Child Tax Credit Overpayments

[meagain]

You can't send evidence that you didn't claim (a problem with logic more than anything else). Demand (in writing) that they send evidence that you claimed for the period concerned, and then show whatever comes back to be incorrect. If they do not comply, invoke the DPA and send a request to the Data Protection Unit in Longbenton (the address will be in the Register of Data Controllers at the ICO website, or somewhere on the HMRC website - failing both of those, you can always ask them for the address on the phone).

[Mushymoo26]

You can request more time to pay it. Call them and explain that the payment terms they have requested will cause you hardship. I would also point out to them, that you have recd no letter or anything regarding the overpayment and feel that they are being unreasonable to make that sort of demand in the time frame. If you say it will cause hardship then they may be willing to either write some off or extend the period you pay it back. Hope it goes well.

[Mushymoo26]

I am glad you managed to sort it out.

 

I am glad I could help.

[lnmrobinson]

Thanks Meagain,

 

Your advice was helpful, I phoned them today (I know you said in writing, but I thought I'd get the ball rolling) asking for any documents they had to say what we had been paid and when.

 

I'm sorry for saying but she was a right snotty cow. Basically she told me a different story to what I had been told the other day on the phone. Now she is saying that it was only the period that I actually claimed, nothing to do with my ex claiming after I left.

She said that the period in question was April 03 to sep 03 where the overpayment was made (I indeed was claiming then). Previously on the telephone I was told it was for the period up to Oct 04.

 

Apparently they wrote to me at my new address in May 04 to obtain my yearly p60/wage slips so that they could ascertain if I had been paid correctly between apr/sep 03. I never received this request.

 

They say that we were overpaid during this time, but how can they know that if they didnt receive any info from me when requested?

I have offered to send my relevant documents so that they can now check correctly but she refused saying that there was a time limit when the request was made and that time limit has lapsed.

She demanded payment from me, or that I continue with my dispute.

 

Now, I do not dispute that I claimed during the period they are now saying

(apr/sep 03) but I do dispute that I was overpaid as she said on the phone, they needed documents from me & my ex hubby back in 04 to ascertain if we had been paid correctly. If they haven't got this info, how can they say we were overpaid?

I'm wondering if there is any particular wording I should use in my dispute basically they cant prove I was overpaid (because they don't have the relevant docs)and neither can I (because I don't know how they work out what you are entitled to).

 

Any more help is much appreciated.

Lisa.

[di0430]

Hi

I do hope they sort this out for you. I really think this system they use now for CTC is pathetic !

I haven't had a penny since May 06 even though my hubbys earnings were approx £24K for 2005/06, I have 2 children, age 12 and the other age 18 who continued at further education now sitting his A levels, they know all this, my hubby is the only earner in the household and yet they say the household income is something like £50K a year or less to be eligible !! All i know is in April 07 they will start paying it and i think it works out something like £16 a week and thats with taking off the overpayments owed from 2005/06.

It just doesn't make any sense does it ??? Not a penny now though !!

Good luck to everyone, you can only pay back what you can afford.

Cheers Di

[chaplinsbabe]

I have a huge problem with Tax Credits. I keep all letters they send to me (I do this with anything). They have been trying to claim back overpayments every year since we started claiming in 2002.

 

Now I have award notices which start off with the right earnings figures on; then 2 months later they change it; we ring, they eventually change it back and then as if by magic it gets changed again.

 

The problems always come in the new financial year cross over. I would ring them in April and say this is what I earnt last year. They would say we can't update it over the phone you need to wait for your renewal and your P60 to get the true amount. What my March payslip said though was the true amount and my P60 didn't come until May. The renewal form wouldn't come until about June either, hence there's where the overpayment comes from.

 

Then there was the problem when my partner became self-employed. The first year he filed the tax return in December with an accountant. He didn't hear the results until after January 31st. Tax credits new this because they kept ringing and writing and asking for the info. When he did try to give it to them they said he was over the deadline and although they had noted his earnings they wouldn't accept the figure - hence an overpayment.

 

Then again when he filed a tax return this year. He knows what he has earnt but Tax Credits will not accept the final figure until the tax office have processed it. When he spoke to them yesterday, the inland revenue said that because they had been on strike on the deadline they were still going through them.

