BAB v Nationwide [CCA] / CLaim form issued

[banksarebandits]

Would appreciate some URGENT advice on this on this. Solicitors have written saying they WILL issue proceedings in 7 days if they hear nothing from me.

 

Here is what they sent me in response to my s78 request;

 

 

Its dated in 05

 

No T & Cs were attached. I dont ever remember receiving any at the time of applying

 

this is one of 14 CCAs me and Mrs Babb are disputing but this is the first that solicitors have written saying they WILL issue proceedings so would appreciate ANYONES advice or opinion...even if i can buy some time...the 7 days runs out next thursday [19/11]. Will instantly respond if anyone reading this needs more info from me

 

Thanks

 

BAB

[banksarebandits]

bump

[banksarebandits]

Anyone?! [please]

[citizenB]

As far as I can see there are no prescribed terms. When did you receive the copy of the document?

 

Have you stopped paying or are you in a reduced payment plan ?

 

Have you received a Default notice ? If so when and can you scan it in for us please. Remove any personal information first. But we do need to know what date it was issued and any remedy date.

 

The letter you say the solicitors have sent. Can you remove any identifying information and post that up as well. Or, if it is easier.. type out exactly what they have written.

 

Meanwhile if you do receive a claim form let us know. You can always hit the panic button at the left side under your avatar. The little red n white triangle to alert the site team to a situation where urgency is required.

[banksarebandits]

Thank you

 

Just got in.Will try and post everything in next hour or so.[Dodgy computer and scanner and im useless at these things]

 

Thank you so much [i hereby undertake to make a donation next pay day...i waive any/all rights that such undertaking be evidenced in writing, signed etc...]

 

BAB

[banksarebandits]

citizen...fraid i couldnt scan last night....will be sorted this weekend...

[citizenB]

Hi bab.. right, will just move you over to the legal section. If you can type up the Particular of Claim for me please.. then we can get you on track.

 

 

BTW.. the panic / SOS / Report button is the red and white triangle to the left of the screen, under your name at the bottom.

[banksarebandits]

HERE IS THE D.N.

 

They have now issued proceedings. Have til 9th Jan to file Ack of service and until 23rd to file defence

 

ANY/ALL advice gratefully received.

 

BAB

 

[citizenB]

oooh, I like it.. :Dthey are asking for the Full Balance (not arrears) and have stated 14 days from the date of this letter... naughty.. but excellent news for you.

 

I dont suppose you received a Termination letter as well.. she says hopefully ?

 

You will also need to get a request to the solicitor for information ie statements showing how the amount they are claiming is made up. A copy of the original agreement. What they sent might be ok for the s78 request but NOT for court.

 

I would suggest you get the acknowledgement out of the way first. You can do this online using the password on the claim form.

 

Remember to print off the receipt as it is proof that you have acknowledged.

 

I am assuming you are going to be defending it all ? just read all the instructions carefully .

 

Any questions, just yell

 

Be back later with information re the information request (CPR)

[citizenB]

Ok, I have removed all personal identifiers from the POCs..

 

 

The particulars of claim

 

The Claimant's claim is for moneys due from the defendant under an agreement ['the agreement'] regulated by the Consumer Credit Act ['the Act']made between the Claimant and the Defendant.

 

 

Under the terms of the agreement, the claimant opened an account number 123456789 [ 'the account'] on DATE (prior to 2007) and issued a credit card to the defendant with a credit limit of XXXXXX The Defendant agreed to repay to the claimant together with interest calculated monthly as provided for in the agreement. The current balance is XXXXXX

 

 

...The defendant was served with Notice under s87[1] of the Act on DATE 2009 .The Notice was served on the Defendant by pre-paid first class post at; Correct Address

 

 

The defendant has failed to comply with the Default Notice and the claimant claims the sum of XXXXXXXX

 

I am not sure if it matters that they have not used the "£" sign.. it could be the restriction on characters that made them leave it off.

 

Edited January 6, 2010 by citizenB
font format commands removed

[banksarebandits]

Thanks Citizen

 

I managed to lock myself out of court website [!] so im gonna walk to Post Office and send Ack of Service by recorded [and keep receipt].Will re read your e-ms and post up anything else when i get back from Post Office...as Capt Oates said...'i may be some time....' [there a blizzard outside!]

