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    • thanks for your kind words ,  its the procedural stuff i worry about   technical stuff that can affect outcomes because of my inexperience   skeleton arguments, to be done cost schedules informing court how long i think it will take etc.    for instance their solicitor has asked for some emails between me and my loan broker - well after disclosure. i havent disclosed these ( they are privileged) and i have written them in the privileged box - only three emails anyway   but should i just provide to him as i actually want to present in court myself , and letting them have them actually discloses  them so they become admissable  or ignore?   also costs- mine arent too high   but what is fast track going to cost me in a situation where i lose.   i know court fees capped at 1650 but what if their solicitor bill is 20k-    i have managed to include all the way through their failings of pre action haste to litigation letters offers to settle subject to costs- i would nt feel so bad if all i was fighting was the court claim amount.
    • Yes you can.....you appear to have a good understanding of the basic credit consumer law.....possibly impress the judge that you went it alone...plenty of Fast Track cases been fought and won by litigants here on CAG.   If you have the evidence...the argument....and the personality to convey .....go for it...think of the fees you will save not paying the barrister.
    • Hi FTMDave They initially requested £140 within 14 days. This has now gone to £182 after the initial debt collection firm took over (now back with CEL   The carpark had two options, pay-by-app and cash, we had n cash hence using the easier app. The app in the playstore has shocking reviews, im not the only one.   I wasnext going to get 'their hand' sent to me fromt he data controller, sending the following:   Dear Sir or Madam   Subject access request ( Data Protection Act 2018 / General Data Protection Regulations (GDPR) )   Please supply the data about me that I am entitled to under data protection law  relating to myself. - All photos taken - all letters/emails sent and received, including any appeal correspondence earlier - A PDT machine record from 23/11/2019  of payments - A record of online payments made using the Google Playstore APP that day - all data held, all evidence they will rely on, and - a full copy of the PCN, NTK - a list of all PCNs outstanding against me and/or this VRN, and I will remind here that any claim must be for all PCNs, not several separate claims.   If you need any more data from me to confirm my identity please let me know as soon as possible. It may be helpful for you to know that data protection law requires you to respond to a request for data within one calendar month. If you do not normally deal with these requests, please pass this letter to your Data Protection Officer, or relevant staff member. If you need advice on dealing with this request, the Information Commissioner’s Office can assist you. Its website is ico.org.uk or it can be contacted on 0303 123 1113.   Yours faithfully    
    • You need to read some more and then some.......costs are restricted in Small Claims Track....have a read of the above thread...same scenario...and its getting close to a hearing now....squeaky bum time for them.
    • OK, we can help you.   A couple of questions first.  You blanked out the amount they are claiming.  Can you tell us?  I bet they have added Unicorn Food Tax to their claim.   Also, can you remember if this was pay-by-app-only car park, or if there were other payment methods?
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    • Hi @BankFodder
      Sorry for only updating you now, but after your guidance with submitting the claim it was pretty straight forward and I didn't want to unnecessarily waste your time. Especially with this guide you wrote here, so many thanks for that
      So I issued the claim on day 15 and they requested more time to respond.
      They took until the last day to respond and denied the claim, unsurprisingly saying my contract was with Packlink and not with them.
       
      I opted for mediation, and it played out very similarly to other people's experiences.
       
      In the first call I outlined my case, and I referred to the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 as the reason to why I do in fact have a contract with them. 
       
      In the second call the mediator came back with an offer of the full amount of the phone and postage £146.93, but not the court costs. I said I was not willing to accept this and the mediator came across as a bit irritated that I would not accept this and said I should be flexible. I insisted that the law was on my side and I was willing to take them to court. The mediator went back to Hermes with what I said.
       
      In the third call the mediator said that they would offer the full amount. However, he said that Hermes still thought that I should have taken the case against Packlink instead, and that they would try to recover the court costs themselves from Packlink.
       
      To be fair to them, if Packlink wasn't based in Spain I would've made the claim against them instead. But since they are overseas and the law lets me take action against Hermes directly, it's the best way of trying to recover the money.
       
      So this is a great win. Thank you so much for your help and all of the resources available on this site. It has helped me so much especially as someone who does not know anything about making money claims.
       
      Many thanks, stay safe and have a good Christmas!
       
