jj69 -v- Barclays

[jj69]

Any advice on the following please :

 

I have an old barclays account that has been closed and passed to DCA.

It has basically for £1300 but I owe about £550 on it the rest is charges.

I have SAR'd Barclays and are highlighting the charges now but does the DCA need a deed of assignment to prove they can collect this debt ?

 

Reclaiming the charges do I go to Barclays or the DCA now account has been closed ?

 

It has gone from one DCA to another and I suspect that one will try for court action soon.Not worried at that as the charges alone are one point to defend.

I don't wont to pay anything which will acknoweledge the debt but need a letter to send these guys to prove they have the right to collect this.

[clemma]

Send them this if you want:

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

 

Reference no: 00000000000

 

You have contacted me/us regarding the account with the above reference number, which you claim is owed by myself/ourselves.

 

I/we would point out that I/we have no knowledge of any such debt being owed to (insert company name).

 

I am/we are familiar with the Office of Fair Trading Debt Collection Guidance which states that it unfair to send demands for payment to an individual when it is uncertain that they are the debtor in question.

 

I/we would also point out that the OFT say under the Guidance that it is unfair to pursue third parties for payment when they are not liable. In not ceasing collection activity whilst investigating a reasonably queried or disputed debt you are using deceptive/and or unfair methods.

 

Furthermore ignoring and/or disregarding claims that debts have been settled or are disputed and continuing to make unjustified demands for payment amounts to physical/psychological harassment.

 

I/we would ask that no further contact be made concerning the above account unless you can provide evidence as to my/our liability for the debt in question.

 

I/we await your written confirmation that this matter is now closed. Otherwise I will have no option but to make a complaint to the trading standards department and consider informing the OFT of your actions.

 

I/we look forward to your reply.

 

Yours faithfully,

[jj69]

Send them this if you want:

 

 

Excellent Clemma...so with that letter I assume they will have to prove that they can legally claim on this debt ?

 

I also assume that the debt cannot be passed on while under dispute ?

[jj69]

over the last six months my buisness has ran into trouble with barclays bank,recently i got a call asking why i was overdrawn by £3000 and why wasnt any money goin in.i repied that i wasnst able to afford to put money in because there was £2000 in charges from unpaid direct debits can anyone put me on the road to sort this out with them it just keeps on gettin more as the weeks go on

 

 

Hi there..sorry to hear about the charges but that sums up banks for you..get a letter off to them pronto demanding your charges back.If you are not sure what has been charged send off a recorded SAR request (on the forums here) which will cost £10 (use a postal order)they have 40 days to comply and should send all statements on the account.

I have a barclays account standing at 1200 from being overdrawn by 200.My SAR showed charges of £2000 from over six years.Got my letter in and waiting to hear back from them since supreme court case..

If they get shirty remind them you are awaiting the SAR request

[WWS]

.........

Edited December 14, 2009 by WWS

[slick132]

Hi jj69,

 

The thread you posted on was an old one, reactivated by a post (now removed) which was made in the wrong forum.

 

I've moved your post and replies into your own thread which you can use from now on.

 

Wait for the redrafted Site POC's and letters and then act according to Site guidelines.

 

Hi WWS,

 

As a bank employee, you should see the Site rules concerning this - A Word from the Banks - The Consumer Forums

 

While I'm sure what you say about bank charges reflects what you've been told, the Site is clear that bank charge reclaims can go ahead despite the recent ruling handed down by the Supreme Court.

 

There's more to read about this in these announcements :-

 

The Consumer Forums - Announcements in Forum : Barclaycard

 

The Consumer Forums - Announcements in Forum : Barclaycard

 

[slick132]

Hi jj,

 

I assume, from your post, that you have written to Barclays seeking a refund but have not yet filed a court claim.

 

Please confirm.

[MARTIN3030]

I work in Barclays Collections

 

You will find that shortly the bank will begin writing to all customers who made complaints regarding the unfair charging case. From information I have, Barclays will deal with these on an individual basis, but most are likely to be advised that the charges are fair and no refund will be due.

