MadKit v Welcome Finance Secured Loan

[MadKit]

Welcome Finance need no introduction or description from me that hasn't been said eloquently and with feeling more than once. Here are the details:

Original loan amount - £25,000 (now owing £32,000), paid off over £12,000

PPI close to £6,000 (lump sum amount) Interest rate 34% (very difficult to find on the copy along with most of the other details)

More info:

- the "agreement" is illegible, some areas of the page are not legible at all

- they have very aggressively pursued this debt and took well over a year to supply info but now I have it all

- the PPI form is new to me, never saw it before and didn't sign as can be clearly seen by an attempt to cut and paste a signature from what I assume is one of my letters (you can see the outline of where this has been stuck on and it is skew)

What I wanted to know is this:

If I go after them for refund of PPI and charges, I assume they will pay themselves this as there are arrears. Am I acknowledging that there is a valid CCA if I go after the PPI and the charges that have been heaped on?

I desperately need to re-mortage my house prior to selling it, will Welcome be able to take the full amount they say is owing (all of the arrears are interest and massive amounts of charges) even though the PPI and charges are massively inflating this?

MadKit

[beyondhope]

my understanding is PPI is paid by cheque or can at least be requested in the form of a cheque as it is money you have not been given the use of..im sure someone will come along who can help abit more

[beyondhope]

I would also say the cca issue would be a seperate issue to ppi and charges

[MadKit]

Just a quick question. I had a so called reputable consumer credit advisor who took my money and did absolutely nothing to help but put me further in debt (long story). The key point here is, she still has all my paperwork and refuses to send it back and ignores every call and email I've sent asking her to do this. This has been going on for 10 months. In the meantime, I can't chase Welcome Finance as I should be because she has all the SAR docs. Question here is, can I ask again for SAR? I don't mind sending another £10 but are they under any obligation to send me this again? And as an equally disturbing problem, how do I force this advisor to return my documents?

 

MadKit

[dadofholly]

Just a quick question. I had a so called reputable consumer credit advisor who took my money and did absolutely nothing to help but put me further in debt (long story). The key point here is, she still has all my paperwork and refuses to send it back and ignores every call and email I've sent asking her to do this. This has been going on for 10 months. In the meantime, I can't chase Welcome Finance as I should be because she has all the SAR docs. Question here is, can I ask again for SAR? I don't mind sending another £10 but are they under any obligation to send me this again? And as an equally disturbing problem, how do I force this advisor to return my documents?

 

MadKit

 

Have you sent an SAR to the advisor or just to welcome?

[MadKit]

I originally sent an SAR request to Welcome and they supplied me with the data which included an illegible agreement, a forged PPI form etc. I sent all of this to my advisor who has not returned it. My question was, can I send WELCOME another SAR request or will they reply they have already fulfilled this obligation and I will be wasting £10 or under the original request, can I ask for another copy of my data? Are you suggesting I should the advisor an SAR request?

 

MadKit

[dadofholly]

Sorry i dont think i correctley understood your needs when i first read your thread.

 

There appears to be two issues so will deal with each in turn.

 

The SAR to Welcome - As far as i am aware there is nothing to stop you again submitting an SAR request to Welcome, but it will cost you £10 again as they have already complied once.

 

The Consumer Credit Advisor - Personaly i would SAR them - two reasons

First - they already have the stuff you require from Welcome.

Second - they may have additional info within their paperwork.

 

Only problem i see is getting the Advisor to comply - though you can force them too via the courts - and i can help supply you with letter templates should they fail to comply - but could take time.

 

Welcome on other hand may be quicker.

 

Swings and roundabouts - but either way it is probably going to cost another tenner.

[dadofholly]

As for the dodgy signature on your PPI - they have form in this area.

 

I will pm someone who may be able to advise you more on that one.

[MadKit]

Update - I heard from one of those PPI we'll get it back for you companies (no am not having anything to do with them) that Welcome Finance are to be liquidated in January. Now I think this may have been a bit of scaremongering but if I want to reclaim the PPI, I will have to move quickly anyway. So, I'm sending off both letters today with £10 postal orders to former FA and Welcome. It will be interesting to see what happens with both. I just wonder what I can do about the clearly cut and paste signature on the PPI application.