 

We have been told we have to pay them over £2000 by the 6th March or go to court. What makes me angry is they know our circumstances at the moment. My partner has just been made redundant and is claiming JSA; we have 2 children one of whom is a baby and I work 16 hours a week. Tax credits are paying us £52 a week in CTC and have told us we aren't entitled to anymore WTC. We can't even afford to heat our house and my partner and I don't eat properly so we can feed the kids so where the hell do they think we have £2000 stuffed away?

[Mushymoo26]

Hi

 

I am so sorry to hear about your situation, it makes me so angry that they are putting peoples health at risk.

 

Right heres what you do. Call them, request an overpayments dispute form to be sent (or you can down load it from thier website). Call them and advise your are disputing this overpayment and that their actions have caused you and your family financial hardship. They will then have to re-assess the situation regarding what you are recieving if you cant afford to eat etc due to them. On the form list everything and if possible take copies of the letters and forms you have. Detail everything even telephone calls. Also speak to whoever at their office is telling you that unless you pay by March they will take you to court. Explain what you are doing, also tell them you will be seeking advise from the CAB. I did this and as soon as I mentioned I would be getting assistance they changed from being very agressive to wanting to help me. If you know the overpayment is their fault, insist that they give you a breakdown of where and when it happened. Take this to CAB. If you dispute the overpayment, they will have to continue paying you at your normal rate (whatever you was getting before this happened) and if you state its causing you financial hardship, it will be quicker. I would also be inclined to ask on what grounds are they going to seek legal action, as all the paperwork indicates that this overpayment was caused by them. I would also advise that you have kept all the letters, award notices and notes of telephone calls. I believe that they are trying to scare parents into paying as they are relying in the fact that they are part of HM Revenue and customs. Try and not let them intimidate you, stand your ground. Let me know if you need any further advice or support.

[chaplinsbabe]

thank you for that. i shall be going to see the CAB about this. I have had my MP involved with this and they have just been fobbing him off too. How do I go about being able to get hold of all transcripts for phonecalls etc

[Mushymoo26]

Do you SAR request or get your MP to request them.

[chaplinsbabe]

wont a Data Protection Act request cover it because I can't afford £10 for a SAR?

[meagain]

HMRC do not usually charge a fee for SARs. You can call the Data Proection Unit (0191 2257575) for all the necessary details such as what identifying information they would prefer (typically name, address and NI number), and the request goes to:

 

HM Revenue & Customs

Data Protection Subject Access Unit

Room BP5001

Benton Park View

Newcastle upon Tyne

NE98 1ZZ

 

This PDF has some useful information, but it may still be worth calling them first if you still have any queries.

[chaplinsbabe]

thanks for your help. it says there is no charge for a SAR so I will get one written and posted Recorded delivery

[Mushymoo26]

Hi

 

As my original petition seems lost in cyber space I have been looking at all the other petitions regarding this.

 

So for anyone who has had the mis-fortune of dealing with the tax office, please sign this one as well.

 

petitions.pm.gov.uk/childtaxcredit

 

Hopefully mine should be on there soon

 

Thanks:)

[di0430]

Hi, thanks for the link.

Have now signed it and i will pass this on ok.

Cheers............lets hope something good comes out of it for a change.

Di xxx:D

[scarlett79]

Hi i dont know if this is any use to anyone,but once watching working lunch last year on tv it was on about tax credits overpayments, a guy was on advising people what to do anyway he said, dont appeal against their decision about overpayments because this apparently meant you were infact accepting the decision on one level, and instesd you should just ring/write and tell them you dont agree. Ithink then thats what you keep doing and tell them how its their fault and so on. Im pretty sure this was what was said as i was in same boat at the time. Idont know if its worth checking out maybe with cab/welfare rights to see what they say.

[di0430]

Hi again.

Please could someone advise me on my sister's behalf the complaint procedures for the CTC ?

My sister had paid what she owed in overpayments back by cheque a year ago and she still receives letters asking for payments !

She does have copies of evidence etc and have wrote to them many times etc, but they are not having it and still deny receiving the payments.

She has made several complaints to the managers dept, and has had enough now, this does not seem to be resolving anything-and the whole repayment balance is paid, so what would be the next step from here ? Any ideas ? Cheers .

[cathbr]

Hi - I am being taken to court to pay back an overpayment which I dispute. The tax office have cancelled my entire entitlement to tax credit for 04/05 because I didn't give them my income information on time. However, when I gave them the information (2 weeks after the deadline) they sent me a provisional notice saying I had been overpaid by around £600. A few months later I was sent a notice saying that my entitlement for the year was nil! I don't dispute there was an overpayment, but I dispute how much. Can they cancel payments for the year even though my income was MUCH less than the £52,000 upper limit for a claim?

