Disputing charges on leaving tenancy

[steve806]

Hi All

 

Any advice on this problem appreciated.

 

I was made redundant 4 months ago just after signing a new tenancy agreement for a year.

 

Like lots of others it has been a challenge getting a new job but today I have received an offer of a new job. However, the job is 200 miles away from where we currently live.

 

We would like to end our tenancy early so that me and my family (wife + 2 boys) can move to where my new job is as quickly as possible as:

 

1. We dont want to break our family up for 8 months until the tenancy ends

2. We cant really afford to pay for somewhere for me to live during the week and pay the rent on our house as well.

 

I have searched through our tenancy agreement and cannot find any reference to ending the tenancy. Their is a list of reasons the landlord can end it but nothing about the tenant.

 

All I can find in the agreement is the dates the tenancy is for.

 

Please realise my intention is not to stiff our landlord (house is through a letting agency and we have kept it in great condition and paid every months rent for the last 4 years on time), we are just in unfortunate circumstances.

 

Can anyone offer any advice on what we could do to try and get out of the tenancy early?

 

kindest regards

 

Steve

[Aequitas]

A contract is a contract. The landlord is under no obligation to release you from it any more than you are under an obligation to release the landlord. Accordingly, the matter has to proceed by negotiation. The landlord is in the driving seat. He can decline to negotiate. If he sets terms for you to be released it is up to you whether or not to accept them. However, you must make sure you negotiate a clean break, and not enter into an arrangement where you continue to pay rent until a new tenant is found.

[steve806]

Hi All

 

Apologies if this is long winded but I would appreciate any advice.

 

My family have been living in a rented house (through agent) for 4+ years.

 

Rent has always been paid on time, house kept clean and no major damage made to property.

 

8 months ago I was made redundant and after 4 months out of work (during which we still paid the rent on time every month) I found another job 200 miles away from where we live so had to live away from home for 4 months.

 

After serving 3 month probation period my job was confirmed and as we were keen to put family back together (have partner and 2 boys) we began looking for a property to rent close to new job and found a property we expected to move into on 4/1/10

 

On 1st December 2009 gave 30 days written notice to letting agents of current property and 2 days later received a telephone call from them advising that I did not have a break clause and as a consequence some fees would be applied. Told agent I understood this and would expect table of charges soon.

 

As of morning of 23/12 we did not receive any correspondence from letting agent. On this day we discovered there would be a delay in our new house being ready and we would not be able to move in until at least 18/1/10.

 

As we believed this would leave us homeless from 1/1/10 and we would therefore have to store our furniture for 2 weeks and live with my partners mother for a shortwhile I telephoned agents of our current property to request that I extend my notice for a further month and leave the property on 31/1/10 as this would have been the easiest option.

 

The agents were very quick to agree to this as it transpired they had forgotten to inform the landlords of our original termination request and had not proceeded with any aspect of the early termination.

 

As we will be staying in the house a further month I have already paid the rent for the month of January 2010.

 

The advice I require is around the fees and ongoing rent.

 

The agent has today e-mailed a request that I pay them 3 weeks rent plus £220 fees to cover their costs in remarketing the property and reminding me that I will continue to be liable for the rent until a new tenant is found. They have stated that they will not commence until I have paid this sum.

 

Given that the letting agent should have begun marketing the property 4 weeks ago and did not do anything until my call of 23/12 reminded them that I had in fact requested early termination can anyone advise if I should still be liable for these fees as the letting agents failure has meant that 4 weeks of potential marketing of the house have been lost due to their incompetence and this could lead to me paying additional rent until the property is relet.

 

FYI my tenancy agreement runs out on 4/4/2010.

 

Any thought or advice would be welcome.

 

kind regards

 

Steve

[Steve__M]

Difficult one, because if they had found a tenant ready to move in in January, then you would be in a tricky position. Also you need them to market the property to remove your responsibility for the rent, so you need them on your side.

 

As your tenancy is ending only 2 months early, they should only be asking for a proportion of their charges for remarketing the property as they would have had to market it in a month or so anyway. 3 weeks rent plus £220 sounds a bit steep.

 

Are you able to talk to your landlord as it may be that they are charging him as well.

[Guest Blessy]

Have you got a copy of your shorthold tenancy agreement? I'm a landlord and I know my previous tenants have NEVER had to pay for marketing the property when they have left early. Have you actually signed anything that states you will be liable for marketing costs?

 

Even if you have it seems a steep charge to me - after all 'marketing' is probably onl lineage in the local paper!

 

Read through your agreement. The agent should have given you a copy after every signing and renewal.

[foolishgirl]

Read your lease Steve. If it's a 'standard' AST, the only sum you should be liable for is the rent to the end of the agreement. Also, if the LL lets the property between the date you move & the date the agreement ends, you should also be entitled to a reduction on the rental due.

 

However be aware that you MUST give notice in writing & at the correct time - again, check your lease. It's usually 1 calendar month calculated from your rental due date so make sure you send it to the agent by Rec. Del. in plenty of time.

 

If you are getting the runaround from the agent, try & contact the LL direct - the address will be on your agreement.