 

BAB

[citizenB]

Hello Captain Oates.. did you get back from the post ok ?

 

You will need to send a request for further information to the solicitor. You should send this by recorded delivery (or special delivery if within your budget) and as soon as possible. You have until the 23rd to submit your defence, so we can hold of preparing one for a few days in order for them to supply the information requested. If not, then we will go with what we have and request the information missing at the AQ stage.

 

 

 

Dear Sir,

 

Re: (Claimant's name) v (Your name) Case No:

CPR 31.14 Request

 

On (date) I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the (Name) County Court.

 

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

 

Prior to the issue of proceedings I had delivered a request for the production of the agreement mentioned in the Claim Form and on which you rely. That request was not fully complied with.

 

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of [each of the following / the] document(s) mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

 

1 the agreement. You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

 

2 the default notice

 

3 the termination notice

 

4 statements showing how the amount claimed in the POCs has been arrived at.

 

 

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the document(s) I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter. Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

 

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

 

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

 

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In addition your statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extension of the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not less than 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my request and you must state the new date for filing my defence.

 

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

 

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, fail to request more time or fail to agree to an extension of time for the filing of my defence, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order.

 

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you.

 

yours faithfully

 

 

 

[banksarebandits]

Hi Citizen [and any other of you wonderful caggers who may be reading]

 

1 Ack of Service posted rec del [1st class] and kept receipt

 

2 Citizen. Have checked all their correspondence but have seen nothing that is either headed 'termination' nor any letter that contains anything that expressly states 'termination' in it.

BUT The DN was accompanied by a letter. Cant scan at the mo so have to type it verbatim

 

Dear Ms BAB

 

AC 123456789

CR LIM ....

OUTSTANDING BAL ...

YOUR AC IS UNDERPAID BY ....

 

Your account is currently underpaid. This is a breach of the condition of your Nationwide credit card agreement which requires you to make at least the minimum monthly payment of £5 or 3% of the account balance [whichever is higher].As a result your account has been suspended and all facilities withdrawn. Please do not attempt to use your card again.

I am attaching a Default Notice which you should read carefully.If we do not reach agreement an agreement with you, we will record information about your account with one or more Licensed Credit Reference Agencies.This may make it difficult for you to obtain credit in the future.

If you have any questions or to make a payment by credit or debit card please call...... 8-9 mon-fri [etc] Please quote your a/c no on all correspondence

Yours Sincerely

Mr Some bloke

Operations Manager

 

3 Citizen YES i am defending the whole lot and have said so on the Ack.

 

Citizen. I Will stop saying thanks cos i am worried it is may be beginning to sound a bit repetitive and therefore unmeant or even disingenuous. But i do so on the basis that each and every time i do reply to your generous help you understand that i do so with profound gratitude.

I owe this site so much. Get paid on friday..am [belatedly]donating a small[things very tight] expression of thanks. Can i set up a debit?

 

Hope this weathers not affecting you too badly

 

Thanks [last time!]

 

Bab

[banksarebandits]

Sorry Citizen! I saw your post of 20.23 AFTER i wrote my last!

 

Love the letter.Will send tomorrow [think i might use a pony to the Post Office next time!]

 

Does anything in my last post alter your draft letter?

 

BAB

[citizenB]

H i BAB, ugh.. isnt this weather awful.. we now have blizzards.. so staying at home is the best option .. if you can !

 

Nope, nothing you have posted makes an difference to the request you are making for information.

 

The thing is they they have screwed up big time with the Default notice. They can only ask for the arears at that stage and they have requested the full balance. Then they havent given you sufficient time to remedy in that they say you must cough up within 14 days of the DATE on the letter. This will not have given you the legally required 14 days to remedy. As no time has been allowed for post.. so depending on how sent you would have been short 2 days for 1st class and 4 days by second or UK / TNT mail.

 

So that makes it dodgy on two issues:D

 

A third but not so important is they are required to give a specific date not just "14 days".

 

There is a legal procedure to follow before they can ask for the full balance. that is...

 

Default for arears only giving a full 14 days to remedy

 

A termination notice

 

Letter before Action.

