reorete & council tax

[reorete]

soory to ask on this thread but im in need of desperate help... to cut a long story short i had a letter from the council out of the blue saying i owed 800 pound in council tax. some for this year and some of the amount they are saying has been owed since 2004... i have tried phoning lots of times to tell them i wasnt working in 2004 and was on income support and full housing benefit.. anyway 4 days before xmas i got a home visit from a mr robinson from dukes bailiffs.. he said i owed 800 pounds and he wanted it in full.. i explained it was 4 days till xmas and im a single parent 3 kids and didnt have it.. he then started phoning for a van to remove goods a locksmith and the police so out of embarassment because the neighbours were out i let him in... he saw i had nothing of value so he did a levy on my 10 year old sofa my mini hifi which was broke a dvd player and all my dvd movies mainly my kids disney dvds... im in total despair since i have till wensday the 18th jan when he will be here to collect goods... i dont care about my things but i have 3 kids and im so upset when they get home from school they wont even have anywhere to sit.... any advise i will be eternally gratefull for xxx ss for doin this on your thread but i dont know how to open my own

[reorete]

ps after he collects the 300 on wensday he will then take payments for the other 500. i havnt got any cash as i lost my job after xmas as buisness is so bad so now im on income support again and very depressed

[Big_Bother!]

Hi Get in touch with the Council Go visit them they usually have a drop-in office at the town hall. You should be classed as "vurnerable" Your a single parent on benefits with children at home. He was just trying to scare the pants off you with his locksmith-police threats etc. Report him to the council -If he comes back next week phone 999 tell them a stranger is breaking into your house and is threaten your life and children. Don't say he's a ballife they wont want to know then, just say your being threatend.

[saintly_1]

Moved posts to their own thread

[ploddertom]

Thanks Saintly

 

PT

[ploddertom]

soory to ask on this thread but im in need of desperate help... to cut a long story short i had a letter from the council out of the blue saying i owed 800 pound in council tax. some for this year and some of the amount they are saying has been owed since 2004... i have tried phoning lots of times to tell them i wasnt working in 2004 and was on income support and full housing benefit.. anyway 4 days before xmas i got a home visit from a (names removed).. he said i owed 800 pounds and he wanted it in full.. i explained it was 4 days till xmas and im a single parent 3 kids and didnt have it.. he then started phoning for a van to remove goods a locksmith and the police so out of embarassment because the neighbours were out i let him in... he saw i had nothing of value so he did a levy on my 10 year old sofa my mini hifi which was broke a dvd player and all my dvd movies mainly my kids disney dvds... im in total despair since i have till wensday the 18th jan when he will be here to collect goods... i dont care about my things but i have 3 kids and im so upset when they get home from school they wont even have anywhere to sit.... any advise i will be eternally gratefull for xxx ss for doin this on your thread but i dont know how to open my own

 

First off go back and edit your post to remove the names. More will follow.

 

PT

[hallowitch]

so he did a levy on my 10 year old sofa my mini hifi which was broke a dvd player and all my dvd movies mainly my kids disney dvds... I'm in total despair since i have till Wednesday the 18th jan when he will be here to collect goods... i don't care about my things but i have 3 kids and I'm so upset when they get home from school they wont even have anywhere to sit.... any advise i will be eternally gratefull for xxx ss for doin this on your thread but i don't know how to open my own

 

 

The bailiff cant levy or remove your sofa if it would leave you and your children no where to sit

 

he cant levy on the dvds that belong to your kids either

[reorete]

i phoned the company who the bailiff is collecting for and they told me they can levy on my setee??????????????

[hallowitch]

no they cant

 

) The following articles belonging to a debtor shall be exempt from distress at the instance of a creditor in respect of a debt due to him by the debtor-

a) clothing reasonably required for the use of the debtor or any member of the debtor's household;

b) implements, tools of trade, books or other equipment including a car or van reasonably required for the use of the debtor or any member of the debtor's household in the practice of the debtor's or such member's profession, trade or business, not exceeding in aggregate value £1,000 or such amount as may be prescribed in regulations made by the Lord Chancellor;

c) medical aids or medical equipment reasonably required for the use of the debtor or any member of his household;

d) books or other articles including a computer reasonably required for the education or training of the debtor or any member of the debtor's household not exceeding in aggregate value £1,000 or such amount as may be prescribed in regulations made by the Lord Chancellor;

e) toys for the use of any child who is a member of the debtor's household;

f) articles reasonably required for the care or upbringing of a child who is a member of the debtor's household.

