Ryanair Compensation Claim - Volcano Problem.

[Cityboy62]

Perplexity

 

My final words in this thread since you have chosen to start making personal remarks when, may I remind you, helping the OP is the main purpose of this site.

 

I have stated facts ref Ryanair (Irish co, effectively beyond UK law but possibly not beyond a concerted EU effort to drag them into court etc) and no, I don't work for Ryanair nor am I an apologist for airlines whatever you may like to believe! Far from it.

 

You can quote regulations 'til the cows come home but what I have tried to offer posters here is practical advice on the appropriate regulations that apply in this case where the OP has some chance of receiving redress. I shall continue to do so.

 

I don't believe I have lied to you, nor am I interested in betting (I only take on sure fire wins ) nor am I a criminal or idiotically ignorant as you claim as my posts on here, MSE and flightmole on this subject bear witness.

 

To the OP and others seeking assistance I shall continue to help. Rudeness and personal remarks should not be tolerated.

Edited April 23, 2010 by Cityboy62

[perplexity]

It would be especially interesting to see the result of a prosecution because of this offence specifically defined by The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations:

 

22. Falsely claiming or creating the impression that the trader is not acting for purposes relating to his trade, business, craft or profession, or falsely representing oneself as a consumer.

Edited April 23, 2010 by maroondevo52
Removed unsuitable comments

[maroondevo52]

perplexity,

 

I have unapproved your last post, can we please get back to helping the origional poster and refrain from personal insults.

 

Regards.

 

Scott.

[perplexity]

perplexity,

 

I have unapproved your last post, can we please get back to helping the origional poster and refrain from personal insults.

 

Regards.

 

Scott.

 

How then do you intend to help the original poster who has not posted again, since 19th April 2010, apparently persuaded that it is impossible to claim a further compensation while the Regulation states clearly enough that it is?

 

Are you happy with that?

 

Did you so much as bother to read the thread to see what this is about?

 

I thought not.

 

In the absence of the original poster my intention to is warn the rest of them, and shall continue to be so.

 

[maroondevo52]

perplexity,

 

I have re-approved your post, leaving the bit's that may help the origional poster and others, I've removed your personal insults, which help no one

 

Am I happy you seem to think the origional poster will not return, no can't say I am, but who knows.

 

Did I so much as bother to read the thread to see what it was about

Yes is the answer to that one.

 

Or do you also think I'm telling lies.

 

I hope you do continue to help other posters on this thread, but would prefer you did it without getting personal.

 

Regards.

 

Scott.

[perplexity]

Unfortunately, it impossible to prosecute an offence under the Unfair Trading Regulations unless a particular person is identified to send a summons to.

 

If you happen to have a better idea of how to identify, in the event of the suspicion that a trader posts to an internet Forum, masquerading as a consumer, none will better pleased by that than I, because of the fear that it is far too easily done and it happens too often.

 

[Mossycat]

From listening to the news today Ryanair have confirmed that they will conform to the EU regulations and pay reasonable accomodation and meals upon sight of receipts, so I think the answer is for anyone caught up in the fallout to send these in to them and state in writing as many details (cancelled flights etc) as possible to help them identify you.

 

I don't often agree with Ryanair but Michael O'Leary does have a valid point when he argues that his airline shouldn't be liable for these costs, which after all were brought in to protect passengers if the airline couldn't fly you home. The fact is that these regulations didn't specify circumstances or time limits, so the airlines have no alternative but to comply with them and then they in turn seek reimbursement from whoever they can point the finger of blame at.

 

Mossy

[perplexity]

For as far as I can tell Ryanair never did comply. The event that I refer to was in January, nothing to do the recent event. Passangers don't sleep on the hard seats in an Airport lobby because they prefer to, and that is the essential test of the Regulations, whether or not they work.

 

N.B.

 

There was no offer of anything more in the way of service - a phone call, hotel, alternative transport, drink, meal.

 

The idea of that sort of omission being a criminal offence is to ensure that it doesn't happen, which is failing, big time, so you need to be wondering why.

