Student finance, local education authority gross mistakes and possible loss of University continuation

[2ltr16valve]

HI all,

 

This is going to be a little long but I will be as brief as possible.

 

Jan 2008 I started college on a access to heath studies course, and finished in Dec 2008 with a full marks pass. I was accepted to a well respected University in London on a Nursing Degree course starting Feb 2009.

 

On the basis I was starting University and doing a NHS degree that only receives reduced funding by means of a nhs bursary.... I applied for Student Finance support through my Local Education Authority. This is where things were messed up from this point forward, I now know.

 

I received a draft award of around £11,000 for the year and thought nothing of it as I have never been to university and knew no different at the time. I then applied for childcare payment support etc and was awarded this also by means of grant.

 

So now, I have loans and grants for myself and grants for childcare. All was great, started university and was doing very well.

 

Start of Feb 09 comes and I contact my Local education authority about my assessment and by fluke speak to a manager who says "you should not be getting all this money, only a reduced loan and thats it" .... as you would expect I was gob smacked and thought he was wrong. I had started my course and received my second payment AFTER speaking to this manager so assumed he was wrong and all was well.

 

Come March 09 I was due the final payment of loan and grant for me and childcare grant, Come payment date no payment. I called Student Finance Direct who told me there was a issue with their system and all payments failed, they would issue another payment that week. I was at university on this day so my partner also went to my Local education authority's office and was told everything on their screen was correct and my payment would be paid as expected.

 

Now, I know this to be untrue as it later come out that the manager I had spoke with had blocked the payment due so this had to of been visible on their screens.

 

As a result of this, I was left very very short of money and with no money to pay our child minder who then terminated contracts, so I had to take a 6 month break from University.... on the basis I had to let them know by the 30th October if I wanted to return.

 

I have made a complaint to the council for this processing error and the initial (not in writing) decision at level 3 after going through level 1 + 2.... is that the council are at whole in error in the administration of my application.

 

The overpayment the Student Loans Company say I owe is just under £6300.

 

I emailed my head of year this week and she has told me it is unlikely I can return to university on this intake (September) due to the high number of students accepted.... so this looks like due to the council's error I have to quit university and start all over again next year, applying again etc ... IF I get accepted !

 

I was told on the phone from the investigator he is going to award compensation to me for stress, anxiety, time and inconvenience ......

 

What I need to know is, If I can not return to University can I sue the council in court for loss of my career ? I was doing well before this mistake by the council and would not have taken a break otherwise.... I was due to sit two exams as well !

 

Lastly, the money owed to the Student loans company can not be waivered by the Council, but can by the Minister of State (Higher Education and Intellectual Property)... So I shall be appealing to this person also.

 

 

 

So any advise on what to do would be great sorry about the long post !

[2ltr16valve]

Anyone

[2ltr16valve]

bump

[2ltr16valve]

Expecting a offer tomorrow people, really really need some help on this please

[2ltr16valve]

Had a reply today, 5 page letter by email but copy of which is in the post.

 

I really really need help now, been offered compensation of £930 ...

[2ltr16valve]

could someone look through this legislation and tell me if section 115(2) applies to me at all ?

 

The Education (Student Support) Regulations 2009 No. 1555

[MARTIN3030]

You could possibly bring a claim against the Council for breach of fiduciary duty-do a google search of breach of duty to read up...any losses incurred or a damages claim for loss of other things would be addressed within that.

Obviously you would not be able to claim if you had already accepted any offers out of Court previously,which are likely to be full and final if you signed such conditions.

In such a scenario you would accept any offer of payment,but reserve the right to further pursue and so would refuse to sign as full and final.

 

The fact that they have offered you compensation should set alarm bells ringing !!

Edited October 30, 2009 by MARTIN3030

[2ltr16valve]

You could possibly bring a claim against the Council for breach of fiduciary duty-do a google search of breach of duty to read up...any losses incurred or a damages claim for loss of other things would be addressed within that.

Obviously you would not be able to claim if you had already accepted any offers out of Court previously,which are likely to be full and final if you signed such conditions.

