Used Wrong Oyster Card - Lost Appeal too.

[pugilist]

Good morning everyone!

 

What have happened to me today on the train is described below in the text of the appeal I have already sent from here: Independent Revenue Collection and Support™

 

My question is: do you think they will refund me the penalty fare that I have paid or not?

 

 

Dear Sirs,

 

A terrible mistake happened today.

The day before yesterday, on Sunday, I topped up my oyster card for a weekly ticket for zones 1-3 starting from monday 22/02/2010. The situation is as follows: today, 23/02/2010, I took a wrong oyster card to travel from Maryland to Manopark. That was my room mate's oyster card, I took it by mistake and found myself in a shamefull situation when the card was checked on the train and it turned out that it was not my card and there were only 80 pence balance on it... The collector wrote down in pen on the notice that the wrong oyster card number is 0xxxxxxxxx x4. I want you to know that the number of my valid oyster card, which I left at home by mistake, is 0xxxxxxxxx x8 I want to stress that it is very stressfull for me as on Sunday I already spent £30.20 to top up a week's travel card and today I paid 20 pounds charge. I'd like to ask you to please refund me the 20 pounds because in fact I have a valid oyster card, but couldn't have provided it today because of that mistake of mine. Thank you very much. I would be very obliged if you respond to me as soon as possible and we could sort out this awful ambiguity.

 

 

 

 

I don't know what to expect. Please tell me your vision of situation. Is there any chance for a successefull refund or there are no grounds for it at all?

 

Any comments would be appreciated.

[Signaller]

Pugilist,

as I am an ex passenger guard (conductor) I can answer this.When using public transport you must be in posession of valid authority to travel.In your case you were, but as you say, it wasn't yours as you'd mistakenly picked the wrong one up.You were in posession of someone elses card, but unfortunately this does not allow you to travel, only your friend.This probably isn't what you wanted to hear though.You weren't in posession of your authority to travel (your card), so you're not entitled to a refund.The company may refund you as a gesture of goodwill, but they are not under any obligation to do so.Sorry this isn't what you want to hear.

Regards

Signaller

[pugilist]

Pugilist,

as I am an ex passenger guard (conductor) I can answer this.When using public transport you must be in posession of valid authority to travel.In your case you were, but as you say, it wasn't yours as you'd mistakenly picked the wrong one up.You were in posession of someone elses card, but unfortunately this does not allow you to travel, only your friend.This probably isn't what you wanted to hear though.You weren't in posession of your authority to travel (your card), so you're not entitled to a refund.The company may refund you as a gesture of goodwill, but they are not under any obligation to do so.Sorry this isn't what you want to hear.

Regards

Signaller

 

Thank you for the reply.

 

I had no illusions before I decided to post my question. Your answer is very reasonable and is just what I expected to here.

So, as far as I understand, I still have a chance for refund as a gesture of goodwill from the company.

Iven if they won't I would not have any grudge against them as I understand that they are not under any obligation to refund in this case.

 

But at least I know that I tried to do evreything possible to get my money back.

[Stigy]

Thank you for the reply.

 

I had no illusions before I decided to post my question. Your answer is very reasonable and is just what I expected to here.

So, as far as I understand, I still have a chance for refund as a gesture of goodwill from the company.

Iven if they won't I would not have any grudge against them as I understand that they are not under any obligation to refund in this case.

 

But at least I know that I tried to do evreything possible to get my money back.

I think it's irelevent in these circumstances, as to who the card belongs to. The issue here is the balance on the card you produced I believe. The problem is, you didn't have a valid ticket to travel, as the money on the Oyster Card wasn't enough to pay for your journey. Unless the Oyster Card is a student one with a picture on it, it's almost impossible to ascertain who it belongs to, unless said person registered it in their name. With all of the above taken in to account, I doubt you'll win an appeal, sorry. Comapnies don't have much good will I'm afraid...

[Signaller]

Pugilist,

mistakes do happen, and sometimes travel companies recognise this. Personally, I have heard all the excuses you could think of (and some) but it seems pretty clear you simply made a mistake.I can speak from experience.If the company addopt the same attitude I used, they will ask the guard/ticket inspector what happened, and you might just get your refund.But as I said,they're under no obligation to do so.Let us know if they reply to your letter.

Regards

Signaller

[pugilist]

Thank you Stigy and Signaller,

 

I'll definetely keep you updated.

 

Signaller, I can imagine how many excuses you heard!

[Signaller]

Stigy,

the OP said in his/her original post that the card was checked and it turned out not to belong to the OP.If there was enough credit on the card, the guard/ticket inspector may have used their discretion and allowed travel without any further problems.Tickets/travel cards/warrants/railcards are not transferrable.It does sound from the OP that a real and genuine mistake was made but the travel company still do not have to refund, although as I said they may do so as a gesture of goodwill..

Regards

Signaller

[Stigy]

Stigy,

the OP said in his/her original post that the card was checked and it turned out not to belong to the OP.If there was enough credit on the card, the guard/ticket inspector may have used their discretion and allowed travel without any further problems.Tickets/travel cards/warrants/railcards are not transferrable.It does sound from the OP that a real and genuine mistake was made but the travel company still do not have to refund, although as I said they may do so as a gesture of goodwill..

Regards

Signaller

I know, however, it would appear that when the Inspector only dealt with the fact that there was insufficient balance on the card, irespective of whether it was his card or not. The point I was trying to make was that unless registered, Oyster cards are like any other paper ticket, impossible to trace back to any one person (unless said person confesses of course). On reading through the OPs initial post again, I can see that he probably admitted the card must be his friends, after it was read, and therefore the Inspector thought as it was an innocent mistake, a Penalty Fare was appropriate, as opposed to a report.

 

What I was also saying in my previous post, was that the company will merely see it in black & white, and that they'll probably not take in to account that he was using the incorrect Oyster Card, and just see that his journey was nit paid for. Of course they might refund him...But from experience on the other hand...

[Old-CodJA]

I know, however, it would appear that when the Inspector only dealt with the fact that there was insufficient balance on the card, irespective of whether it was his card or not. The point I was trying to make was that unless registered, Oyster cards are like any other paper ticket, impossible to trace back to any one person (unless said person confesses of course). On reading through the OPs initial post again, I can see that he probably admitted the card must be his friends, after it was read, and therefore the Inspector thought as it was an innocent mistake, a Penalty Fare was appropriate, as opposed to a report.

 

What I was also saying in my previous post, was that the company will merely see it in black & white, and that they'll probably not take in to account that he was using the incorrect Oyster Card, and just see that his journey was nit paid for. Of course they might refund him...But from experience on the other hand...

 

Stigy, I agree that the Inspector probably thought this a genuine mistake in this case and has nonetheless taken exactly the right action

 

I have been involved in the decision making process and in prosecuting these matters for a very long time and that experience leads me to believe that there actually is a chance that Pugilist may get a refund in this case

 

Oysters are available in a variety of formats and if both these cards were adult Pay-As-You-Go cards only, with no season ticket or student or, other discount qualification, they are inter-useable. On this basis, the appeal may be allowed and the penalty refunded.

 

No guarantee, but it is a possibility.

[pugilist]

Well, thank you everyone, but they rejected

 

next time I can post here a scanned image of their reply if anyone is interested