[Mushymoo26]

Hi - You need to call them and request that they send you a breakdown of how they have calculated the charges. Also have you check entitledto.co.uk it should give you an idea of how much you were entitled to and perhaps you can then work the difference. I would also fill out a dispute form and see how you go from there.

[cathbr]

Hi thanks, I have now written to them asking what my entitlement for that year should be for my stated income and how they calculate that. I have also asked them if they are saying it is nil because they are penalising me for sending the info in late. I don't think they are allowed to penalise me for sending info in late, only if I don't tell them about things like having a partner, which I haven't.

[chaplinsbabe]

they have tried that one with me for 2005/2006 when my partner was self employed and because he didn't hear back from the tax office until after jan 31st 2006 they tried to make out we were entitled to NO money whatsoever for that year.

 

I have sent a DPA request and they have written back and asked me to fill out of their forms which asks me to provide the same info I had already given them. I also wrote to the debt management people to tell them I was putting all monies owed into dispute as I had reason to believe from the info I have that I do not owe the £11000 they claim dating back to 2002.

 

The debt management team said they came to my house on friday (9th) to discuss how I was going to pay back the money they say I owe. However I was in all day and unless they come disguised as the postman who delivered a second class envelope from them then they are lying.

 

I am not giving them a penny until they can prove without doubt that I actually owe this money

[cathbr]

Hi - yeah, my delayed info was because I had sent in a tax return in the January and hadn't worked out until then what my total income for the previous year was. In the end, it was not much more than the estimated income I had given them in the September.

 

Oh well, at least I'll have my day in court. Just hope the judge sees things from my point of view and doesn't just assume that the Tax Credits people are right!

[tartanarmy]

Hi all

 

Can anyone tell me how to claim money from previous years? I believe I should be able to do this as I was told not to claim years 2004/05 and 2005/06 by the Revenue and Customs in order to pay off an overpayment. They were wrong and eventually wrote off the overpayment.

 

Also, is it usual for them to claim overpayment for money that has not physically been paid. As I said I had the first year's overpayment written off and didn't claim after that, yet they've sent a letter saying I've been overpaid by £589.

[delboytrotter]

Just a note to let you all know i was succesful at claiming that i was entitled to what the Tax Credits office paid me,

This is what i wrote to them ,

 

We are sure that the overpayment of tax credits would not have happened if the tax credit office had not made a mistake with our claim and removed our children from our form, when the tax credit office removed our children from our claim form it left us without a claim and our tax credits were stopped completely, my wife then phoned the tax credit office and after several phone calls we finally persuaded the office to arrange emergency payments which were then made on a weekly basis at considerable inconvenience to us which meant we had to make a round trip of 35 miles to pick up a cheque from the Inverness office.

We feel that the error was totally the fault of the tax credits office for removing our children from our claim form and once they had reinstated this which took many weeks and several phone calls which once again we had to pay for we were informed that it was sorted out and that would be the end of it.

We then received a claim for overpayments and feel that as the fault was the tax credit office that we should not be liable for the overpayment and if anything we should be reimbursed for the hours spent trying to sort out the mess that was created by the tax credits office which involved many hours on hold on some occasions and many hours on the phone, this compensation should also include my time spent writing letter to which you have never responded.

I would appreciate if you could bring this to a speedy and acceptable resolution.

 

 

It was ture btu it may aork for others just by altering the wording, i know they dont like the idea of compensation for letter writing and stress, in the end they had to pay us back nearly £1200 .

 

Good Luck

[tartanarmy]

Thanks for that. What is becoming increasingly clear to me is that if you fight, fight and keep on fighting them they'll back down. You just have to stay strong.

 

My last post is somewhat out of date as I have since contacted them about it and, guess what, one hand wasn't working in tandem with the other and they had a made a mistake. Surprise, surprise.

 

Oh, and I should say that alongside the money they wrote off they also paid me £30 for stress caused and telephone calls made. Next time I'll fight for more and would advise everyone to do the same.

[delboytrotter]

Well done, i really agree, i think consumers need to fight for more as our rights are being taken from us by so called ombudman groups etc etc which do nothing. If everyone who reads these forums stands up for themselves then it is only a matter of time until the consumers take it back.

This is our money and i just keep reminding myself, they are taking my money!