PPI YCC & Go Debt

[Catweazle69]

Hi.

 

Im not going to bore you all with yet another tale of woe as reading the threads and all your responses seem to be of the same ilk and Im very impressed with the replies and advice. I just want to clarify my personal predicament.

 

My situation is simple. Car bought (forced purchase with ppi) July 04, 1 repayment made, then car was faulty, they wouldnt repair it, I lost my job, they took it back without any paperwork etc in Oct. No letters in 4-5 years etc then today they call my mother as she was one of the referees on the form. Wanting to send papers etc.

 

Now I no this debt (and it would appear a lot of others) becomes statute barred in July and it would appear they are having one final push etc. To sum up my ppi situation on my contract reads as follows

 

PPI Premium (this is actually left blank on the contract)

It then reads downwards as follows.

 

Mech BDown etc 550.00

Gap Ins 300.00

Tot Ins premuim cash price 850.00

Less Down Pmt 101.00

SF Req by way of credit 749.00

Add Int 311.80

Bal pay 1060.80

Tot Amt Pay 1061.80

 

Am I to assume this follows the pattern of others and if so should I send the standard letter people refer to on posts ie its null and void? Should I play them along for a couple of months until 6yrs has elapsed? and finally if the agreement is worthless and they send papers to try to bankrupt me (as they are threatening to do) do I just set it aside as I am disputing the fact?

 

Thank you in adv for any advice you give.

[postggj]

send this recorded delivery to the cretins

 

cut and paste letter fill in details and send to godebt...so far they have declined to take anyone to court after receiving this..though they have sometimes gone for a stat demand again dont worry they are easy enough to set aside

 

 

Xx

Xx

Date

 

Agreement number

 

Dear sir/madam

 

I do not acknowledge any debt to your company

after having my agreement from DAF looked at I can now confirm the following

 

I HAVE NO INTENTION OF MAKING ANY PAYMENT ON THIS ACCOUNT. I REQUIRE GoDebt TO EITHER CLOSE DOWN THIS ACCOUNT OR ISSUE AN N1 county court claim

 

I will now explain why the agreement is unenforceable, might I also suggest yourselves running it past a solicitor qualified in the consumer credit act and regulations.

 

When the agreement was taken out, I was informed that I had to take out payment protection insurance to cover the creditor if I was unable to make repayments.

 

Now this constitutes a charge for credit as it has been included in the amount of credit.

 

As the amount of credit has been misstated, the agreement cannot be enforced, as the amount of credit is a prescribed term, a court is prohibited from enforcing the agreement.

 

For clarity may I suggest you study s.127 (3) of the consumer credit act 1974?

 

The agreement in the way it is laid out falls well short on a compliant agreement.

 

For your reference the payment protection insurance needs to be included in total charge for credit and not the amount of credit

.

As the agreement is in two parts, the conditional sale and credit agreement, as they have been linked, the true cost of the vehicle has been overstated. This puts the debtor at a disadvantage should he/she wish to do a voluntary termination on the vehicle.

 

I now draw your attention again to the meaning of amount of credit.

 

This is the difference between the cash price of the vehicle and any advance deposit.

 

Might I suggest you look at s.9 (4) of the consumer credit act 1974 for clarity?

 

Now as the price of the deposit was added to the insurance and not the credit agreement (car)

 

The cost of finance to the debtor has increased in the conditional sale agreement (car finance)

 

I WILL NOW EXPLAIN IN CRYSTAL CLEAR ENGLISH

 

1/ ANY DEPOSIT HAS BEEN ADDED TO THE CREDIT AGREEMENT/INSURANCE AND NOT FOR WHAT IT WAS INTENDED FOR.

THAT WOULD BE THE CONDITIONAL SALE PART OF THE AGREEMENT

 

2/ THE DEPOSIT HAS BEEN ADDED TO THE AMOUNT OF CREDIT ON THE INSURANCE

 

3/ BY DOING THIS, THE TOTAL FIGURE REPAYABLE ON THE CONDITIONAL SALE AGREEMENT HAS BEEN MISSTATED, PUTTING THE DEBTOR AT A DISADVANTAGE IF HE/SHE WISHES TO DO A VOLUNTARY TERMINATION.

 

IN SIMPLE SPEAK

 

THE TOTAL CHARGE FOR CREDIT AND AMOUNT OF CREDIT HAS BEEN MISSTATED.

 

May I suggest looking at s.90 of the consumer credit act on termination and payments of a third?

 

THIS ALSO IS PREJUDICIAL IN THE ANNUAL PERCENTAGE RATE WHICH TO WILL BE MISSTATED AND BEING A PRESCRIBED TERM, MAKES THE AGREEMENT UNENFORCEABLE.

 

Please do not insult my intelligence by stating its In the terms and conditions] which I signed and agreed to. That is unless you consider a contractual agreement is binding and the consumer credit act is not.

 

 

I require a final response as to either issue an N1 claim and allow me to enter a defence] or close down this account.

 

 

yours faithfully

xxxxx

[Catweazle69]

As I thought!

 

Thank you for your advice!