 

Kit

[dadofholly]

Update - I heard from one of those PPI we'll get it back for you companies (no am not having anything to do with them) that Welcome Finance are to be liquidated in January. Now I think this may have been a bit of scaremongering but if I want to reclaim the PPI, I will have to move quickly anyway. So, I'm sending off both letters today with £10 postal orders to former FA and Welcome. It will be interesting to see what happens with both. I just wonder what I can do about the clearly cut and paste signature on the PPI application.

 

Kit

 

With the cut and paste signature - have you been able to match it up to the document they have copied it from?

 

Also dont worry if Welcome go belly up in Jan as the fscs will pick up any claims remaining.

[Dustyd]

Hi Kit,

 

I am due in court this Thursday (16th Dec) for the exact same thing, a forged signature on PPI and the reclaiming of the PPI with interest.

 

They have never offered me in anything other than WFS heaviliy weighted terms i.e my account, which is in dispute becuase of this would be no where near paid off by what was their illegal actions in the first place.

 

The interesting thing is I had a pre-written out agreement given to me when I went to sign for the loan, and after a fair bit of argy bargy with the branch manager he finally agreed to take the PPI out. Interesting however I took away with me the original PPI agreements so it couldn't be put it through. Guess what, they forged one and put it on their systems, and now I have their solicitors bundle it's clear (as I have the original) that something naughty has gone on. I have even employed an indepent handwriting analyst to prove it's not my signature and in fact the PPI agreement is even dated 3 days different from the actual loan agreement in a totally different format!

 

Wish me well for Thursday, I'll let you know how I get on.

 

Dusty

[MadKit]

Dusty

 

I wish you everything of the best and wish I could be there to see their faces, if they even turn up. The signature they have stuck on the PPI is so clearly a copy of my signature it has the box around it and is skew and I have never seen the document before. I am also being given the run around by them so will be starting a court claim as soon as I have either my documents back from ex-customer credit advisor or the 40 days are up on the second DSAR request I am sending tomorrow. The key issue around my alleged agreement with them is also that the agreement is so illegible, it is impossible to read and some of the figures have been over written in order to try and make them legible.

 

You go Dusty and I'll be waiting to hear from you.

 

Kit

[Dustyd]

I'd get a court case going ASAP, as it's took me best part of 18 months to get this to trial.

 

They will be turning up BTW as they are using Cleggs Solicitors who are based in the same business park as them in Nottingham. Interesting Cleggs have had some success in defending PPI claims gauged by their case studies on their website, although a different dating of agreements, handwriting experts report and me holding the original copies of the PPI agreements hopefully will mean a success.

 

Good luck,

 

Dusty

[dadofholly]

Good luck Dusty - let us know how you get on.

[Dustyd]

Well I won my case for misselling of PPI, but not for the fraud which would have meant compounded interest that I was after for £7500, although when the cheque comes through for £3500 it will be the end of an episode for me.

 

They did try to bully me pre-court in the morning by their barrister handing me a schedule of their costs if they won of £4000!. I told him I had nothing to lose as I felt mt evidence was conclusive.

 

Problem is, Welcome as it appears cannot provide any original agreements (despite their solicitors being a stones throw from their offices in Nottingham), and their barrister confirmed this under oath, so therefore in not providing originals the judge cast doubt whether fraud had taken place - futhermore their barrister was quoting all sorts of legal precedents where if fraud wasn't involved the compounded interest has never been awarded as damages quite early on in the proceedings. Interesting also they called no witnesses despite my serious allegations against certain people at WF, probably as they don't work there any more maybe.

 

So goodbye Welcome, and I wish all of you battling with them the very best in dealing with them, and if you need any more details PM me. One thing I will say however, is in not being able to provide original agreements when being claimed as having disputed signatures, if this was known by me they they were not going to produce these in court maybe I could have taken a different tact from the beginning, who knows. I represented myself BTW, so had no legal opinion on this.

[dadofholly]

Well Done Dusty Thats great news.

 

With the fraud was it in relation to commission payments or them making up signatures on your PPI?

 

But well done once again.

[Dustyd]

Well Done Dusty Thats great news.

 

With the fraud was it in relation to commission payments or them making up signatures on your PPI?

 

But well done once again.

 

Hi dadofholly

 

I've PM'd you so as not to share too sensative info

[dadofholly]

Hi dadofholly

 

I've PM'd you so as not to share too sensative info

 

Thanks just got it - will fill you in with details this evening when i get a bit of time.