 

They have issued a default notice asking for the full balance and not giving you the correct amount of time to remedy. Just for starters

[banksarebandits]

Hi Citizen

 

Have typed out the letter but not mentioned the termination notice...will now insert,print and trek to the PO...will send Special...

 

Have got another claim from M&S...wheres best place to start thread,post up stuff etc?

 

BAB:oops:

[citizenB]

Hi Citizen

 

Have typed out the letter but not mentioned the termination notice...will now insert,print and trek to the PO...will send Special...

 

Have got another claim from M&S...wheres best place to start thread,post up stuff etc?

 

BAB:oops:

 

 

Right, I was going to direct you to the M&S Forum, but see this is a claim as well. So just start a new thread in the legal issues forum and let me have a link and I will pop along and have a look.

 

YOu can click on the legal issues link at the very top of the screen (after Debt Action Group)

[citizenB]

BAB,

 

I would suggest you check with both the Royal Mail Website and the Northampton Bulk processing centre that your Acknowledge has arrived with them:D

 

I think we agreed that your defence has to be in by the 23rd January didnt we ?

 

I wonder if you have locked yourself out of the Northampton site permanently ? Perhaps you could ask when you contact them re the AoS.

 

I think we should be prepared to mail the defence in which case if you havent received any documents from the solicitors by 18/19th then you should be putting in an embarrassed defence.

Edited January 11, 2010 by citizenB

[banksarebandits]

Hi Citizen/anyone else reading

 

Sorry for delay...overwhelming personal issues

 

Just spoke with court.They have my AOS [in time] and Defence IS due on 23rd Jan.

 

Can you help me with next step. Rather embarrassingly i have no idea what an embarrassed defence is let alone draft one.

As you anticipated, i have had no response from NATWIDE sols to my CPR 31.14 request [sent 7th Jan]. Should i ask them for more time to lodge defence or even apply to strike out/stay as i threatened?

 

Annoyingly, i seem to have a dodgy password so cant e-m the court. Locked out again this morning. When i spoke to court this am, they [understandably] would not discuss. i am MR BAB. Summons is against MRS BAB who is out at work and they will only discuss with her.Will get her to phone court when she can.

 

Citizen. Hate being lastminuteish again but any urgent advice much appreciated.Have to be offline for a couple of hours so no offence if you do reply and i dont respond immediately

 

Mr BAB

[banksarebandits]

Dear team

Please see my thread BAB v Nationwide [cca] in legal issues.

My defence is due 23rd Jan[!] and i am desparate for some advice.

I have been helped enormously by Citizen B. I tried to pm her but for some reason my browser keeps rejecting.

Please accept my apologies for using the red triangle thingy if this is a misuse of it but again i am doing so out of desparation and hope you can forgive and understand.

I have to leave for work now and will not be able to log on until this evening so please accept my apologies if anyone is kind enough to respond and i do not respond immediately

With deepest thanks

BAB

[citizenB]

Oh heck, if you are still locked out of the Northampton Web site then you are going to have to get this in the post tomorrow 22nd by Special Delivery (Next Day service). It is most important this is with the court by the 23rd.

 

Can you remember if the Default Notice was in fact posted 1st class mail.. did you keep the envelope ? Was it Royal Mail 1st Class or UK Mail 1st class?

 

I have just brought forward the POC for reference.

 

 

 

 

The particulars of claim

 

The Claimant's claim is for moneys due from the defendant under an agreement ['the agreement'] regulated by the Consumer Credit Act ['the Act']made between the Claimant and the Defendant.

 

 

Under the terms of the agreement, the claimant opened an account number 123456789 [ 'the account'] on DATE (prior to 2007) and issued a credit card to the defendant with a credit limit of XXXXXX The Defendant agreed to repay to the claimant together with interest calculated monthly as provided for in the agreement. The current balance is XXXXXX

 

 

...The defendant was served with Notice under s87[1] of the Act on DATE 2009 .The Notice was served on the Defendant by pre-paid first class post at; Correct Address

 

 

The defendant has failed to comply with the Default Notice and the claimant claims the sum of XXXXXXXX

 

Ok, holding defence. If Mrs BAB is able to phone Northampton and see if there is anyway they can get her access to the site then you will just need to type in the body of the defence. If you do have to send it Special Delivery then you will need to type it out in the format I have provided below.