[steve806]

Hi All

 

Any advice or feedback greatly received.

 

I recently terminated my lease early. My lease was due to finish 30th April 2010 (thought I have e-mail amending this date to 3rd April which agents now say was an error) but I left the property on 29th January 2010. I paid the rent up to 3rd April when I left property.

 

In March agents advised me they had a new tenant who wished to move in on 4th April and requested that I therefore check out by 31st March. Throughout March I received numerous telephone calls urging me to check out by 31st march so accordingly I organised to ensure house was clean and check out by this date. Now agent is trying to charge me additional rent until end of April and is now saying new tenant will be moving in on 1st may. Surely they cannot have it both ways - urge me to sign the house over to them and them try to charge me additional rent?

 

We had lived in house for 5 years and having 2 children and cats carpets were not in best condition. Before leaving agents advised me that landlords would be having house recarpeted prior to new tenants moving in and I offered that instead of paying for professional carpet cleaning prior to check out (as stipulated in agreement) I would contribut £200 towards purchase of new carpets. Landlord initially agreed to this and then a few days later changed their minds and asked us to have carpets cleaned.

 

After checking out I have now received schedule of fees for repairs etc and they are charging me £415 towards new carpets. Both my local agents and the check out man advised that 5 years was a reasonable time frame to replace carpets from a tenancy with 2 childrens and pets (carpets were budget - not good quality). Any comments on whether this charge is reasonable?

 

Also, after 5 years in the property the curtains were no longer of good standard (were cheap to begin with) and as a consequence most were thrown away and replaced with curtains we purchased ourselves. The agent has now tried to charge us £150 for new curtains. Surely after 5 years they would be due replacing anyway? Comments please.

 

Finally, I have accepted that the kitchen would require further cleaning - in reality some dust forming due to house being empty for 2 months, and have disputed that ensuite and bathroom require further cleaning - again dust, and the agent has suggested a charge of £250 to complete this work. Even at £10 an hour this would be 25 hours worth of cleaning which seems excessive. FYI all other rooms were classified as clean. Does this amount seem excessive?

 

Any advice, feedback or recommendations on next steps would be gratefully accepted.

 

kind regards

 

Steve

[steve806]

Hi All

 

My tenancy was due to end on 29th April 2010. In september last year I requested to change the date I paid rent each month due to a change of job.

 

The landlord agreed to this and the agent sent me an e-mail confirming the payment date had changed and as a result of this change my tenancy end date would change to 3rd April 2010 and as a consequence all my planning has been aimed towards this date.

 

In January this year I requested to end the tenancy early as I had moved to another part of the country for work whilst my family stayed in the house but we could not face being apart any longer. I paid the rent up to the new end date of 3rd April and moved out of the house at the end of January.

 

Last weeks the agents have sent me an invoice saying they want rent for the period 4th to 29th April. I have responded advising them of the change made last September and when asked to prove this I have sent them back their e-mail.

 

They have responded by saying that it was written by a new girl in the office who got it wrong and that it was a mistake to tell me the end date had changed to 3rd April and it should have been another date (not specified) and therefore I still owe them the money.

 

Can they really do this? Surely their e-mail constitutes a legal change to my tenancy agreement? I cannot be held responsible for their error can I?

 

Any advice gratefully received.

 

kind regards

 

Steve

[Planner]

You where advised incorrectly. There is no reason why a change in rent payment dates should change the tenancy period HOWEVER you where nevertheless told, in writing, that this was the case. Agents mistake, you dont owe this money in my opinnion. The landlord will need to claim any loss resulting from this from the agents.

 

This doesnt mean they wont try and grab this from your deposit.

Edited April 13, 2010 by Planner

[Steve__M]

Was your deposit protected. If you signed a new contract since 1st April 2007 then it may be that it should have been.

 

Is there a check-in inventory listing condition of the house. Was a checkout done?

 

I guess for the rent, did you come to a clear early agreement with the agent that you'd move out by 31st March? The way you put it it sounds like they were badgering you as though they were not sure that you would move out.

 

Is £415 the total amount for carpets, or a share of the cost? I'd have thought that at most you'd pay 10-20% of the cost - an agent I used suggested that carpets would have a nominal life of 6-7 years.

 

The curtains are a difficult issue. I have some 5 year old curtains that were originally cheap which are still in good condition! Possibly you should not have thrown them away without permission. Did you leave the new curtains you purchased in the house?

 

With the cleaning, it may be that agents think that it is more than just dust and that a deep clean is in order. Evidence from the inventories would be useful.

[steve806]

Thanks for the kind response Steve.

 

My deposit is protected. A check out was done but all I signed for was agreeing the kitchen and bathrooms required further cleaning and that the carpets were marked (with a note that the landlord was going to recarpet). 2 days later I was sent a schedule of dilapidations showing the things I am disputing.