 

SAR is a good way of finding out what you've been charged, but will not get you anything back unless the circumstances are different from the standard "I think the charges are unfair"

 

What you should have done (knowing that no money was going into the account) was cancelled the direct debits coming out. The bank advises you everytime one fails. It is your responsibilty to either service them or cancel them, you cant expect the bank to pay them without funds in your account.

 

What you should now do is call either your Business Account Manager or Barclays Collections and arrange to pay back the debt over a period. Barclays will be happy to split the payment over 6 months to get your account back to order.

 

If you do nothing you will eventually lose your overdraft facility and be liable for the whole debt at once.

 

Hope this helps

 

 

WWS thank you for your words of wisdom.

Equally maybe I can return the favour.

 

quote

 

"You will find that shortly the bank will begin writing to all customers who made complaints regarding the unfair charging case. From information I have, Barclays will deal with these on an individual basis, but most are likely to be advised that the charges are fair and no refund will be due."

 

You will find that shortly customers will begin writing to Barclays with more complaints regarding unfair charges,which will approach from different angles to those previously seen.Barclays will of course continue to maintain that the charges are fair even though most people in England agree they are not.

 

 

SAR is a good way of finding out what you've been charged, but will not get you anything back unless the circumstances are different from the standard "I think the charges are unfair"

 

Most people on CAG know the criteria for seeking a SAR and for those who are unsure,details are widely available for them.

We have found that in many instances a SAR has been the ONLY way to determine the real level of charges since Barclays have not exactly been too quick to hand the figures to customers on a plate.

 

 

What you should have done (knowing that no money was going into the account) was cancelled the direct debits coming out. The bank advises you everytime one fails. It is your responsibilty to either service them or cancel them, you cant expect the bank to pay them without funds in your account.

 

In an ideal world where there is a level playing field that gives both parties fairness,its easy to say this.

The truth is that Barclays were happy to take excessive fees charges that were not in proportion to its real costs and did not tell customers then "What they should have done "

I did not see in any terms and conditions I had from Barclays that I should cancel direct debits because Barclays charges were not proportionate.

No one expects the bank to pay them if theres no money in the account-they have shown that they will take charges by other means aside from any failed instructions.

 

What you should now do is call either your Business Account Manager or Barclays Collections and arrange to pay back the debt over a period. Barclays will be happy to split the payment over 6 months to get your account back to order.

 

This is all very convenient for Barclays who have shown nothing but contempt for customers seeking a fair deal and saw so many businesses go to the wall after taking excessive charges.

My business account manager was very keen to look at my account-none so much every month after taking commission charges that made the account go even further into the red.(those commission charges by the way already comprised of charges from previous snatches )

 

If you do nothing you will eventually lose your overdraft facility and be liable for the whole debt at once.

 

There are many instances where people DID do something and yet still lost their overdraft facility-I know I am one of them.

Barclays are only interested in Barclays.

 

 

I find your post quite offensive as I am sure will most Barclays customers who have experienced overcharging and bullying tactics in their quest to have charges refunded.

 

If you think the fight is over-then you have more to learn than you have to give advice here.

Go back and let them know at Churchill place-my guess is that they will have their work cut out in the coming weeks and months.

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello Folks!

 

Another myth that needs to be dispelled, is the banking Fairy Story that an Overdraft Boundary is a flexible thing, over which the banks have little control should one of their beastly Customers have the cheek to breach it.

 

All banks, and Barclays in particular, have always held absolute power over this apparently flexible boundary between Authorised and Unauthorised Overdraft Debt.

 

When they want to enforce an Overdraft or Account Limit (such as zero), they can do so and will have absolutely no hesitation doing so when it suits them. Once they flick the switch to enforce it, not a single penny will go out beyond that which has truly been Authorised by the bank.

 

If an Account ends up going over the Authorised Limit, that is only because the bank has allowed it. Their systems are far too sophisticated, supervised and controlled to suggest they have no control over what goes out.

 

It is important to understand that the banks' talk of Unauthorised Overdrafts is a complete banking fiction. There is no such thing. Every penny below zero is always Authorised by the bank. However, in order to justify their malicious Charging Tactics, they instead like to pretend that there is an easily breached threshold, in order to plead that they are the innocent party left with no choice but to penalise their Customers for breaching (or often for just attempting to breach), these wholly imaginary thresholds.

