MKDP Claimform - Barclaycard **Claim Discontinued**

[Nivagey]

Hi, last week I sent a template letter to Barclaycard requesting a copy of my original credit agreement from them.

I received this letter back from them stating they do not have to send the original copy to me.

 

Could anyone please advise if this letter from Barclaycard is correct

and they do not have to provide the original contract?

 

Thank you for your help

 

http://tinypic.com/r/rvvnkg/6

 

Image - TinyPic - Free Image Hosting, Photo Sharing & Video Hosting

Edited December 6, 2009 by Nivagey
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[cerberusalert]

The thumbnails are too small, can you upload your original files to TinyPic - Free Image Hosting, Photo Sharing & Video Hosting and then copy & paste the Urls back here?

[Nivagey]

Hi , thanks for letting me know that, I will give it a go now. Thanks again.

[cerberusalert]

It's their usual bull template letter. They do say that they are sending a copy under separate cover, so you should get it within a couple of days if they manage to find it, which is doubtful knowing them. The rest of the letter is just gobbledygook trying to intimidate.

[Nivagey]

Hi thanks for that. I did notice that they said they would be sending a copy of your "current" executed credit agreement? Does this mean they do not have a copy of the original and will not send that? Thanks again.

[cerberusalert]

Barclays are infamous for not sending any documentation, whether it's because they've destroyed them or they've been warehoused & they cannot find them is anyone's guess, but suffice to say they have to send you a 'True' copy of your executed agreement which you signed otherwise they cannot take any enforcement action.

[Nivagey]

So would I be right in thinking that "if" they can not produce a copy of the "original signed" credit agreement with my actual signatuer on it from before May 1985 they can not take any inforcement action? Sorry if iI sound a bit slow Thank you for you help.

[cerberusalert]

Yes you would be correct.

[Nivagey]

Cool, thank you very much! All the best !

[gyos]

Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1557)

9 Copies of old agreements and security instruments where the agreement or security instrument has been lost etc

 

Any copy of an executed agreement made before 19th May 1985 or of a security instrument relating to security provided before that date which is given to the debtor, hirer or surety under any provision of the Act on or after that date may comprise an easily legible statement of the current terms of the agreement or security as the case may be insofar as they are known to the creditor or owner where, due to an accident or some other cause beyond his control, the creditor or owner does not have in his possession the executed agreement or security instrument or any copy thereof.

 

Basically, they are admitting there is no agreement.

[Nivagey]

Hi , Thank you very much for that, will be interesting to see what happens next. Thanks again for everyones help. All the best!

[Nivagey]

Hello again Could anyone help me on this one please? This is the letter from Barclaycard today regarding the letter of dispute I sent them as they would or could not produce the "original true copy" of my agreement the I had requested. Thanks

 

 

Image - TinyPic - Free Image Hosting, Photo Sharing & Video Hosting

 

Image - TinyPic - Free Image Hosting, Photo Sharing & Video Hosting

 

Image - TinyPic - Free Image Hosting, Photo Sharing & Video Hosting

[jet83]

Hi Nivagey.

 

What barclaycard have sent you looks exactly the same as what i received from them back in May. I wouldn't worry about it to much to be honest they're just trying to fob you off. After i received this letter from barclaycard, cerberusalert advised me to either go down the CPR 31.16 request route or send a Subject Access Request, i chose to send them the Subject Access Request and i would personally advise you do the same as they have to produce all the information they hold on you and serves two purposes

[IdaInFife]

threads merged.

 

Please stick to the one thread for the same issue thanks

 

Ida x

[jet83]

Sorry pressed wrong button.

 

As i was i saying it serves to purposes as they have to produce the CCA and also claim back unfair charges which they may have added to your a/c.

 

I see you have already had advice from cerberus who knows an awfully lot more than me, i'm sure he will advise you further.

[citizenB]

jet83. Sorry, the company do not need to send a copy of the agreement within a Subject Access Request.

 

The information commissioner will not support any complaint made that a creditor did not supply a CCA within the DPA1998 request as it is covered by another act ie CCA 1974

 

HTH.

 

What you should receive from a subject access request is other and usually more interesting information.

[jet83]

Hi Citizen B, fair enough i'm certainly not going argue with you, thats how i understood to be but i guess i was wrong. I still made a complaint to the ICO anyway, althogh all these associations seem to be on the side of the banks rather than the consumer, when ever i've had any dealings with them anyway

 

In their reply to my sar, Barclaycard did actualy send me an application form claiming it to be the original agreement, when all i had from my cca requsets were printed off T&C's so its got to be worth a go anyway.