 

It is not just Ryanair that I am having a go at. It should not be so difficult for a regulatory body to wander along to an Airport to check if the legally required notices are in fact displayed.

 

[Mossycat]

For as far as I can tell Ryanair never did comply. The event that I refer to was in January, nothing to do the recent event. Passangers don't sleep on the hard seats in an Airport lobby because they prefer to, and that is the essential test of the Regulations, whether or not they work.

 

 

 

The thread was entitled Ryanair Compensation Claim - Volcano Problem, which is what I was responding to, if you have hijacked the thread to post about something else that's up to you, but don't assume people are replying to you rather than the OP

 

Mossy

[perplexity]

The thread was entitled Ryanair Compensation Claim - Volcano Problem, which is what I was responding to, if you have hijacked the thread to post about something else that's up to you, but don't assume people are replying to you rather than the OP

 

I am telling you what goes on, confirming that what has since been reported here is not so unusual.

 

If you'd rather be ignorant it might be better just to be so, instead of being so hurtfully ungrateful about it. I doubt that those who are now at a loss as to what their rights are will thank you for that, especially the OP.

 

If you'd read the thread you might have understood that the OP had already given up and gone!

 

 

P.S.

 

Sincerely concerned passengers, please also read, for instance, this previous thread I found:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/holiday-companies/30758-ryanair-cancelled-flight-no.html

 

I spent a few hours last night, googling about to gather information. There are dozens of similar instances to be found online and all to same effect: While (EC) No 261/2004 specifically states that the passengers concerned "shall be offered assistance", the experience reported by the passengers is always "no offer of help or information", or words to exactly the same effect.

 

What has happened on this occasion is then fairly obvious if you read between the lines. There was so much of a fuss about it that O'Leary realised that he was not going to get off so lightly this time around, so he makes the most of it by manipulating the media to make it look like the reimbursement (which is not a "compensation") is some sort of magnanimous gesture on the part of Ryanair.

 

Hopefully, when the EU decides to compensate Ryanair (as I expect they will) an appropriate investigation takes place to verify the truth of just how many of the passengers were reimbursed as a matter of fact, and which were not.

 

Crooks should be in jail, not running airlines.

 

Edited April 24, 2010 by perplexity
P.S.

[Codysowner]

I too have had the problems experienced by others on this forum. We had 2 flights cancelled when returning to Prestwick from Majorca. Due to work commitments and my son due to sit his exams this coming week we made the decision to find our own way home, which took us 54 long tortuorous hours, one flight, 18 hour bus journey, ferry crossing and 5 subsequent coach journeys before we reached home. I am in the process of preparing a compensation form against Ryanair but have had no luck in finding an address where i can post the claim form to, i've spent hours trawling through the net and Ryanair's website but have drawn a blank. Can anyone tell me what their address is or how they managed to file their claim against them?? Thanks in advance! Least we've learnt a valuable lesson - avoid Ryanair like the plague in future, saving a few pound just isn't worth the hassle!!

[slugo]

the address is now on there web site in the regulation pdf file as i,m in the same position as you having my flight canceled and rebooked to the 28th from the 17th also making my own way home. did you receive confirmation from ryanair when you canceled your later flight? as i,ve heard nothing and i have to add ryanair has been terrible to fly with under these conditions nobody at check in desk at airport no telephone number that was,nt shut off and also imposible to change flight online

Ryanair Compensation Department, Dublin Airport, Co. Dublin, Ireland.

Edited April 24, 2010 by slugo
address missed

[carlosbambino]

Really cant believe it but I got an email yday stating i have a refund coming for both my flights.

