Help with Halifax DN & Card Termination Letter

[smactaff55]

Hi All

This is my first thread and may I say this site is a Godsend.

I have read numerous threads and must say that the advice and help given is invaluable, first class and helps us " Debtors " relax more.

I attach a Halifax DN & Credit Card Termination letter I have received from HAFILAX ( Note my spelling ) . Could I please have some feedback & advice from you fellow CAGGERS agreeing with what I'm thinking.

The DN, IMO, is invalid as it has conflicting details & "dates by given" + a couple of other unclear statements as previously put up on HAFILAX threads. Also the Term letter has been sent and dated prior to the date I was given on the original invalid DN by which to settle. Am I right in thinking the HAFILAX have shot themselves in the foot!!??

I did request a copy CCA from Albion Debt Collections and that they forward to HAFILAX and the 12 + 2 days are now up. I have a receipt that Albion received the Rec Del 4/11/2009. However, I did not send a £1 fee. I have had no ack but still continue to receive tel calls and usual DCA demand letters

 

YOU DON'T MESS WITH THE ZOHAN!!!

Halifax DN Page 1.doc

Halifax DN Page 2.doc

Halifax Credit Card Termination.RTF

[alfwithhair]

well IMO the default notice looks ok to me, contains the required infomation and give more than the 14 clear days to rectify.

However they have terminated the account before the remedy date stated on the DN, so could have as you say shot themselves 'unlawful recisson' of the agreement, so could only claim the arrears and not the full balance. But wait for some other opinions, this is only my view, not a legal statement of fact

[smactaff55]

Thanks for your quick reply alf

My reason; DN is OK dated 3/9/2009, payment by 24/9/2009 but on Page 2 of DN, paragraph 3 it then states reuested amount WITHIN 28 DAYS OF THE DATE OF THIS LETTER ie 3/9 equating to 1/10/2009 + approx 2/4 days re posting contradicting Page 1 date 24/9/2009.

Am I being too picky?

[alfwithhair]

That reference appears to relate to the time limit before they will pass the information to the CRA's

But as you say is some what mis-leading

Wait and see what others have to say

[Guest HeftyHippo]

In my limited experience, the DN is flawed for the reasons you say. There is a contradiction between the dates given on the first and second pages. One gives you until 24 Sept, the second page gives you until 3 Sept + 28days = 1 Oct to pay the sum OR make an arrangement to do so.... WHAT did they want you to do? That's without looking at the format and words used, there may be other faults also

 

What Alf says about the later date being when they will report you to the CRA is correct, but what about the 'gap' between the dates on the pages? The first date says if you pay by this date no further action will be taken. The second is when they report you to the CRA.... what were they intending to do inbetween? The legislation says they have to be clear about their actions/intentions, and they are NOT clear about what they will do if you pay after the first date but before the second. At the least, they are unclear, at worst contradictory and misleading.

 

The difficulty with arguing about that with a judge is that his opinion of whether it is clear or not is a lottery

 

However, fortunately, they issued the Termination a long way before even the earliest date. So, they didn't even give you the shortest time to make good the default, let alone the longer time of Oct 1st to either pay the amount OR make an arrangement. Fortunately also, the Termination is clear and unambiguous!

Edited November 24, 2009 by HeftyHippo

[smactaff55]

HH

Thanks for your contribution and observations to this thread

IMO someone @ HAFILAX has dropped a b******. They've issued the DN giving me 21 days in error and the term letter has automatically been issued after 14 days without being checked to DN.

I fully take on board your comment re any Judge

[Guest HeftyHippo]

I think you would need a lenient judge to agree its defective on that alone, but there may be other things wrong with it as well.

 

Happily, yu don't really need it, as the termination is crystal clear

[42man]

Date of the DN is the 3rd....Termination is the 16th even allowing for any postal days....they have not given you the required 14 days minimum...it is an unlawful recission of contract.

Edited November 24, 2009 by cerberusalert

[42man]

You might find this interesting - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-2166205.html

[42man]

• Failure of a default notice to be accurate not only invalidates the default notice (Woodchester Lease Management Services Ltd v Swain and Co - [2001] GCCR 2255) but is a unlawful rescission of contract which would not only prevent the court enforcing any alleged debt, but would also give rise to a potential counterclaim for damages where damage occurs to my credit rating (Kpohraror v Woolwich Building Society - [1996] 4 All ER 119)
  

[smactaff55]

42Man

Many thanks for your input.

I take it I can now proceed with issuing the relevant letter re unlawful recission found elsewhere in Halifax posts.

 

The issue of no true copy of CCA I assume is no longer in question as there is no longer a legal agreement??

[42man]

Well you could write to them pointing out their 'mistake' and ask them how they plan to compensate you

[42man]

AND they are still in default of your request for a copy of your agreement - you could try this (directly to the original creditor) - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/173201-why-you-shouldnt-use.html

[smactaff55]

Hi & thanks again 42Man

Seems pretty complicated to me

I was thinking on the lines of a letter similar to attached template from forums with relevant amendments to what I consider invalid DN and putting in my 2peneth re termination agreement. Again, am I right in thinking I won't need the CCA?

Invalid DN & Agreement Termination Letter Template 1.doc

[42man]

I would still pursue the CCA too but this way - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/173201-why-you-shouldnt-use.html as this cagger did - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/165349-smt37-morgan-stanley-goldfish-3.html#post2119750

[smactaff55]

Re opening this thread as further info. to advise.

Finally received copy CCA together with attached letter which IMO is unenforceable as no PT's or T & C's. Account was opened in 1988.

My help required is re final paragraph of attached letter re quote that debt collection can still continue even when account in dispute, which they are acknowledging in this letter. Since the date of this letter I have had a DCA threatogram from Westcot's.

Secondly, on this thread in my previous posts you'll see that an invalid default notice has been served and a termination letter which is an unlawful recission.

Another point is that I regularly check my Experian & Equifax files on line and neither of these are showing that I have any debts, defaults etc with Halifax. Has anybody any idea why this should be as I do not wish to contact Halifax to make them aware of this.

All comments on above will be greatly appreciated.

Halifax Letter Enclosing CCA.RTF