       
        • Thanks
    • Hermes and mediation hints. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/428981-hermes-and-mediation-hints/&do=findComment&comment=5080003
      • 1 reply
    • Natwest Bank Transfer Fraud Call HMRC Please help. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/428951-natwest-bank-transfer-fraud-call-hmrc-please-help/&do=findComment&comment=5079786
      • 31 replies
    • Hermes lost parcel.. Read more at https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/422615-hermes-lost-parcel/
      • 49 replies

Legal Action: how to start off. IMPORTANT IF YOURE BEING SUED


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The other thing is that I cant find out if my agreement is valid or not. I have posted on here a few times but had no reply. It was taken out 25/07/2005 and looks like there was a tearoff piece on the top. I cant figur out if its an application form or not. It does say credit card agreement at the top left. The back doesnt have any terms and conditions on it and on the front the terms go up to 3b which refers to section 4 and its not there. Nowhere on the form does it refer to a seperate document containing terms and conditions, only under the heading IMPORTANT - DATA PROTECTION, where it states that you must read sections 13 and 14 on the terms and conditions provided. Heres a link to the thread and photos if anyone would like to look and advise. Its hard to read not the best photocopy they provided. I signed it but never dated it.

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?273135-MNBA-CCA-enforcable&p=3094765&highlight=#post3094765

 

Just noticed on the very bottom right hand side it says, "see the rest of your terms and conditions (including definitions) which are in the leaflet enclosed".

Is that ok giving a leaflet with the terms and conditions on it in 2005?

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This is just the job for me at the moment. Only difference is that I have put a Bank in court for the sale at undervalue. A very large undervalue, don't want to give too many details.

I have requested copies of any valuations upon which the Bank relies. I've been told that none were mentioned in their Defence. They did mention advice taken about the valuation from a valuer, but according to them that's not a valuation! the Bank is saying they'll disclose later. I have replied mentioning CPR 15.4 which defined the word document. Is this ok?

 

I'm not sure how the bank intends to defend a claim for sale at undervalue without a valuation.

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thankfully HHJ Wakeman QC handed down his judgment.

 

IF the agreement is illegible then it is foul of the Cancelation notices regs and then the court cannot enforce it, so , you would plead that the documents are illegible and you cannot plead as to the enforceability of the agreement at this stage

 

So does this mean that although they can print out the terms and conditions which are legible, the contract which is very hard to read will be foul to the cancelation notices as you describe above? Can you look at my link and give me your opinion please.

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I have to file my defense in a couple of days. Can someone have a look at the POC on the claim form for me and let me know what you think. Heres the wording below :-

 

The claimants claim is for the sum of XXXXX being monies due from the defendant to the claimant under a regulated credit agreement made in writing under reference xxxxxxxxx

 

The defendant has failed to make payment in accordance with the terms of the agreement and a default notice has been served upon the defendant pursuant to section 87 (1) of the consumer credit act 1974.

 

Sent by Howard Cohen on behalf of Santander

 

They have not supplied the default notice as I requested.

 

I also have a letter from Santander stating that "the agreement was assigned to the Lewis Group on xxxxxx. When this happened the agreement between you and Santander cards was terminated and the Lewis group became the legal owners of the debt.

The account was not therefore terminated, as you have suggested, nor have we rescinded on the agreement.

 

The agreement was taken out 29/01/2008 online and the agreement is just a printed copy, I havent physically signed it, will this make any difference?

Any opinions on the above?

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i have recently been passed an opinion of a barrister whom i have not debated my view on this whole rescission arguments, but i can say that his view mirrors mine in that you cannot terminate a regulated agreement unless the statutory requirements are met.

 

if they arent met then no termination can occur, this accords with Chambers view, and the view of many County Court judges and many many other counsel whom i have canvassed.

 

I think we all follow what you say PT, it's just we are none of us sure where that leaves us. I understand that the agreement is still alive, but where does that put both creditor and debtor who understood the agreement was terminated, payments ceased & debt sold off nearly two years ago.

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I have to file my defense in a couple of days. Can someone have a look at the POC on the claim form for me and let me know what you think. Heres the wording below :-

 

The claimants claim is for the sum of XXXXX being monies due from the defendant to the claimant under a regulated credit agreement made in writing under reference xxxxxxxxx

 

The defendant has failed to make payment in accordance with the terms of the agreement and a default notice has been served upon the defendant pursuant to section 87 (1) of the consumer credit act 1974.

 

Sent by Howard Cohen on behalf of Santander

 

They have not supplied the default notice as I requested.

 

I also have a letter from Santander stating that "the agreement was assigned to the Lewis Group on xxxxxx. When this happened the agreement between you and Santander cards was terminated and the Lewis group became the legal owners of the debt.

