Vodafone, HELP

[orfoster]

I have recently had back a full disclosure from Vodafone as they are asking for a amount of money for 18 months contract, I ONLY signed for 12 months in the shop and know this, I have asked them for the copy of my orignal contract four times, these are the responses

 

1. The copy of your contract is on the way

 

2. The copy of your contract is on the way to your home address and has been printed in my office (taken from a memo on the disclosure)

 

3. I have sent the contract to your home address, this arrived but with no signature in the box and was a blank copy.

 

4. Letter covering the Data Protection Disclosure telling me that the copy of my contract is held in a secure area which doesn't bring it under "personal data" and will not be given under the data protection act.

 

 

They have served defaults on my credit rating due to the amount i owe them but is in dispute and won't provide me with a copy of my contract, is this right???

 

Vodafone Never sent me a letter saying they were defaulting me and according to my credit file i have THREE defaults from them!!

Please help.

[pford]

have a read of this thread some very good points made in it

[SurlyBonds]

I have recently had back a full disclosure from Vodafone as they are asking for a amount of money for 18 months contract, I ONLY signed for 12 months in the shop and know this, I have asked them for the copy of my orignal contract four times, these are the responses

 

1. The copy of your contract is on the way

 

2. The copy of your contract is on the way to your home address and has been printed in my office (taken from a memo on the disclosure)

 

3. I have sent the contract to your home address, this arrived but with no signature in the box and was a blank copy.

 

4. Letter covering the Data Protection Disclosure telling me that the copy of my contract is held in a secure area which doesn't bring it under "personal data" and will not be given under the data protection act.

 

 

They have served defaults on my credit rating due to the amount i owe them but is in dispute and won't provide me with a copy of my contract, is this right???

 

Vodafone Never sent me a letter saying they were defaulting me and according to my credit file i have THREE defaults from them!!

Please help.

 

This is typical Vodafone bulls**t and delaying tactics... read the Default Hell thread about the Data Protection Act issues, they are totally wrong... if the contract has even as much as your name and address on it, it wouldn't matter if they stored it on the moon, let alone a "secure area"(??) it is still subject data as defined under Part 1, Section 1, subsection 1:

"personal data" means data which relate to a living individual who can be identified-

 

(a) from those data, or

 

(b) from those data and other information which is in the possession of, or is likely to come into the possession of, the data controller,

 

and includes any expression of opinion about the individual and any indication of the intentions of the data controller or any other person in respect of the individual;

 

And just WTF do they think they're smoking with this "secure area" bull??? I could say my kitchen was a secure area because it's got an intruder alarm detector in it and a lockable back door. It is typical nonsense from some £9k a year admin-centre amoebas-for-brains Muppet.

 

What they do have is a legal obligation to keep it secure. But, to claim that they keep it so secure that even they can't get to it is just about the funniest thning I've heard about a Data Protection Act matter in a loooooooooong time.

 

MI5 might keep a file on you - and they must be slightly more secure than a so**ing mobile phone company (a bit?) - and you can request to see that under the DPA and Freedom of Information Act.

 

What you could do, of course, is write to them and say that you're going to complain to the Information Commissioners Office because it appears that they've been so secure that they've lost it... lost your personal data, they can't trace it, and therefore they have not fulfilled their DPA duty in relation to protection of your records.

 

Also, just drop in the little matter of Durant v Financial Services Authority [2003] EWCA Civ 1746, Court of Appeal (Civil Division) - in your particular circumstances - there's about another 200 case laws in relation to other refusals.:grin:

 

I'd bet they'd soon damn well find it if they needed to go to Court to sue you! Do they really think that the whole World is stupid?? (US Presidents, excepted!)

 

So, by their own illogical argument, if they can't get to it, then no contract exists, so you don't owe them anything, because they can't show you signed anything.

 

Or, if they do know where it is, then they have to go fetch.

 

Either they know, or they don't... or is it won't?

 

Either way, you have them by the proverbials.:grin:

[orfoster]

haha i love that reply! I might print it off and frame it on my wall. Yes vodafone have been causing me quite abit of stress about this. They won't send me much about my account but i have copies of their internal memos about me in which they say "the copy of my contract has been printed and sent" it never reached my door. I know full well i never signed an 18 month contract. So i have made up a letter and have sent that in first class to complain, i think its the one Neo made up for the other girl about almost the same thing. They have put THREE defaults on my credit file and none of which they ever sent me a letter for.