[MadKit]

Well done Dusty! I feel all fired up to tackle Welcome Finance now. I have a number of issues to take them to court on and as the signature on the PPI is clearly forged, the agreement is illegible and the PPI has not been refunded, I have a lot to tackle. Any help on this would be greatly appreciated as I want to make sure when I submit the claim details, I get it right. I need to do this as soon as possible, would like to get this in today or tomorrow (online) so I can get this in the system.

 

MadKit

[MadKit]

So Welcome Finance claims are being taken over?

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-12624895

 

And - The FSCS said Welcome Finance, part of the Cattles group, was effectively insolvent.

 

Where does that leave me with a secured loan? How much money can they take when I sell my house (Welcome really pumped up what was owing so it was way more than I originally borrowed and paid off) ?

 

MadKit - now even madder!

[MadKit]

Update

 

I sent a copy of my PPI refund letter to FSCS and received nothing but yet another letter from Welcome Finance in response to my "complaint" and saying they don't agree. If they are out of business, they are certainly still employing the snotty people who make this company a nightmare to deal with. I have drafted the last letter I will be sending to WF and FSCS regarding the PPI which with charges now tops £24,000. I also finally received the statement of account. Seems I paid off more than £17,000 of the £20,000 and now owe £32,000 plus!

 

I have read through all the threads and it seems monthly interest is 1.35% and APR 20.51% - even without a calculator (dual or otherwise) that makes no sense at all. One thing I can just about read near the interest -

in calculating the APR no account has been taken of any variation in the rate of interest. We may vary the rate of interest by giving you not less than 14 days written notice at any time to reflect any change in market conditions.

What does that mean?

 

I have scanned in the agreement (mostly illegible) so small print is unreadable but figures are just about. I noticed that my signature has been initialled (not by me) but with my initials and clearly not my writing. As mentioned before, my signature has been cut and pasted on a PPI document that I had never seen before as well.

 

Add to all of this, the Acceptance Fee and Mortgage Indemnity Fee (??) have been added to the credit which I believe is unlawful?

 

Obviously WF and/or FSCS are not going to do anything about this and haven't even bothered to respond to the numerous letters. I am willing to post up the agreement which has the personal information blocked and would like advice on what to do next. I think I have a very strong case for taking this to court and more than happy to do that.

 

MadKit

[MadKit]

Bump - mainly for everyone out there who is fighting Welcome.

 

On 2 March 2011 the FSCS declared WFSL in default. This is because the firm is unable, or likely to be unable, to pay claims against it in relation to PPI. WFSL sold a substantial number of PPI policies to its customers, and a declaration of default opens the way for those customers, and any others who might have valid claims against the firm that are protected by the FSCS, to make a claim.

 

The FSCS will now be responsible for PPI claims against WFSL. To assist in its handling of claims, the FSCS has arranged to use WFSL's claims handling resources. However, the FSCS will remain responsible for all decisions on claims, which will be made in accordance with FSCS rules, and will closely oversee and monitor all steps in the handling of claims. This arrangement will enable claims to be processed more quickly and efficiently.

 

Looking further on the FSCS website, they seem to me to be moonlighting as a claims company, see below:

 

The rules under which the FSCS operates set out the basis on which we are required to calculate compensation, and this differs from the basis used by firms. Our rules are contained in the FSA handbook.

 

Under the FSCS rules claimants will be entitled to 90% of the value of their claim. Amounts of compensation payable will be first set off against any outstanding loan balances you may owe to WFSL, which could mean that we will not send you your compensation.

 

So they keep 10% and if you owe money, you won't get any PPI return? I thought this was a given because the PPI was unlawfully applied, that money belongs to us. Also, they then claim the money back from WFS so they do have the money? Seems like the only way to get back the PPI, plus interest and I mean all of it, we have to take them to court, is this right?

 

Madder and madder

MadKit

[dadofholly]

Sort of right. - the fscs do not claim any money back from welcome though. And they do use any money you are owed to pay off any outstanding balance with Welcome.

[MadKit]

Hi dadofholly, this also on their website:

 

The firm’s restructuring provides for the FSCS to receive payments from WFSL to cover the costs of compensating PPI claims in respect of policies sold on or after 14 January 2005.

 

AND they say any claims before this date will be dealt with directly by WFS.

 

MadKit

[dadofholly]

Yes this is their running costs - the fscs was set up to compensate consumers in such circumstances - it is better they charge them than you.

 

As for the rules re:2005 etc. - the rules are set by the FSA, not the FSCS.

 

Is your Policy pre-2005?