In such a scenario you would accept any offer of payment,but reserve the right to further pursue and so would refuse to sign as full and final.

 

The fact that they have offered you compensation should set alarm bells ringing !!

 

 

HI Martin,

 

Many thanks for the reply. Shall be having a read up on what you put above today

 

They have given me (pending payment) compensation for the delay in dealing with my complaint. This is not a full and final either, and allows for me to take it further to the local gov ombudsman or court etc.

 

 

 

This is the letter they sent, edited out names etc.

 

Stage three - appeal

 

I write in response to your recent request for a stage three appeal. Further to our recent correspondence I have now completed my investigation of into your complaint, which I understand to be regarding the following:

 

The Student Loans Company is holding you liable for a grant overpayment of £6298.14. You feel that as the overpayment occurred as a result of Council maladministration, you should not be liable for it. You have also complained that the Councils error has left you in severe financial hardship and that you may not be able to resume your course as a result.

 

 

Investigation

 

In order to investigate this matter I have checked Council records and have consulted ********** (Quality Assurance Officer), ********* (Assistant Finance Manager), ********** (Benefits Manager) and ********** (Pupil & Student Services Manager). I have also spoken with you at great length to discuss your concerns in more detail.

 

 

Background

 

The Council received your complaint via MP Jon Cruddas on 28 May 2009. In this complaint you expressed concern that the Council had incorrectly assessed your application for funding, which resulted in you being overpaid. Student Loan Services (SLC) were subsequently demanding the money back, and you were concerned that this would put you and your family in extreme financial hardship. As well as being faced with the threat of bankruptcy, you also raised concern that the SLC informed you that they would recover your overpayment ‘in course’, which meant that they would offset the debt against your ongoing bursary entitlement. This would mean that you would not be able to return to your course as you would not be able to financially support yourself.

 

A***** C**** responded on 6 August 2009 advising that the Council had attempted to discuss the matter with the SLC who, due to data protection were unwilling to discuss your case and would only recommend that you contact them yourself. Your complaint was agreed upon the basis that errors were made, and that there was a delay in addressing the matter.

 

You escalated your complaint for a stage three appeal on 25 September 2009 with concerns that the stage three response did not adequately address the issues that you raised.

 

 

Findings

 

It is my understanding that you initially applied for student support for a diploma in Adult Nursing, but was refused support upon the basis that you were already receiving a non-income assessed bursary from the NHS.

 

You then switched your course to a BSc in adult nursing, and notified the authority of the change in your circumstances to this effect. Unfortunately, the officer responsible for assessing your application incorrectly determined that you were attending a degree course, which you will be aware do not attract NHS funding. This resulted in full mandatory support, including grants being approved instead of just the reduced top-up loan of £3180.00.

 

The error came to light after you called and spoke to L** B****** on 13 February 2009. Mr B****** apologised for the Council’s error and reiterated the fact that you would only be entitled to the top-up loan as you were already receiving NHS funding. You advised that you would write to the authority to formally challenge this.

 

You also applied to the NHS for assistance with childcare costs. This application had already been assessed and, based upon the assumption that the Council’s assessment was correct was approved; however following the reassessment of your support entitlement in April 2009, it transpired that you were not in fact eligible for childcare costs assistance. Your forthcoming payments were subsequently cancelled.

 

The total amount of overpayment outstanding is £6298.14.

 

A meeting was held on 20 October 2009 with A****** S******, Y***** B*******, A***** C***** and L** B***** to discuss your complaint. Following our earlier discussions, we discussed the fundamental issues of your complaint:

 

• You feel that as the overpayment was a result of Council error, it should not be recovered from you

 

• You took on personal financial commitments (a 12-month contract BT phone line sky TV package) upon the assumption that you were eligible to additional finance and could therefore afford these commitments. You feel that the authority should accept responsibility for these

 

• The SLC have advised you that you remain liable for the overpayment and that they will recover the debt ‘in course’, which you explained as meaning that if you were to continue on the course you would receive no further funding as the overpayment would automatically be offset. You would therefore not be able to resume your course as it would not be financially viable for you to continue. You accept that may have to pay the money back; however, you are keen to resume your course and could continue if the SLC are willing to agree to not recover any monies from you until your course is finished and you are qualified. You claim that you spoke to the SLC to try to negotiate this, but were informed that you would need to speak to the Council.