 

2) The following articles belonging to a debtor shall be exempt from distress if they are at the time of the distress in a dwellinghouse and are reasonably required for the use in the dwellinghouse of the person residing there or a member of the household-

a) beds or bedding;

b) household linen;

c) chairs or settees;

d) tables;

e) food;

f) lights or light fittings;

g) heating appliances;

h) curtains;

i) floor coverings;

j) furniture, equipment or utensils used for cooking storing or eating food;

k) refrigerators;

l) articles used for cleaning, mending, or pressing clothes;

m) articles used for cleaning the dwellinghouse;

n) furniture used for storing-

(i) clothing, bedding or household linen;

(ii) articles used for cleaning the dwellinghouse; or

(iii) utensils used for cooking or eating food;

 

o) articles used for safety in the dwellinghouse or of household articles

3) The Lord Chancellor may by regulations add to the list set out in subsection (2) above, or delete or vary any of the items contained in that list.

We consider that under 1(b) and 1(d) the preferable aggregate value might be £1500.

[ploddertom]

i phoned the company who the bailiff is collecting for and they told me they can levy on my setee??????????????

 

I'm not being flippant but the Company will also tell you the moon is made of cream cheese ie they will tell you anything they think you will believe. They are full of lies, bu**sh*t and cannot lie straight in bed. In other words believe nothing they say.

 

They cannot arrest you, put you in jail, break into your home unless they have a valid levy and advise you in advance etc etc. You will get sound advice here as long as you carry it through.

 

In particular follow what hallowitch says.

 

PT

[reorete]

many thanks to you my friend xxxxxx

[hallowitch]

Irregular Distress (Levy) by Bailiffs

With thanks to Tomtubby

[edit]MRS AMBROSE v NOTTINHGAM CITY COUNCIL

This is another well known legal cases that has been relied upon many times when either issuing proceedings, or one that can be referred to when writing a letter of complaint. This case concerns a lady by the name of Mrs Ambrose who claimed that a levy (distress) was irregular as bailiffs had removed goods from the home that were necessary for “providing the basic domestic needs of the family”

Background:

Mrs Ambrose and her husband had an unpaid Council Tax bill for £851.00 owing to Nottingham City Council. In September 2003, Rossendale’s Bailiffs attended at their home to levy distress on goods. Rossendale’s had entered the property, where they identified items that were listed on a Walking Possession. Next to those items listed, the bailiff wrote the words: “and all other goods on the premises unless exempt or specially exempt by statute.” The bailiff had not looked around the house; he had merely entered one room and was therefore unable to see which items were “exempt”

Regulation 45 of the Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) Regulations 1992 lists the following items as being exempt from seizure:

"Such tools, books, vehicles and other items of equipment as are necessary for use personally in employment, business or vocation"

"Such clothing, bedding, furniture, household equipment and provisions as are necessary for satisfying basic domestic needs of the person and family".

=========================================================

As the Council Tax remained unpaid, the bailiff returned with a van to seize furniture that included a sofa, footstool and two dining chairs.

 

District Judge Cooper agreed that the seizure was irregular as the bailiff had removed furniture that was necessary for “satisfying the basic domestic needs of Mrs Ambrose and her family” This was because, amongst other items removed, the bailiffs had removed 2 dining chairs. They left behind the table and the remaining two chairs. As the family consisted of Mrs & Mrs Ambrose and one child, the bailiffs should have left seating for 3 people, not two.

Nottingham City Council had argued that there could not be any irregularity as Mrs Ambrose had signed the Walking Possession. This was rejected by Judge Cooper who agreed that Mrs Ambrose was faced with the prospect of having her goods removed unless she signed the Walking Possession.

==============================================================

As important as the above is, the Judge also agreed that the wording on the Walking Possession was deficient in that the reference to “all other goods on the premises unless exempt” did not specify what those other goods were, and which ones were exempt. The Judge agreed that the levy was also irregular for this reason.

__________________

[reorete]

so does that make his levy invalid? im scared as hell hes coming at 4 on wensday so what can i do. what do i say to him as hes very agressive.im scared ... i want to pay this but in all honesty can only pay in reasonable installments

[hallowitch]

so does that make his levy invalid? I'm scared as hell hes coming at 4 on Wednesday so what can i do. what do i say to him as hes very aggressive.I'm scared ... i want to pay this but in all honesty can only pay in reasonable instalments

 

yes he has an invalid levy you must send a letter to the bailiff company telling them you believe they have an invalid levy

send a copy of the letter to the council along with a copy of the walking possession agreement send all letters recorded delivery

 

did he send you a letter saying he was coming on Wednesday to remove the goods on the levy

[reorete]

no he put the date he was coming back on the copy of the walk in levy he gave me

[reorete]

i havnt got time to write to them hes coming wendsday afternon

[hallowitch]

no he put the date he was coming back on the copy of the walk in levy he gave me

 