 

We did agree with agent that we would move out by 31st March 2010. In fact we moved out on 29th January and moved 200 hundred miles away. We only returned in March to prepare the house for check out.THere was some confusion between the agents local branch and their central lettings department. The local branch asked me for a check out date and I gave then 31st March but they did not pass this information to the central team who kept badgering me for a date - I must have told them 4 or 5 times I had arranged date with local office. Also, we did notify the agent at the begining of December 2009 that we wanted to end the tenancy early, but discovered they did not act on this request and market the house until January 2010. When I questioned this they said my request had 'fallen through the cracks'. My view is that this meant they lost a month of marketing through their incompetence. Does that sound reasonable?

 

Furthermore, in September last year I requested to change the rent payment date due to a change in job and the agent advised me in writing that this would change my tenancy end date to 3rd April. They are now backtracking on this by saying a girl in their office made a mistake and this information is not correct. We have planned towards 3rd April based on this information and I would of thought the e-mail constitutes a legally binding change to my terms?

 

 

The carpet cost is a share, but what bothers me is that I already offered £200 toward new carpets as the agent advised the landlord would be replacing them but this was declined so we spent £210 having the carpets professionally cleaned. I dont deny the carpets were not in the greatest state but we had a tenancy for 5 years with 2 children under 10 and 2 cats and both the agents and the inventory company both suggested to me that in those circumstances 5 years was a reasonable time to replace. It is the landlord who is insisting I pay towards new carpets. The carpets were budget carpets - I have seen them on sale in carpet world for less than £10 a square metre so even at 10% that would suggest £4200 for new carpets which is replaced with comparable seems really high

 

The cleaning they have specified is the kitchen, bathroom and ensuite and they checked out stated 'further cleaning'. I have benchmarked clean costs for local firms and they average cost is £7-8 an hour. Based on their request for £250 that would suggest up to 31 hours of cleaning for 3 rooms. Does that not seem high even if it was a deep clean?

 

We did leave the new curtains in the house.

 

Any further comments gratefully received.

[Aequitas]

Irrespective of whether the email was effective to change the terms of the tenancy I think you can rely on it. The fact that it was sent by a new girl is irrelevant.

[steve806]

Hi All

 

I am in the middle of a dispute regarding return of deposit and a response received from the landlord via the agent this morning has caused me great concern.

 

We are having a disagreement over fair wear and tear on curtains and the landlord has said they believe the curtains have been damaged by my wife tying them up when open. The landlord says they have noticed this many times when driving past the house. Now, the landlord lives abroad and returns to the country a few times a year. He has no reason to drive anywhere near the property and his statement seems to suggest they have been spying on the property when in the country and opens up concerns that he may have done more than look in the windows.

 

I cannot prove that they have been in the house when we were absent but my wife in particular is now feeling violated at the thought that it is possible the landlord has been in the house. Our tenancy agreement stated that it was a managed property (by the agent) and that the landlord needed to request in writing if they wanted to visit the property. They never did this in the 5 years we rented the house but now we are concerned that they never did because instead they just chose to enter when we were not in.

 

Are we overreacting and if not is there anything we could do about this given that we have no other proof than the landlord saying he had driven past.

 

Any thoughts or advice would be gratefully received

 

kind regards

 

Steve

[doompixie]

Might just be my perspective but it sounds like they are just making excuses to not return your deposit. I doubt you can get a reasonable look at minor curtain wear from driving past a house

 

They're not allowed to enter without your permission, however some will but I'm not sure if anything can be done if you're not still living there. I don't know what you'd hope to achieve by bothering them after you've left? I'd focus more on the deposit issue.

 

If you are still living in the property then perhaps you can get a new lock fitted (don't damage anything and replace the original when you leave) or a chain, if its really necessary. Its potentially not at this point if you're leaving as they may just try and claim extra damage.

[Planner]

Yes, you are over reacting. If you had a £150,000 asset would you not drive past occasionaly when you returned from abroad?

 

The question concerning the curtains is easy - are they damage from being tied up when open if so then it isnt fair wear and tear IF NOT then what is wrong with the curtains and has it simply been caused by use, age or an inherant defect?

 

 

EDIT - Gosh, I see from your other two posts your having lots of problems, curtains would be the least of my worries!!

Edited April 13, 2010 by Planner

[Steve__M]

You need to look into how you raise a dispute with the deposit protection scheme if agent is not prepared to accept your case. Just a few more thoughts.

 

It sounds like you can construct a good case around the email changing the date to 3rd April plus the communication you have, to argue that the end date was indeed 3rd April. Any evidence of their incompetence is useful to help prove that they are wrong and you are right.

 

For the carpets, find out what proportion of the cost they are asking for. You can either argue that you should pay a lower proportion, or that the quotes are "betterment" ie. replacing cheap carpets with better carpets at your cost. Get a written quote from the carpet shop.

 

Cleaning costs are tricky because basically the agent will get in the company they usually use who will charge an inflated price, and it may be hard to argue with them. Insist on getting a copy of the invoice. Check with the companies you spoke to to see whether their costs would include things like deep cleaning of ovens, extractor fans and so forth.

[Aequitas]

You have unfortunately fallen into the trap that many fall into and that is that you failed to get the whole thing properly documented.

 

On the facts as you set them out it seems as if an early surrender was agreed and that now that it has not turned out as the agents expected they do indeed want to have it both ways. Do you have anything at all in writing?