 

 

 

I will now address these issues in the order raised as above.

 

• The SLC becomes responsible for the administration of financial support after the award authority (LBBD in this case) has completed the income assessment and eligibility elements of the application process. The Regulations do not specifically cover circumstances where a miscalculation by the Local Authority or the SLC results in a student receiving payment of a higher amount than he / she is entitled to, whether or not it is likely that the student was aware that they had been overpaid. However regulation 113(1) stipulates that an eligible student must, if required by the Secretary of State repay any amount paid to him under Part 5 or Part 6 of the Regulations which for whatever reason exceeds the amount of support to which he is entitled under Part 5 or Part 6. The regulations also state that the Secretary of State must recover an overpayment of any grant for living and other costs unless he considers it is not appropriate to do so.

During the meeting we discussed whether Revenue and Benefits were prepared to exercise grounds of discretion in your case and given the circumstances, willing to accept liability for the outstanding overpayment of £6298.14. Revenue and Benefits maintain the view that whilst it is acknowledged that you were overpaid as a result of Council error, you have declared in your application for student finance that you are obligated to repay any of the overpayment in full. In view of this and in line with the current regulations Revenue and Benefits uphold their decision to not accept liability for your overpayment.

 

• You stated that you took on additional financial commitments which have now been compromised due to your financial situation. You stated that you signed up for a telephone line and SKY TV package to assist you with your course. Whilst I agree that these commitments may have been made upon the assumption that you were receiving the correct funding and therefore in the position to afford such commitments, these were personal choices that you made. I therefore cannot support your assertion that the authority should be held liable in this regard.

 

• the Student Support Regulations for 2008/09 allow for an overpayment of any grant for living and other costs to be recovered from any other grant that is payable to the student under regulations made under section 22 of the Teaching and Higher Education Act 1998 (regulation 113(2)). You are understandably concerned by the fact that if this happens, you will not be able to continue your course as you will have no means of financially supporting yourself.

The legislation states that as good practice, the Local Authority should contact the SLC to advise of the circumstances that caused the overpayment to arise to allow the SLC to negotiate the most appropriate method of recovery where the student is unable to make repayment in full; it would then be reasonable for the SLC to negotiate the recovery of the overpaid amount on a case by case basis. Records demonstrate that L** B***** has had contact with the SLC who were initially not willing to discuss your case due to data protection; however I obtained a declaration from you in which you gave the SLC authorisation to discuss your case with the authority.

 

G*** M******** from the SLC has looked at your case and advised if an agreement is made to repay the overpayment whilst it is at the ‘in-course’ recovery stage (while you are still on the same course), the overpayment will not be offset against any further NHS bursaries you may be entitled to providing the agreement is maintained. There are no set timescales set for paying back overpayments and the SLC will discuss the position with individual students on a case by case basis. You will need to contact the SLC to confirm this but in the meantime, this advice should alleviate your concerns regarding affordability and enable you to make an informed decision about whether or not you can resume your course.

 

 

Decision

 

In view of the issues raised in your complaint, I have made the following decisions.

 

It has been accepted that the overpayment occurred as a result of Council error, and that there has been some delay in concluding the matter.

 

You have requested that as a resolution to your complaint, the Local Authority pay you what you initially expected to receive before the administrative error was uncovered, and also compensate you for the extra financial commitments that you have made. Unfortunately, I cannot recommend that this happen as this decision is outside the jurisdiction of the complaints procedure. To reiterate, the regulations set out that the secretary of state must recover an overpayment unless he considers it is not appropriate to do so; you therefore have recourse to challenge your liability for the overpayment directly with the secretary of state. I understand from our conversation that MP Jon Cruddas is actively assisting you in pursuing this.