Honestly cannnot believe it after 3 days of constant ringing and getting nowhere

[maroondevo52]

Good to hear

[Codysowner]

Hi thanks for the address. In reply to your question we received no communication from Ryanair when our flights were cancelled. We were due to fly home on the 18th and the last flight they gave us was for the 29th, which was unacceptable so that's why we had to make our own way home. We asked at the desk each time for our accomodation and meals paid, also help with travel costs to the airport and was told they weren't liable. On returning home i realise they did have the 'Duty of Care' as quoted on the regulations. I can reiterate there was no information from them, their website gave basic advice about cancelled flights, we tried to phone and couldn't get through umpteen times. We also couldn't change our flight online since we'd already checked in online before leaving home for the original cancelled flight (which we were required to do by Ryanair before we left!) , hence why we had to travel to the airport each time our flight was cancelled to rebook another. In the end they gave us a flight to Barcelona (Girona) and we had to make our own way from there, spending nearly £1000 on bus fares and ferry. That's not including what we spent on paying additional hotel accomodation and food bills or taxi fares to airport which were 68 euros each way. 2 people were behind the check in desk when the queue was massive. We waited about 6 hours in total in that queue. Totally unacceptable, never ever again are we flying with them. Good luck in your journey home and thanks for the address.

[perplexity]

It's a criminal deception, isn't it?

 

It is one thing to argue about the display of a notice, whether or not "shall be offered" allows Ryanair to wriggle out by pretending that a passenger may eventually claim a refund, but it is quite another when a passenger asks for meals and the passenger is told in no uncertain terms that the carrier is not liable when the carrier is.

 

1(b) of Article 5 of the Regulations is clear about it; while the airline could argue that they are not liable for hotel bills if a passenger accepts a refund instead of re-routing, the passenger must still be offered the "meals and refreshments in a reasonable relation to the waiting time", as well as "free of charge two telephone calls, telex or fax messages, or e-mails".

 

Did that ever happen with Ryanair, on any occasion since the Regulations came to force, except that a canny passenger pushed them into it?

 

That is a serious question that I want to see investigated.

 

On the one hand, According to Ryanair:

 

"Where it is not feasible for Ryanair to arrange the care set out above, Ryanair will reimburse you for reasonable receipted expenses upon application to: Ryanair Compensation Department, Dublin Airport, Co. Dublin, Ireland."

On the other, I witnessed a Hotel proprietor with an empty Hotel to fill, canvassing stranded passengers while they waited in the queue to be re-routed, with the Airport staff taking no notice of the fact that this was happening, while the passengers resisted what they took to be nothing more than commercial opportunism.

 

[Joe Strummer]

Hi, we were stuck in portugal via Ryaniar, on the first day of the chaos I called my bank Natwest who covered us via the Advantage Gold policy they confirmed they would pay out on this and at that point I was assuming Ryanair would try and find a way to not pay out plus i had no webiste access ( i was on holiday ) and Ryanair didn't answer there phone. Now back and Natwest are saying all claims should be referred to Ryanair.

 

A couple of points, I wondered if anyone had a view? Ryainair is basically accommodation and food. Natwest covers travel, we had a hire car ( we were in a villa in the middle of no-where ) so should the Natwest policy pick that up along with petrol costs? Secondly do we HAVE to pursue Ryanair for the money or can we not claim of Natwest who admitted liability and gave us a claim number? i'd welcome any comments

[perplexity]

The The Regulation is quite specific about this:

 

Right of redress

In cases where an operating air carrier pays compensation or meets the other obligations incumbent on it under this Regulation, no provision of this Regulation may be interpreted as restricting its right to seek compensation from any person, including third parties, in accordance with the law applicable. ....

 

and this:

 

1. This Regulation shall apply without prejudice to a passenger's rights to further compensation. The compensation granted under this Regulation may be deducted from such compensation.

 

However, there is a difference between compensation and reimbursement. If you sent a copy of the same receipt to two different parties to claim the same cost, that would not be so clever. It would otherwise depend on the terms you agree to with NatWest, which I am not familiar with.