The account was not therefore terminated, as you have suggested, nor have we rescinded on the agreement.

 

The agreement was taken out 29/01/2008 online and the agreement is just a printed copy, I havent physically signed it, will this make any difference?

Any opinions on the above?

 

If I'm honest I'd say come to an agreement with them. Not having a copy of the default notice is not fatal to there case, a judge may believe their systems are in place to send them and if their records show this that will be enough. As the agreement is so recent they dont have to worry about s127(3) and as it was online a simple tick in a digital box is all that is required to confirm the agreement.

 

Sorry, but you could just be adding to your legal costs here unless there are some circumstances you havent divulged.

 

S.

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My Court claim doesn't have my correct credit card number on it and the credit card number on my statements is different from the original statements, before the company was taken over. Does anyone consider this of any significant relevance in a defence?

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No, they could easily get permission to rectify this.

“The industry is rotten to the core, whether it is in-house recovery and collection, or where agents are used, or where the debt has been sold.” Andrew Mackinley MP, House of Commons, 22 April 2009

 

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If I'm honest I'd say come to an agreement with them. Not having a copy of the default notice is not fatal to there case, a judge may believe their systems are in place to send them and if their records show this that will be enough. As the agreement is so recent they dont have to worry about s127(3) and as it was online a simple tick in a digital box is all that is required to confirm the agreement.

 

Sorry, but you could just be adding to your legal costs here unless there are some circumstances you havent divulged.

 

S.

 

Thanks Shadow.

I have to put in my defense tonight, I have read what everyone has said so I am gonna try the angle that they havent supplied me with all the documentation I asked for or replied to the 2 emails I sent them asking for the default notice. I will see what the court says and and see if i can get a strikeout for not issuing another DN correctly. If it goes further I have logs of all the phonecalls I have had from Santander, sometimes up to 3 a day harrassing us, they have been asked to only contact us by post or email and not been helpful and ignored our letter at first. They didnt want to know when I first asked for them to freeze the interest and help out, I sent a CCA request then put the account into dispute, they have continually harrassed us with debt collection letters, some very threatening and missleading, and 3 or 4 different agents so I dont know who to deal with. Still adding interest when the accont is in dispute. Why is it that these sharks can quote the CCA when they want to take us to court and get away with blatantly not following the rules when they sue us.

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Hi PT, Your thread is very interesting can I use some of the info from here to get a ccj set aside?? I had a judgement go against me last friday but the claimant had not responded to any of my formal req for information part 31.16 or a CCA req or a formal notice of account in dispute. Any help you can give me on filling out my N244 would be greatly appreciated. My thread is located under legal Help just lost in court against cl finance/ Howard Cohens. Many thanks

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SJ

 

Can you please set up a link to your thread?

 

Thanks

 

BD

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http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?306857-Fairness-Gene-s-opinion&p=3423924#post3423924

 

Fairness Gene, I have moved your post into a thread of it's own, in order for you to discuss/debate your opinion .

 

This particular thread is a valuable resource and debating thread, but on the subject it is dedicated to.

 

uptoeyeballs

UndercoverElsa

duckwaddler

Pumpytums

 

your posts were moved as well in order to keep the debate going. :)

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Verrrry good idea Cb... :-)

In the meantime if FG has any legal issues he/she needs help with we'll do our best to help, as ever....

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  • 3 weeks later...
I have put a Bank in court for the sale at undervalue. A very large undervalue, don't want to give too many details.

I have requested copies of any valuations upon which the Bank relies. I've been told that none were mentioned in their Defence. They did mention advice taken about the valuation from a valuer, but according to them that's not a valuation! the Bank is saying they'll disclose later. I have replied mentioning CPR 15.4 which defined the word document. Is this ok?

 

I'm not sure how the bank intends to defend a claim for sale at undervalue without a valuation.

 

 

I'm not sure whether it is relevent to your situation, but my attention was recently drawn to a thread in which a homeowner is suing a mortgage lender, in which the issue of a sale of the property at an undervalue was one of the issues being discussed.

 

The thread is here: Mortgage Express appoint LPA Recievers

 

In particular, this part of the other thread might be relevent for you: post3428207

 

That other thread is considering the duties - if any - of a mortgage company to a borrower, on a sale by the mortgage company of a mortgaged residential property. In particular, it looks at a sale under the powers in the mortgage contract, in the light of section 109 of the Law of Property Act 1925, where the mortgage company appoints a receiver under that Act to handle the sale for it.

Edited by Ed999
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