 

Furthermore, the evidence from countless hundreds of thousands of Customers, suggests that the way the banks have manipulated these imaginary limits, has clearly been done in order to levy wholly obscene Charges that go hand in glove with them. There is no doubt that the banks have deliberately engineered a significant level of Consumer debt.

 

Barclays employees are also briefed on how to use an Exit Strategy once the bank has decided to dispense with a Customer. We have yet to see the full written details of this, but the evidence confirms that it appears to involve a systematic ramping up of Charges just before the bank pulls the Customer's Overdraft and Account(s).

 

The bank will claim that the Customer has lost control of the Account(s) when, in truth, it is the bank that has deliberately taken away the control from them.

 

This is the same tactic employed by many of the Credit Card banks, who are known to inflate interest rates and the frequency of charges in order to create a significantly larger End Stage Debt once an Exit Strategy has been put into motion. This Inflated Debt is then used in a variety of ways, either to boost the sums to be claimed via Litigation, or to boost the Tax Loss, or to boost the residual offer price when selling the Inflated Debt to the Debt Collection Circus (usually a combination of the last two, unless the bank thinks the Consumer has assets sufficiently valuable to justify the costs and slight risks of proceeding with Litigation).

 

Funnily enough, none of these issues were mentioned by the recent Poster above. They were simply trotting out the tired old banking Party Line: you owe, so you must pay it.

 

Repeat after me: there is no such thing as an Unauthorised Overdraft.

 

Cheers,

BRW

[jj69]

Hi jj,

 

I assume, from your post, that you have written to Barclays seeking a refund but have not yet filed a court claim.

 

Please confirm.

 

Hi Slick....

Thanks for moving to a new thread...

Yes letter sent requesting 2k back...Wescott have it at the moment,they rang me to say ' did I know the court ruled in favour of the banks ' when can I pay...dont miss a trick do they lol...kindly reminded them that I still have outstanding query with Barclays and until I recieve a letter they are getting nought...also reminded them that it looks like another challenge could be made so until them they can go jump..

[jj69]

I work in Barclays Collections

 

You will find that shortly the bank will begin writing to all customers who made complaints regarding the unfair charging case. From information I have, Barclays will deal with these on an individual basis, but most are likely to be advised that the charges are fair and no refund will be due.

 

SAR is a good way of finding out what you've been charged, but will not get you anything back unless the circumstances are different from the standard "I think the charges are unfair"

 

What you should have done (knowing that no money was going into the account) was cancelled the direct debits coming out. The bank advises you everytime one fails. It is your responsibilty to either service them or cancel them, you cant expect the bank to pay them without funds in your account.

 

What you should now do is call either your Business Account Manager or Barclays Collections and arrange to pay back the debt over a period. Barclays will be happy to split the payment over 6 months to get your account back to order.

 

If you do nothing you will eventually lose your overdraft facility and be liable for the whole debt at once.

 

Hope this helps

 

WWS thanks for those comments but as others have pointed out by heaping on more and more charges does not help the coustomer resolve the issue or bring the account back under control..

About 18 months ago I lost my job and was without work for two months,Barclays were terrible at trying to help resovle the problem and the collections dept kept asking for unrealistic sums to pay into the account like 200 one week 300 the next despite that fact I was stuggling to afford my mortgage they just wanted more money and heaped on the charges..in the end it got offloaded to DCA's and written off by Barclays so please tell me how this course of action has benefited myself or Barclays one bit..

I'm not having a go as you do the job you do thats fair enough but sometimes people just need some time to sort their banking issues,time which is not given by most banks but plenty of time for profit making first...

[MARTIN3030]

Yes well said....interesting how Barclays didnt go cap in hand to the GOV for cash to get them by...reason is quite simply they dont need to and no way was they going to agree to any conditions attatched if they did.

If there was an Xfactor equivalant for banks with no scruples Barclays would take 1st 2nd and 3rd place....no one else would get a look in.

[jj69]

Yes well said....interesting how Barclays didnt go cap in hand to the GOV for cash to get them by...reason is quite simply they dont need to and no way was they going to agree to any conditions attatched if they did.

If there was an Xfactor equivalant for banks with no scruples Barclays would take 1st 2nd and 3rd place....no one else would get a look in.