 

Whilst I agree that the overpayment did occur as a result of Council error, the regulations support the local authority’s assertion that the Council is not liable to repay the overpayment and are therefore not duty bound to pay it back in your case.

 

In view of the above, your complaint is partly agreed.

 

 

Conclusion

 

The Council’s stage two response fails to acknowledge the obvious distress, time and trouble that you have legitimately expended due to the Council’s error from February 2009 to the current date. In view of this and in line with LGO guidelines you are entitled to the following monetary compensation:

 

Element Amount

Distress, uncertainty and worry caused to the complainant from 13 February 2009 to 22 October 2009 as a result of the Council’s maladministration (pro-rata at the rate of £1000 per annum)

£670.00

 

Time and trouble reasonably expended by the complainant by pursuing his complaint with the authority

£250.00

 

Total:

920.00

 

If you accept this compensation, please complete the attached form and return to me as soon as possible. I must point out that compensation may be offset against any rent or Council tax arrears if applicable.

 

Upon behalf of the Council, please accept my sincere apologies for any inconvenience caused to you. If you remain dissatisfied with how your complaint has been investigated, you may refer your complaint to the Local Government Ombudsman for further review. A leaflet outlining how to complain to him is available from public libraries and council offices.

 

 

Yours sincerely,

Edited October 31, 2009 by 2ltr16valve

[MARTIN3030]

Ok looks quite thorough.

Its good that you have the MP involved.

I noticed one name remains visible (Mr L.B) Maybe you want to edit that too.

 

If your MP is still involved then would be an idea to capitalise on that with any appeal that goes to the Sec of State.

[2ltr16valve]

Ok looks quite thorough.

Its good that you have the MP involved.

I noticed one name remains visible (Mr L.B) Maybe you want to edit that too.

 

If your MP is still involved then would be an idea to capitalise on that with any appeal that goes to the Sec of State.

 

 

Edited I think :s missed that one.

 

I can see MP on 4/11 but its a open meeting so dont know how much I will get to discuss, as this is complex it needs time an attention.

[MARTIN3030]

Well now you have a good summary in writing its a good start.

and November 4th is only days away.

Maybe an idea to do a copy of the response above so you can leave it with him too.

[2ltr16valve]

Well now you have a good summary in writing its a good start.

and November 4th is only days away.

Maybe an idea to do a copy of the response above so you can leave it with him too.

 

 

I have a hard copy as well as electronic of the letter so shall print a copy off and take it with me

 

The only way out of it I can see if the sec of state using his discretion on this

 

Am I right in thinking (reading), from what the response says... paraphraseing a little, "Yes we did mess up, and put you in double the debt you would be in at this point in time ... but tough, you deal with it"

[MARTIN3030]

Well they have agreed to pay compensation and have not denied liability (although I did note the comment about "part" )

 

They are talking about what recourse they are expected to offer probably referring to their textbooks !

As we know the response would have been well thought out before you got the copy-but its quite clear theres admission of mistake there.

 

I would say its nothing more or nothing less of what they could have written in response-but it does seem to have been very carefully written.

 

Discretion from the Sec of state is by nature of the word meaning that there will be cases which are open to looking at more closely and should rely on all facts that preceeded / followed and were instrumental to the overpayment being made.

I would say that you have a good case and certainly have nothing to lose by taking it to the SOS.

[babybear39]

Sorry to read your thread and the problems you are facing but I don't know enough about SLC, even though I'm a mature student myself. Maybe a site team member could help, I'll flag your thread for expert attention if it's available. I'll ask for you...

[IdaInFife]

I'm afraid I cannot find anyone who has any experience or any sound knowledge of these issues.

 

can you get any help from student reps etc?

 

ida x

[2ltr16valve]

I'm afraid I cannot find anyone who has any experience or any sound knowledge of these issues.

 

can you get any help from student reps etc?

