Supreme court rules

[renegotiation]

but lets look at this calmly, we now know the oft cannot asses the FAIRNESS of the charges, but lets go back to when we first started claiming our charges back, i for 1 never claimed unfairness on my court papers, i claimed under the fact that penalty charges where not enforcable under english contract law. is that not an option still????

 

What we saw today was naked power exposed. It's been decided that us plebs won't get justice on this. All avenues will be stopped. End of story. The whole structure of how we are governed needs to change. The system isn't fit for purpose. This isn't about money to me. My parents were only due back a couple of hundred in total. No small amount I know, but this is about democracy. And I just saw Angela Knight on TV too!!! Arghhh!!!!!!!!!

Edited November 25, 2009 by renegotiation

[MondeoST24]

"But it does not mean the fight against unfair charges is over.

The Office of Fair Trading (OFT) is expected to continue to push for fairness to apply to charges. The ruling stated it can still assess the fairness of charges but under different grounds."

[TenaciousC]

Let's not forget that the government is a major shareholder in a number of the banks in question... it was never going to go as planned.

 

I expect that the bankers lined the pockets (in the proverbial manner) of the Judges and Ministers, that or they're serious investors in some/all of the said banks, how else can they arrive at this baseless descision?

 

If ever we needed evidence that this country is becomming corrupt, then this is it. You do tend to start seeing suspicious headline judgements in corrupt countries, and now this is starting to show here.. ho hum.

[peterlucas]

Let's be clear about this. The court DID NOT say the charges are not unfair. They were not looking at that. They said the OFT can not asses them for unfairness. So I'm applying to have my stays lifted, and then we'll see if NatScum and HSBScum want to settle, otherwise we'll have it out. Unfairness has not been considered by the court, the charges have not been ruled on, mearly assessment by the Office of Bringing Obstructive Litigation. So let's stick two fingers up at the banks and their lackeys at the OFT, Supreme Court and FSA (the worst bunch of them all in my view) and get our motions to lift the stays filed today. 1 million cases stayed, the unfairness argument WILL be heard if we make it heard. The fight back begins now!

[mickrick]

Forget it, its all over. This country is corrupt, not to the core but from the core. Banks now have carte blanche to charge us for whatever they want, whenever they want. And with no right of appeal to the European Court Of Justice as well. This is a stitch up of immense proportions. There should be an investigation into the Supreme Court, never mind banks.

 

Will the last one out of the country please turn out the lights?

[Consumer dude]

Time to march against this system of corruption..

[onestressedwoman]

What is stopping us from going to the high court and standing a protest on this decision people power !

 

I'm living in a dream world again people have no power anymore to many decisions being made across the board with no mass public opinion

 

We have to fight can't this go to the european court as they would have taken it if we won

[Sunshine54]

Peter - I like your style!

 

In a lot of cases this is actually all that we can do.

 

I have an overdraft of £2k and charges/interest account for £1900 of that sum so it's been on hold for months awaiting the outcome today.

 

I can't afford to repay the amount so will have to fight.

 

The charges ARE unfair and we need to shout that from the rooftops (and the courtrooms)

[100mel]

Agreed - just proves what a totally amoral and corrupt system we live under. After all this government can prop up HBOS secretly to the tune of over 60m of our money and keep it quiet for 12 months - if you are a bank you can get away with anything and then be bailed out when in trouble - doesn't seem to work for those of us who have lost jobs, houses etc

 

Joe Public doesn't have a hope

 

My advice to any graduate and young people is leave the country now

[enoughisenough]

I agree. A strategy for continuing to issue claim and lift stays where these claims have been brought is of fundamental importance. They will run scared of fighting their corner. These are very very narrow grounds.

[enoughisenough]

55 Guests...

[Crapstone]

 

Will the last one out of the country please turn out the lights?

 

Gladly and I'll slam the flamin door shut. In just a short space of time I've managed to pursuade 3 people to withdraw all but essential money from their banks today...Anyone fancy starting a secure mattress company?

[vegnomeat]

It's pretty simple really, don't break the rules and there aren't any penalty charges.

 

What is it with you people ?

[danmoz98]

I also have pending claim with Lloyds and I guess they will now contact me to repay. A hearing in our favour would have have reduced the deby by over 50 %.

 

If I understand it correctly this means the banks are free to charge what they want for their services.

 

If this is the case then a law should be passed immediately to ensure that charges are appropriate to recover reasonable costs not as a revenue generator.

 

Obviously the Unfair Contract Terms Contract Act does not cover this but by the sound of it the Supreme Court had decided it is not possible to unravel the true cost of the banks products and services.

 

Given, I lost my job in August and not working this is a very poor outcome for me and got knows what I will do when they come calling.

 

Should i contact them or wait for them to come to me?