 

 

 

 

In the xxxxxxxx

County Court

 

Claim number : XXXXXXXX

 

 

 

Between

xxxxxxxxxxx-

Claimant

 

 

and

 

 

xxxxxxxxxxxx-

Defendant

 

 

 

Defence

 

1. I xxxxxxxxx of xxxxxxxxxxxxx am the Defendant in this action and make the following statement as my defence to the claim made by xxxxxxxxxxxx

 

2. The Defendant is embarrassed in pleading to the Particulars of Claim as it stands at present, inter alia: -

 

3. The Claimants' particulars of claims disclose no legal cause of action and they are embarrassing to the Defendant as the Claimant's statement of case is insufficiently particularised and does not comply or even attempt to comply with CPR part 16. In this regard I wish to draw the courts attention to the following matters;

 

a) The Particulars of Claim are vague and insufficient and do not disclose an adequate statement of facts relating to or proceeding the alleged cause of action. No particulars are offered in relation to the nature of the written agreement referred to, the method the Claimant calculated any outstanding sums due, or any other matters necessary to substantiate the claimant's claim.

 

b) A copy of the purported written agreement that the Claimant cites in the Particulars of Claim, and which appears to form the basis upon which these proceedings have been brought, has not been served attached to the claim form.

 

c) A copy of any evidence of both the scope and nature of any default, and proof of any amount outstanding on the alleged accounts, has not been served attached to the claim form.

4. On receipt of the claim form the Defendant sent a request to the acting solicitors for further information in order to submit a fully particularised defence. The information requested via CPR31.14 was :

a) A copy of the agreement which forms the basis of this claim

b) A copy of the default notice.

c) Copies of statements showing how the amount claimed in the Particulars of Claim has been arrived at.

5. It has been confirmed via the Royal Mail website that the request was received and signed for (PUT DATE RECEIVED HERE) . There has been no response to my request.

 

6. Consequently, I deny all allegations on the particulars of claim and put the claimant to strict proof thereof

7. I respectfully request the court’s permission to submit an amended defence should the claimant file a fully particularised Particulars of Claim and provide the documents requested.

 

Statement of Truth

 

 

I xxxxxxxxxxx, believe the above statement to be true and factual

 

 

Signed .....................

 

Date

 

 

 

Edited January 21, 2010 by citizenB
formatting

[cymruambyth]

Hi this is one you can adapt.

1. I, XXXX of XXXXX make this statement as my defence to the claim brought by XXXXX.

 

2. The claimant’s particulars of claim are vague and fail to disclose any cause of action; they appear to be an abuse of the process in that they fail to deal with the basic rules of pleading in accordance with the CPR, even allowing for the constraints of the bulk issue system.

 

3. No documents supporting the claims in the particulars have been offered and despite two requests to the claimant for further information via CPR 31.14 dated XXX 2009 and XXXX 2009, both sent by recorded delivery, none has been forthcoming and as a result I cannot plead in defence to the claim.

 

4. Without clarification of the claimant’s claim, the defendant is extremely disadvantaged and as the claimant’s claim appears without merit, the defendant asks to be allowed to submit a fully particularised defence should the claimant provide copies of the original documents he will rely upon.

 

5. Further to the above 4 paragraphs, the defendant is unable to plead effectively or at all. The defendant is embarrassed.

 

Statement of truth

I believe that the facts stated in this defence are true.

I am the Defendant.

 

Signed:

XXXX

XXXX 2009

[banksarebandits]

Thanks Citizen. Thanks Cymru.

 

Mrs Bab spoke with court today.They seem to accept we do indeed have some rogue password and they cant fix BUT they said we can fax and /or e-mail tomorrow [22nd]. Mrs Bab has name and number of person she spoke to and she will phone again to make sure. She has left some time to even drive there if really necessary [we are not a million miles away]

 

No Citizen, i did not keep the envelope that the DN arrived in. Damn it. Lesson learned though.

 

Need to get typing. My first defence. Gulp...

 

I assume court serve copy of our defence on claimant once they get it from us? What happens next?

 

Thanks again

BAB