[postggj]

no probs

 

they have a problem understanding the english language

 

that letter is in clear english even a 2 year old can understand

 

keep me updated on the reply

[Catweazle69]

I have yesterday sent the letter as you advised by Rec Del. I also emailed it to them on Thurs evening.

 

I await there (if any) reply! - Im guessing they will have got the letter today or by Monday @ the latest.

 

One thing I cannot understand. Normally if you have a debt with someone the first port of call for the creditor is a court summons to the debtor so why are GoDebt going down this route? They,ve had 4-6 years to chase these people or is it because they know the YCC credit agreement is worthless and this Stat Demand Bankruptcy status scares alot of people? Also you would think the courts are now aware of this company and it should be law that before a stat demand is issued the person who is accused of owing money is allowed to defend themselves in court. Then only if they are found guilty of owing it and still refuse to pay should such a demand be issued.

 

Secondly it appears from reading of other peoples woes that a lot of cars (like mine) where returned for being faulty/rubbish/undriveable etc.

 

I dont know who it was who discovered the mis selling of PPI thus making the agreements null and void but I cannot help but wondering what would happen to everyone if this wasnt the case. How can a company be allowed to hound people like this?

 

If anybody can answer It would solve my curiosity and Im sure others.

 

In the meantime I will keep this thread updated with developements.

[postggj]

what you need to remember is yes car credit went under, only the parent company survived

 

direct auto finance

 

so the accounts were then sold off to godebt and marlin.

soon after they realised these agreements were no more than bog roll.

thats why they try and secure the debt by statutory demand as they know there would be no chance in court ref a ccj claim.

 

with reference the poor quality cars

 

most of these cars the likes of godebt/welcome/ucan/ etc, etc use are ex aution or fleet cars. thrashed to the limit.

 

buy them cheap, sell them high

 

and yes, legislation to stop this harrasment is there, only the oft are left wanting

[Catweazle69]

As I thought. Interesting!

 

Thanks for your quick confirmation of my thoughts. I await to see if (and how) they reply to your template letter.

[Catweazle69]

I have today (after posting the letter to them, emailing it last Thurs, then again yesterday as I had no reply) received an email from a Stuart Barns (@GoDebt) though the email was signed in the name of the clown who rang my mother (breaking the data protection act in the process by revealing the alleged debt amount etc) scaring the life outa here last week.

 

The email reply simply states - we acknowledge reciept of your email dated Mon 13th May (the 13th was last Thurs!!) and email today, the contents of which have been noted.

This matter has been escalated to a manager who will respond to you in the next 7 days!

 

The header was also changed from my initial one (that just had the agreement number in it) to FW - DIRECT AUTO FINANCIAL SERVICES, yes in bold instead.

 

I await there next communication!

[postggj]

the plot thickens

 

dont be surprised if you get a two line reply stating they believe the agreement is enforceable

 

but they will never take you to court

 

or they may just throw in the towell

 

they now know the word is out

[Catweazle69]

Has nobody ever taken this [problem] to Watchdog? - Obviously people who are aware of this site have taken your good advice but there are no doubt 100,s out there that are getting ripped off and stressed to breaking point.

 

A Stat Demand should not be allowed to be issued unless the proper channels (ie-taking the individual to court first) have been explored.

 

I personally would like to see this company highlighted nationally by Tv or a Newspaper and consequently obliterated from trading ever again!

[postggj]

it is an offence to pursue for a debt they know is unenforceable

 

fraud act i believe

 

the word is getting out though

 

they will never take you to court for the reasons given

 

thats why they go the statutory demand route

 

as with all dca

 

we keep getting them setaside and get cost all on the dca

 

its about time the oft started to wake up

 

mind you

 

1st credit aka connaught colections were put on probation due to the amount of stat demands they issued

[Catweazle69]

So basically by putting peoples down payments against PPI or Mech Breakdown or Gap insurance then adding a shortfall by way of credit then finally adding interest is where they failed eh? Sorry if I sound dumb, just curious and as Im studying consumer law its a very interesting case!

 

As I stated in an earlier post they left my PPI column (No10) blank then just added 11 & 12 together (whatever Gap Insurance is for God Only Knows) sub my down payment then added on a load of interest. So what that figure of £22.10 a month was for god oly knows. Very crafty.

 

Must say I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall when someone/somewhere realised the error of there ways..................!!!

[Catweazle69]

Well after sending my letter to them by email and recorded mail 7 days from last Monday (as promised) I today received a reply.

 

To me it appears to be stalling tactics as I quiet clearly stated take me to court or cancel the agreement.

 

I list below there laughable response on the issues raised.

 

Unenforcability - Amount Mis Stated

 

You will note from your agreement that you signed to both a conditional sale agreement and a credit agreement - one for the car and one for the insurance. Both clearly set out the balances due. I cannot see anywhere on the agreement where the amounts are incorrect

 

Agreement being non compliant

 

Please confirm why you think the agreement is not compliant. I would refer you to the terms of your agreement to which you signed and agreed to be bound.