 

ida x

 

 

Hi Ida,

 

Sadly no they do not know anything about this kind of problem let alone law sadly. They can at best liaise with the SLC but would know less on the matter than myself.

 

It really is a tricky one

[carolan78]

If you have found any more information on this aspect i would love to know. Although my situation isn't brought on by an overpayment. I am stuck in their que and to e quiet honest if they don't sort out finance very soon then I will have to quit the course this year

[gni03349]

The OP could investigate to see whether this is a case of "maladministration", as it would be classed as "official error". This would only help on the compensatory side though (still, it's worth up to £5000 if my memory serves me correctly). On the upside for everybody though, if it went to an Ombudsman, then procedures would/should be changed as a result. Other than that, I think the OP would have to fight their case in court (as per loss of career etc). I am in a funding-issue situation also, which means I may have to drop out (broken assurances etc, incorrect figures, downright lies etc). Where is the accountability with these people??

 

Whether it's the Student Loans Company or the local LEA's, these people are paid to do a job, and do it correctly. There are too many mistakes made that nobody has any will to follow up on and correct and learn from. They are essentially a law unto themselves, backed up with the letter of the law. If a private company did this, they would have been wound up pronto!.

[2ltr16valve]

Had this reply today, which is laughable ! do these people not even know their own legislation !

 

Thank you for your email of 21 October, addressed to Lord Mandelson, enclosing correspondence about the overpayment of your student funding and your subsequent appeal to the London Borough of Barking and Dagenham. I have been asked to reply on the Minister's behalf.

 

I should first explain that the Education (Student Support) Regulations govern the payment of student finance to eligible students. The Regulations do not specifically cover circumstances where a miscalculation by the Local Authority (LA) results in a student receving a higher amount of support than they were entitled to.

 

Where any overpayment of funding arises, LAs are required to reclaim the amount. There is no discretion to write off such an overpayment, regardless of the circumstances. Indeed, at the time a student makes a student support application, they sign a declaration to the effect that if financial assistance was paid to them, and it was for whatever reason, more than the student was entitled to, they would be required to pay back the amount.

 

Where an overpayment arises, the SLC issue an "in course" letter which means that the overpayment of grant will be recovered from any future grant payments. If the amount is not recovered during the course of study, which in your case it will not be as no further grant payments are payable for your current course, they will issue an "end of course" letter. This letter will say that arrangements need to be made to repay the amount outstanding and the repayment schedule can be negotiated. Whilst the Department is sympathetic to your situation, the overpayment will need to be recovered and I would sugget that you contact the SLC on how to take this forward.

If you have not already done so, you could apply for assistance from your university's Access to Learning fund (ALF). The ALF is a discretionary fund administered by Higher Education Institutions, following departmental guidelines, to help students who are in financial difficulties during their studies. You can obtain further information and details of how to apply from the Student Services at your institution.

 

Yours sincerely

 

Mrs **** *******

Public Communications Unit

 

 

What do I do now ? Can I challenge this in court ?

 

Labour are a fooking joke, from top to bottom ! bring on a election, although will only bring more monkeys to the throne

[2ltr16valve]

Had this reply today, which is laughable ! do these people not even know their own legislation !

 

 

 

 

What do I do now ? Can I challenge this in court ?

 

Labour are a fooking joke, from top to bottom ! bring on a election, although will only bring more monkeys to the throne

 

 

anyone ?

 

 

I have found someone else on here now that is in a very very similar situation with the same authority..... How does this fair for our argument being there is now two of us from the same period thats had the same problem....?

[2ltr16valve]

The OP could investigate to see whether this is a case of "maladministration", as it would be classed as "official error". This would only help on the compensatory side though (still, it's worth up to £5000 if my memory serves me correctly). On the upside for everybody though, if it went to an Ombudsman, then procedures would/should be changed as a result. Other than that, I think the OP would have to fight their case in court (as per loss of career etc). I am in a funding-issue situation also, which means I may have to drop out (broken assurances etc, incorrect figures, downright lies etc). Where is the accountability with these people??

