing the agreement altogether with the same end result..

MAY NEED A SECOND OPINION ON THIS THOUGH!!!!!

[susiemac77]

My thoughts are:- IF they agree to this and you pay the arrears..there is a poss. that they may sell the debt on as it is still there...

IF you went to court and produced the contents of your letter as your defence YOU would recieve a judgement (unlawful or struck out)killing the agreement altogether with the same end result..

MAY NEED A SECOND OPINION ON THIS THOUGH!!!!!

 

Anyone?

[just_jue]

Hi Susiemac, just a long shot but when you took out the agreement did welcome make you have PPI? If so use it they may not like it it but that is what they sold them for.

 

JJ

[susiemac77]

Unfortunately I didnt take the PPI as I was pretty sure it wouldnt be worth the paper it was written on!

 

Sand dancer - I i really dont want to risk this going to court and havent had any 2nd opinions so Im going to send the letter and and add a paragraph that I want written confirmation that WF and Lewis wont chase for balance at later date, wont sell it on and will mark my credit file as paid. Worth a shot

[susiemac77]

Received a letter from Lewis yesterday (dated same day I posted my letter to them)

They have offered 50% discount to settle if I pay by 11th July

 

I wont be paying it (couldnt even if I wanted to in a week!) but am hoping that they have realised it wont stand up in court and will negotiate to repay just the arrears listed on the dodgy default

 

the arrears are about 20% of the full amount they requested so if they offer between 20% & 30% without going to court and let me pay in installments I will accept that and get rid of it - will make sure I have written confirmation that they wont chase for blance or sell it on