 

 

All three places indeed..the sickest joke was the fact I had been a customer for over 12yrs and yes I did go very rarely overdrawn sometimes apart from that my account was in kept in good order I was even paying an account fee of £5 month for all the worthless extra's you get but hey ho I was satisified enough.After the job loss and bounced D/D's the charges piled on..after that customer loyalty went out the window.

A bitter pill to swallow but now it has made me wiser.I now have two basic bank accounts with no overdraft facilities,when the bank asks my if I want a nw account I flatly refuse..I am now watching every penny that goes in and out..

[MARTIN3030]

Seems WWS has removed his posts ?

Could it be a realisation that his comments did not hold any water on CAG ?

[jj69]

Seems WWS has removed his posts ?

Could it be a realisation that his comments did not hold any water on CAG ?

 

 

That is a shame..he/she should be able to post comments as I stated that's the job he/she does and fair enough I don't have a problem with that..

I'm not individually going after any people but those who are from Banks,DCA's etc that post on here will face some critiscism from those most affected.

My current job involves security clearance thanks to my trashed credit rating was close to losing that job as I was seen as a potential for bribery from the DVA , until I sat down with HR and explained the situation with previous job losses..DCA's and banks have that much power on your credit ratings that you feel powerless to act,that and the fact they send letters stating court action etc etc,it's only thanks to this site that I have pulled things around,saved my house from being repossed and started paying my essential bills again..

WWS your comments are welcome don't leave the forum if you have valid comments to post and feel you need to put your point across..

[MARTIN3030]

I saw it as more of an ultimatum as opposed to advice.

Lets be honest this site is here for the benefit of progress and justice.

WWS did not inform CAGGERS of anything they didnt know already-he just sought to demonstrate the same arrogance that we have been led to expect-our charges are fair,we wont be paying them back,pay us any arrears or else we will come after you.

 

Hmn I think this sort of advice is best left to the CSA and Credit today forums-he must have got off at the wrong station.

[jj69]

I saw it as more of an ultimatum as opposed to advice.

Lets be honest this site is here for the benefit of progress and justice.

WWS did not inform CAGGERS of anything they didnt know already-he just sought to demonstrate the same arrogance that we have been led to expect-our charges are fair,we wont be paying them back,pay us any arrears or else we will come after you.

 

Hmn I think this sort of advice is best left to the CSA and Credit today forums-he must have got off at the wrong station.

 

 

Lol...you could be right on that first comment...

All I know is this site is essential to help you put your case across...

As I found out in a recent visit to my local court to have a set aside actioned the DJ turned around and said ' where are you getting your information from ' (when I was submitting my defence etc)..I told a little white lie and said ' online solicitors ' (not letting him know about these sites) his response ' well I don't agree with these things ' ..makes you wonder if we have any justice in this country when an individual cant research his own defence before a court appearance.

He turned down the Set aside anyway but then the company who bought the case against me backed down and discontinued forcing the judge to have the case struck out...

[Rooster-UK]

He may have deleted his post, but the entire erroneous contents of his post have been quoted in post #8.

 

Take a look Barclays!

[MARTIN3030]

Lol...you could be right on that first comment...

All I know is this site is essential to help you put your case across...

As I found out in a recent visit to my local court to have a set aside actioned the DJ turned around and said ' where are you getting your information from ' (when I was submitting my defence etc)..I told a little white lie and said ' online solicitors ' (not letting him know about these sites) his response ' well I don't agree with these things ' ..makes you wonder if we have any justice in this country when an individual cant research his own defence before a court appearance.

He turned down the Set aside anyway but then the company who bought the case against me backed down and discontinued forcing the judge to have the case struck out...

 

 

Judges are like the rest of us-at the end of the day they have their own thoughts,opinions,and ways of doing things.

We rely on them to be fair,level headed and decisive..but as we have seen they can be like chalk and cheese when it comes to delivering Judgements and voicing their personal opinions.

I suppose in some instances we have had some excellent results from Judges that favour the CAG cause-in others the result has been pretty much a foregone conclusuion.

In a perfect world we would have no need to be making any sorts of comparisons......because there wouldnt be any unfair charges !