 

Not good enough the bailiff must send you a letter giving you a time and date when the removal will take place

 

CODE OF PRACTICE

ON

LOCAL AUTHORITIES' USE OF BAILIFFS

IN THE ENFORCEMENT OF LOCAL TAXES

There have been changes wrought by case law and also by amendments to the

Distress for rent Rules 1988 and Council Tax (Administration & Enforcement)

Regulations 1993 as follows.

p5 Forcing re-entry

The law upon the rights of bailiffs to force re-entry to premises in order to remove

goods previously seized has recently been clarified. In Khazanchi v Faircharm

Investments; McLeod v Butterwick [1998] 2 All ER 901 the Court of Appeal held that

bailiffs may only force re-entry where they are being deliberately excluded from

premises. It will thus be necessary in most cases for the bailiff to notify the debtor in

advance of the date and time of the visit in order to remove. If the debtor is then

absent from home, or refuses entry, force may be employed

 

if he does come on Wednesday do not answer the door to him

he doesn't want to remove your goods on this occasion he wants to add a van/attendance fee that will have to be removed along with the levy fee

[RaeUK]

Hi reorite. Relax you are in good hands with the people giving you advice. The bailiff is trying to intimidate you please do not let him succeed. The last thing a bailiff really wants is your goods. He wants your money. And, apparently, plenty of it.

Follow Hallowitchs advice and Plodders.

In the meantime I want to re-read this thread and I'll post up some advice about the vulnerable category. If it applies it is something to follow up AS WELL AS other advice. You have plenty of ammunition. So, tin hats on chaps...

Best wishes.

Rae.

Edited January 11, 2010 by RaeUK
the dreaded tie poo...

[reorete]

im scared to not let him in as he has already done a levy... setee, kids dvds.. mini hifi my sons... dvd player

[reorete]

what if he claims hes entitled to take my sofa? can i call the police

[reorete]

i feel so humiliated

[ploddertom]

i feel so humiliated

 

 

There is no need to be, you are not picked on because of what has happened to you. Many of us here have been in a similar position or worse. Rather than listen to the Bailiff or his Company run with what you learn here.

 

The Bailiff would love to have you as his puppet so that everytime he pulls a string you dance to his tune. With help you can turn the tables to your own advantage. Please learn to ignore everything he says, he lives in fantasy land. Eventually he will go away and annoy someone else who unfortunately has not found this site.

 

PT

[RaeUK]

Hi reorete. Just to underline other points - and hopefully ease your worry hunni, the bailiff cannot take your kids stuff and cannot take your sofa. Check your walking possession notice for other anomolies... Follow the advice given regarding an invalid levy...

 

There is a National Standard for Enforcement Agents. It isn't law but does set the standard the bailiff should work to and the councils should adhere to it as they are the bailiffs ultimate boss .

 

Department for Constitutional Affairs - Enforcement - National Standards for Enforcement Agents

 

Those who might be considered vulnerable include the following:

the elderly;

people with a disability;

the seriously ill;

the recently bereaved;

single parent families;

pregnant women;

unemployed people; and,

those who have obvious difficulty in understanding, speaking or reading English.

 

 

Obviously you tick two of the boxes so might be considered. That little 'might' is a big word indeed! In my mind, what you have so far gives good cause to write to the council and let them know your circumstances. That said if there is anything else that would help please let me know. For instance, do you get any other benefit? DLA for example. Are you currently under your GP or other healthcare professional?

Best wishes.

Rae.

[RaeUK]

Hey hunni, as plodder said, don't feel humiliated.

Look, many on this forum advise not just out of the goodness of their hearts, or because they happen to know what they're talking about. But often because what drove them to that knowledge was having been through what you're going through and feeling as you feel now.

 

I'm going to paste here my little story. It's for you to read and appreciate you are not alone in how you're feeling. OK? It's in italics so those here at CAG who've read it before can be spared the tedium. But, as I say, it's for you...

 

… I have chronic emphysema and am well and truly in the vulnerable category. I am weak and easily bullied. It wasn't that long ago I had a Christmas completely ruined by a testosterone fuelled idiot of a bailiff. He terrified me, threatened me and completely scared me. I had saved up for months to get my young niece and nephew presents. And when you're on a low income, living day to day, you'll understand just what a sacrifice that was. I went without many times. That swine cleaned me out. Took my last penny. I'm sorry, but I will state - without shame - that I'm crying as I type this. I don't like to hate people but I do hate that guy. I truly hope he rots in hell for his crimes….

 

Take care hun.

Rae.

[reorete]

guuted for you kelcou... and ty for your kind advise all of you xxxxx