 

Whether it's the Student Loans Company or the local LEA's, these people are paid to do a job, and do it correctly. There are too many mistakes made that nobody has any will to follow up on and correct and learn from. They are essentially a law unto themselves, backed up with the letter of the law. If a private company did this, they would have been wound up pronto!.

 

 

can you explain more about the maladministration thing ? they did admit that it was the case...

 

also

 

 

 

 

I have found someone else on here now that is in a very very similar situation with the same authority..... How does this fair for our argument being there is now two of us from the same period thats had the same problem....?

[gni03349]

Well... you have to go through the official complaints procedure, and get a final correspondence from them. Then, if you are still not satisfied, you have to get all your complaints together in a letter and ask your local MP to refer it to the relevant Ombudsman, who then goes through all the facts of the case, and can compensate you for various things... such as expense in trying to sort out the problem, and/or compensation for the hassle. It's by no means guaranteed anybody will get it, but basically, it's a kick up the bum to the people who got it wrong in the first place, and a reminder that it could cost them if they don't follow their owns procedures.

 

Anybody who has had to have dealings with SLC know how bad they've been at doing the job... it's not just you and the other one you found, but the more people that hit them with claims for maladministration, then the more serious somebody might decide to take it! (Two directors I think it is have resigned over the fiasco already... probably more heads will roll too, but don't let that put you off complaining/claiming).

[2ltr16valve]

Well... you have to go through the official complaints procedure, and get a final correspondence from them. Then, if you are still not satisfied, you have to get all your complaints together in a letter and ask your local MP to refer it to the relevant Ombudsman, who then goes through all the facts of the case, and can compensate you for various things... such as expense in trying to sort out the problem, and/or compensation for the hassle. It's by no means guaranteed anybody will get it, but basically, it's a kick up the bum to the people who got it wrong in the first place, and a reminder that it could cost them if they don't follow their owns procedures.

 

Anybody who has had to have dealings with SLC know how bad they've been at doing the job... it's not just you and the other one you found, but the more people that hit them with claims for maladministration, then the more serious somebody might decide to take it! (Two directors I think it is have resigned over the fiasco already... probably more heads will roll too, but don't let that put you off complaining/claiming).

 

 

Hi,

 

Think I will ask these merged now, http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/228133-urgent-student-finance-local.html

 

Take a read though that thread mate, have had response from council... at level 3. They admitted they were in the wrong, paid me compensation yet will do nothing about the debt.

The lady I spoke with today and I are going to see our MP on the 8/1/10.

 

Its not so much SLC tbh here, its more my Local Education Authority (LEA).... the error is in whole theirs, the SLC just paid what they were told to from my LEA's calculations.

 

I have spoken to The Guardian who are more than willing to run this story and tear SLC/LEA to shreds.

 

[gni03349]

Well.. they admit liability. No mention of the Ombudsman on this thread. I called a very helpful lady of the Ombudsman service, and after a brief explanation, she agreed it could be looked into. The problem was, which Ombudsman to complain to... there are so many lol. Anyway, she called me back to tell me that it should be Lord M's lot. Give them a call... they were extremely helpful to me.

 

I had a quick read of this thread and it mentions a meeting with your MP? See how much further you can go with him and ask for advice about ethe Ombudsman. As I said in a previous thread, there is no guarantee of any kind of payment being ordered by him/her, but as there is admission, I would have thought that he/she would, at a minimum, expect that to be paid. It's just that he/she can order more to be paid, so it's worth a thought. I gather that your main concern is getting this overpayment written off.

 

The way I see it, is that if enough people would complain, then this whole LEA/SLC shambles would finally be addressed. The biggest problem is that the systems they use are years old (LEA ones at least), and if any changes need to be done, rather than change the existing one, they create another one, so who knows how many different databases with duplicated and incorrect data are in existence? This is partly explained by the fact that these are "live" systems, and they probably don't or won't have another system running parallel for testing changes... cheaper to pay consultants to create yet another one. It just means there are even more points-of-failure though... as we are discovering.

[supasnooper]

Threads merged as requested.