 

ST

 

It's already a revenue generator, from the BBC article;

 

"At stake is an estimated £2.6bn of annual income for the banks, which had appealed against earlier rulings. "

 

£2.6billion a year from screwing customers!

[onestressedwoman]

Crapstone what an idea - thet would be the kick up the rear that they deserve !!!

 

All my money as of today will no longer be deposited into my account

[Crapstone]

It's pretty simple really, don't break the rules and there aren't any penalty charges.

 

What is it with you people ?

 

You don't have to break any rules. Haven't you got more important things to do than gloat and preach rubbish that you obviously know nothing about?

[enoughisenough]

Financial institutions never face any penalties and Never break the rules? That's why the FSA has issued a record £28 million in fines to financial firms. Get it into your head that without this revenue stream the banks will be determined to grab their billions from the taxpayer and every current holder in the land.

 

Anyone with a current account. Move it if you can to the Nationwide or the Co-op. Where the customers are the shareholders. Let the High Street Robbers go back to their profitable investment banking that caused the economic meltdown.

[peterlucas]

It's pretty simple really, don't break the rules and there aren't any penalty charges.

 

What is it with you people ?

 

We rather like the idea of everyone having to follow the law you see. Strange idea I know.

[TenaciousC]

Joe Public doesn't have a hope

 

My advice to any graduate and young people is leave the country now

 

Is there a way to teach them a proglonged lesson?

 

Is there a workable way to boycott the banking system enough to kick them hard and repeatedly where it hurts the bankers most.. in their pockets?

 

If this had been in France there'd be a strike or riot about now, that would scare the hell outta the government here there'd be brown benches in the houses commons/lords.

I suppose that sort of prostest is not really the decent Anglo Saxon thing to do.

 

I'm mid thirties and I am a full time student, and once I finish my degree, I'm outta here!

[paulrockliffe]

So the court has said the OFT don't have the power to deal with this issue on our behalf? When you put it like that, it sounds like a good thing.

 

I'd much rather have competent people fighting the case on the correct grounds rather than another year or three of OFT incompetence.

 

At least this ruling will get stays lifted and allow the real issues to be examined in a timely manor if only on an individual basis.

 

It really is just a stalling tactic the way this whole process has been put together. How long has been wasted deciding whether the OFT can bring the case?

 

We will get there in the end.

[Sunshine54]

let the Guests read and learn

 

This is the most influential consumer group in the country and we need to make sure that we exert that influence as strongly as we can.

 

The charges are unfair - FACT

Most banks have reduced their charges as they acknowledge this - FACT

This judgement does not contradict this - FACT

 

As Peter said, a million cases on hold. lets get them moving and create a groundswell that can't be ignored.

Edited November 25, 2009 by Sunshine54
typo

[speedtrip]

I think Peter could be right about lifting the stay.

 

However, I think this also needs a co-ordinated campaign to clearly state how unhappy with the decision we consumers are:

 

Options:

 

1) A petition on the No 10 webisite express our disgust and outrage urging the goverment to overturn this decision.

 

2) A Rally in Central London to follow up the above.

 

Whatever we do we shouldnt just roll over and die.

 

ST

[danmoz98]

I take it this means you can still persue claims, still go to court and still demand the banks show their true costs involved in their 'charges'?

 

As we know they won't want to show their costs then they'll continue to pay out as before?

[redwood]

Ok the decision went for the banks, did anyone really expect anything different?, the banks, the government, the Law Lords, does anyone still believe they are seperate entities?. Whilst we were picking a few £100`s here and there they were content to pay out, but we went for the big one and they finally bit back. Now when the heats gone out of this ruling, we'll find another way, and the fight will be back on, is it over? is it hell

[Marivanna]

The supreme court has just ruled in favour of banks in row over overdraft charges. What will happen next ? Discuss..

 

This must be absolutely devastating for everyone with suspended claims.

 

They've won on a sort of a technicality - definition of 'fair' price of core product. It always seemed to me a weak argument and I watched in amusement the row of wins by Consumer Group. Mind, I did not want banks to win.

 

They say there are other avenues. So here is one idea.

 

I worked for the bank, not any more.

 

When approached by a customer with questions about their charges, it was fairly easy to explain 'why'. However, I struggled to explain 'why this much'

 

In almost third of the cases the amounts were not in accordance with the rules in customers' T&C. In banks favour.

 

Example from memory. The T&C said that bank would not charge more than the actual unauthorised OD was. If the charge was, say £25, and UOD £14.30 - guess how much would appear on the account? It got more complicated in there were couple of small UOD one after another.

 

I sought help from superiors and superiors of superiors, training officers just to get myself a bad image and total despair of hysterical snigger when I discovered they did not know the difference between round-up and round-down.

 

My advise - the major battle is lost, you cannot loose any more so go for it and request recalculation - and them sue for the breach of contract/fraud/whatever.