 

Edited April 26, 2010 by perplexity

[southamptoner]

My family and I had our flight back from Girona to Bournemouth cancelled twice and the second time they didnt even bother to tell us! It was a nightmare to try and get through to Ryanair by website and telephone. At the "Help" desk in the airport at Girona, they were either not there or there was a queue a mile long with (understandably) irate customers. We had to hire our car again for a week, obviously keep our kids amused for a further week, pay for food, diesel etc. We were lucky enough after an extra weeks stay in Spain to be collected by my father-in-law who drove our car after taking the ferry to France and drove 15 hours to collect us. What a relief. I understand we can not claim diddly squat from our insurance company but we can try under "delay" as they deal with claims case by case. Ryanair have also not been very accommodating to say the least I am trying to contact them at the moment as I understand there is a glimmer of hope that they may pay for some of our extra accommodation and food. Is this correct? If so what's the right way of going about it?

Edited April 27, 2010 by southamptoner
read other reviews

[perplexity]

Please read the thread.

 

Unfortunately, Ryanair would not yet appear to have seen fit to respond to the forum to account for their practice as such.

 

However, if the postings from Cityboy62 toward the start of this thread were rather to be understood as an indirect representation of what is to expected from Ryanair, that would possibly not be so far from the truth of it.

 

The problem is then that the right way to go about it is certainly not the way that Ryanair went about. Did you give up on waiting to be seen at Girona Airport, or did you queue for long enough to be offered a refund or re-routing?

 

[Joe Strummer]

We are sending all paperwork to the Dublin address, registered post. We were stuck in Portugal for one week we are claiming the cost of the villa for a week ( a third of the cost of staying in a hotel ) and a hot restaurant meal a day ( we went to the superrmarket for other meals as we could prepare cold meals at the villa), I belive we could claim upto 3 meals a day plus accommodation so I would hope that Ryanair will see reason.

We are talking to our other insurer about what we can claim on the extra weeks car rental and petrol but they have now said we talk to the airline first despite admitting liability. God knows how long this will take to resolve.

 

My concern is how the hell do you chase Ryanair they never ever answer the phone do they!

[perplexity]

The problem with chasing Ryanair would be pretty much the same as an attempt to win the London Marathon. You are not the only one, and they treat it as a sport, not a charity.

 

[everhopefull]

I have just joined this forum. Re 'Perplexity's comment, if enough people make a fuss, Ryanair are surely more likely to be reasonable.

 

Re the queries about insurance, speaking as a retired insurance broker, your policy covers what it says it covers, so read it. If it doesn't cover your loss, you can always ask the insurer to be generous and pay anyway but they may well say No.

 

My own losses amount to £1000, all incurred BEFORE Ryanair said they would pay anything. Rather than wait a week for the next Ryanair flight back from Malta (which might have been cancelled if the ban on flights had been reimposed) we flew back to UK with another airline as soon as the skies were open again.

 

Like Joe Strummer, I have sent all details and copy receipts to Ryanair in Dublin but don't expect a reply yet as they are probably inundated.

[perplexity]

My point would rather be that it's a fuss in the wrong direction, to pick a fight with Ryanair.

 

We already knew what they are like and it is arguably not the fault of an airline if the passengers never bothered to read the EU Regulation, in advance of the event, or since.

 

It disturbs me more to wonder what goes on with the authorities who were supposed to enforce the Regulation, to ensure that this would not be happening to start with. Ryanair's breaches are clear cut, indisputable. In the event of a criminal prosecution there would be no defence to the charge of misleading consumers, in view of specific requirements that fail to happen.

 

Why then is O'Leary so blissfully unafraid of the possibility? Because of what is it "futile" to prosecute? It reeks of corruption.

 

[edno99]

Seems like my original post has sparked some serious discussions around this matter and I hope they have helped the many people affected by this situation. I have enjoyed greatly the responses from you all - apart from some personal attacks made... there's no need, we're just trying to get what we're entitled too, not use these forums as a means to attack those trying to offer that help!

In light of the discussions taking place here and on other forums, I am now in the process of collating receipts for hotels, trains, food, ferries, coaches etc. etc. incurred as a result of trying to get home and will be sending this to Ryanair's compensation department shortly. However, in my orioginal post I stated that I had applied for compensation at the airport on being told that my flight was cancelled. 2 weeks later and no sign of this.... how long does ryanair have before they are supposed to have given me this £99 back?