[Nivagey]

Hi thanks guys for this, however im still confused as what to do next Barclaycard seem adament that they do not need to provide it and we are not in "dispute". Any advice as to what I should do now? Thanks

[cerberusalert]

Hi thanks guys for this, however im still confused as what to do next Barclaycard seem adament that they do not need to provide it and we are not in "dispute". Any advice as to what I should do now? Thanks

 

I'd be tempted to send them Scots letter below & see what their response is;

 

Re: my request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974

 

Thank you for your recent letter sent to me, the contents of which are noted. I appreciate your quick response to my original letter. However, the reply received by me does not fulfil your requirements under the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

The Act demands that I be supplied with a true copy of any properly executed credit agreement that exists in relation to the above account. I may ask for this on demand providing that a fee of £1.00 is paid. This fee was sent with my original letter.

 

My request remains outstanding. The items you sent in your reply, does not constitute a true copy of any credit agreement that may or may not have been signed by me on the opening of this account. It neither confirms that I am liable for any alleged debt to you, nor gives me any chance to evaluate whether any original agreement was ‘properly executed’.

 

I still require you to send me a true copy of the original credit agreement that you allege exists. As you will know, under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, a judge is not permitted to make any enforcement order unless the creditor can provide a true signed copy of the original credit agreement. This means that unless you can produce such an agreement, this alleged debt is not enforceable in law.

 

You had until XX/XX/2008 to provide me with the true copy I requested. You are now in default of my request. Any account I hold with you is now in legal dispute. Whilst the account remains in dispute, you are not permitted to ask for any payment, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you. Furthermore, whilst the dispute remains, you are not entitled to charge any interest on the account, nor make any further charges to the account. Additionally, you are not entitled to register any information on this account with any credit reference agency.

 

To register information with a credit reference agency, you must have written consent from the customer to collate and share such information. This consent is given in the form of a signed credit agreement, so until you produce such an agreement, you may not do this.

 

The requirement for consent to share data is a clear requirement of the Data Protection Act 1998. any such attempts to share my data without my consent will be met with a complaint to the Information Commissioners Office

 

To sum up, I will not be making any further payments to you until you provide me with the document I have requested. Whilst you remain in default of my request, you are not permitted to take any action against this account. This includes adding further charges and passing any information to the credit reference agencies.

 

Should you not have any signed credit agreement in relation to this alleged debt, please confirm this in writing to me.

 

 

I look forward to your reply.

 

Yours faithfully

Print name do not sign

 

**amend to suit your circumstances.**

[Nivagey]

Hi Cerberusalert,

 

Sorry mate I might have confused things a little here, I have sent "that" letter (thanks) the reply I got from them on the 24th is posted in my 24th Dec thread, its 3 pages long,they claim they still dont have to produce the original copy and say we are not in dispute and I have to carry on as normal or they may register a default against me with the credit reference agencies Thanks

[cerberusalert]

Have a read through these threads;

why you shouldnt use section 77/78 CCA 1974 if you want the signed agreement - The Consumer Forums

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/165349-smt37-morgan-stanley-goldfish.html

[Nivagey]

Mate im totally confused now. So by sending a £1.00 postal order in the very first letter I sent to Barclaycard then was incorrect? The letter of formal request Ref 77(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 requesting the a "true copy" of the signed agreement. The thread from the post you have just mailed me below seems to imply that this request was not the right way to go?

 

"So what can you do to get the correct information that you need? Well, firstly, you need to write to the lender and ask for the agreement making sure that you make it clear you require a copy of the signed agreement in its original form and that the request you are making is NOT made under the Consumer Credit Act 1974".

[cerberusalert]

Mate im totally confused now. So by sending a £1.00 postal order in the very first letter I sent to Barclaycard then was incorrect?

In the majority of cases a CCA request is sufficient & the majority of creditors will in fact supply a full copy of any agreement. However there are some, Barclays being one of them, who are notorious for refusing point blank to supply any information whatsoever... even SARs.

[Nivagey]

If they refuse point blank to supply and I do nothing, can they still take action against me then i.e take me to court? Reading the threads on the posts you gave me it seems unless they can produce the original signed agreement in court they can do noting? Sorry if I seem a bit dim Thanks

[cerberusalert]

If they bring court action you can bring them to 'strict proof' where they will have to produce the original agreement.

 

Some creditors will go the 'full mile' by attempting to gain a CCJ in the absence of a CCA in the hope that they will win by default but if you contest they withdraw at the last minute.