 

Allocation of Deposit

 

I refer to section 7.3 of your agreement. Customer Declaration. where you confirmed that you paid the down payment in box 3.0 and the vehicle deposit in box 2.0 of page one of the agreement. Clearly you agreed to the allocation of your payment being against the insurance by ticking yes.

 

Prescribed Term Agreement

 

Your agreement was set for a period of 48 months and the instalements where calcuated on this basis. Please explain why you feel this agreement is unenforceable.

 

They then go on to offer a deduction of the insurance (£1161) but still want 3.5K!

 

This to me seems like a standard letter they have set up. The template letter clearly tells them to refer to the Consumer Credit Act yet this letter is asking me to explain to them again why I think its unenforceable. Right or Wrong?

 

I look forward to a quick response and your views.

[postggj]

expect nothing less from godebt

 

do not accept the reduction in ppi, its game over for you if you do

did they continue to demand money from you

 

so take me to court then

 

cretins

[postggj]

mind you

 

that letter i did is not rocket science but we are talking of a dca

[Catweazle69]

To true. They very kindly offered to take off the total insurance and asked me to pay 3.5k by June 2nd (how very kind of them)

 

Im admiting to nothing trust me. I think Im just going to send another letter asking them to AGAIN refer to the details within your template letter. The only reason Im doing that is to cover my own back should they send a stat demand. That way I can show the court there ignorance.

[postggj]

ime on a letter as we speak

 

i did say it would take at least two or three more letters

 

check back later on tonight

[Catweazle69]

You did indeed. Thanks and I look forward to your response.

[postggj]

catweazel69

xxx

xx

Godebt

Xx

Xx

 

Date Xxx

 

You’re Ref/account Number

 

i Do Not Acknowledge Any Debt To Your Company Or, Any Company You Claim To Represent.

Dear Sir/madam

 

Thank You For Your Letter Dated Xx/xx/xxxx In Reply To My Letter Dated Xx/xx/xxxx (copies Enclosed)

I Am Surprised By Your Response As My Original Letter Explained As To Why This Yes Car Agreement Is Unenforceable. It Is Down To The Alleged Creditor To Prove The Agreement Is Enforceable Not Myself So The Comments In Your Letter Are Irelevant.

 

My Letter Was Addressed To Your Complaints Department And As A Condition Of Your consumer Credit Licence, You Are Required To Give Me A Full And Final Response To My Complaint Giving Me The Option To Escalate To The financial Ombudsman Service.

 

Until This Happens You Are Prohibited From Demanding Money Or Enforcement Action.

 

I Reject Your Offer Of Taking Off The Payment Protection Insurance As The Agreement Is Null And Voiid.

 

Your Companies Actions Are Also In Violation Now On The Regulations Contained In

 

consumer Protection From Unfair Trading Regulations.

 

I Now Require A Final Response To My Complaint As Any Further Demand For Payment Or Enforcement Action Will Be Regarded As An Offence under The Addministration Of Justice Act 1970 And The Protection From Harrasment Act 1997.

 

A Report Will Then Be Sent To The office Of Fair Trading to Investigate Your Fitness To Hold A Consumer Credit Licence.

 

A Report Will Be Sent To The financial Ombudsman For An Indapendant Decision

 

A Report Will Be Sent To The Information Commissionairs Office For Breaches Under The Data Protection Act.

 

As Stated, I Am Giving Your Company Now 14 Days For Compliance From Receipt Before Enforcement Action Comences.

 

I Trust This Makes My Position clear And I Will Now Enter Into No Further Correspondants With Your Company

Edited May 24, 2010 by postggj

[postggj]

Send Recorded Delivery

[Catweazle69]

That is an absoloutley brilliant letter postggi.

 

Thank You. I will send it tomorrow and report back with (if any) responses from or indeed not from our friends in South Wales..............!

[postggj]

My Pleasure

[Catweazle69]

Got a response today. Standard rubbish saying they have noted my points but feel the debt is still enforceable and will be happy to accept an reduce amount. They state they consider the complaint closed (even though there accompanying leaflet gives two further options of complaint before passing it to the financial ombudsmen ie a senior mangers response and a MD response) They then went onto say they will now pass it back to one of their colections team who will be in touch.

 

There arrogance is beyond belief! - This morning I got one of the "Dalek" voice messages asking me to ring a London number immediately. I have since checked this number out and it appears others have recieved such a message. The assumption seems to be it is some form of Mickey Mouse solicitors.

 

Im not overly concerned but would apprciate your advice on my next move, if any.

 

Thanks.

[postggj]

Standard Rubbish

 

Ime Surprised It Not From A Compliance Manager

 

Can You Posty Up Or Pm Me This Telephone Number

[Catweazle69]

Sure its 0207 831 2161 - Irang it and some guy answers by saying "Can I Help You" I just then hung up.

 

If you google it is asscociated with Go Debt. It appears I only got half the message as others have it with the line "we arranging to send someone out etc etc before giving the number and requesting to call immediately.

 

It is laughable! - What do you reckon? Have you another fantastic letter up your sleeve or should I just go down there stated complaints route?