[Tinkerbelle]

Bar Stewards

 

Good Look with it all... I am pretty sure you will get them removed

[SurlyBonds]

...but i have copies of their internal memos about me in which they say "the copy of my contract has been printed and sent" it never reached my door...

 

A phenominal piece of evidence to show they are lying...and I use that word unreservedly. Make sure you don't lose that, it is critical for both the Information Commissioners Office and the Court.

 

So go for the kill and get it over and done with.

 

Stat. Notice and cover letter to them to remove the default markers

a) along the lines of lack of contract to prove that you ever under agreement with them

b) and there was never a contract in the first place allowing to disclose data

c) that contract is dead, with all the embelishments on the Default Hell thread about permission dying with the contract being shot.

 

and also tell them to stop disclosing your data under the same principles and the permissions that have expired in the contract and your rights under the Data Protection Act.

 

21 days to some up with some evidence or they can STFU and JFDI.

 

If they don't reply with hard evidence then take the BarStewards through your local County Court - I doubt if they even bother turning up, the size that Vodapain are.

 

The End.

 

P.S. Why are there three markers? Are you saying one for each of the three CRAs? or three markers per credit file? I've never heard of three data entries for the same account with one agency... they can't post updates on difference entries...it's not a blog, it's a credit file!?!??!

 

The purpose of a credit file is to show the current and historic status of the account, and that is always within one entry, unless you have separate accounts.

[orfoster]

It may be one default notice, (i don't know as i never had any notice)the credit file company show one for may, one for june and one for july. Not one for August yet. Does that mean three entries or just one being carried over??? It just looked like three to me. Thank you for taking the time to reply, i have sent the letter in demanding my contract and if not they are to remove the notice.

[orfoster]

Still no reply from Vodafone to my letter requesting a copy of my contract and copy of default notice. They were given 14 days and that runs out on Tues so we shall see, why am i not expecting them to reply. Not too sure where to go from there?

[callumsgran]

You havent been defaulted yet orfoster, the credit file is showing that you are 3 months behind with payments is all! when they default you they will have to serve you with a default notice!

[orfoster]

Lol i knew that, i was just testing you! Its confused me as it says on my credit file "default" so i thought i'd had one. They still won't provide me with my contract though as i only signed into a 12 month one and they are charging me for and 18 month one.

[callumsgran]

Doesn't matter how long the contract is for, they have to supply it on demand! if you've sent a DPA they have to comply.

[orfoster]

the copy of my contract and i quote from the DPA response "is held in a secure area which does not bring it in line with the data protection act and is not personal data so we are unable at this time to provide this to you, we are however able to supply you with a screen shot of our computer showing the contract is for 18 months" they have charged me £300 for the extra 6 months. They haven't responded to me which i do find very rude.

[callumsgran]

send them this, adapting it to suit your needs!

LETTER BEFORE ACTION

Section 7 – Data Protection Act 1998

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Account: xxxxxxxx

 

I am in receipt of the documents that you have supplied in response to my Data Protection Act information request dated (Insert Date). The disclosure of personal data is incomplete in that at least the following documents are missing.

 

(Adapt this next section to your situation)

 

1) You have failed to provide a complete list of transactions and charges.(Add details of missing period - or a transaction that you know about which is not included)

2) You have provided no notes, or documents relating to any legal action between you and myself.

3) You have provided no notes, or documents relating to instances of manual intervention.

 

This is not an exhaustive list by any means, it is just an example of some of the information I am missing.

Accordingly, I have to tell you that you have not yet complied with your obligations under the Data Protection Act 1998.

 

You have a further (Insert number of days remaining) days to comply.

 

Yours faithfully,

[ffocus]

This may help. I havent got a result yet. But its prob worth a read.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-bailiffs-advice/22995-bad-credit-default-removal.html?highlight=vodafone

[orfoster]

After sending the above letter, this is the response i got from Vodafone.......

 

Dear Oliver

 

REQUEST FOR SUBJECT ACCESS

 

Thank you for your letters of 3rd August and 1st September 2006. I am sorry that you have not recieved an earlier request. I had contacted the team that had originally agreed to send out your contract/airtime agreement and asked them to progress this matter. I had not realised that they had not done this. I have chased this matter with them and I understand that this request should have been actioned.

 

There seems to have been some confusion over how and where we store a copy of the terms and conditions. My understanding is that the acutal copies of the signed airtime agreements are stored in secure archive, which as I advised before, is not organised in a manner that is covered by the definitionof "personal data" as defined in the recent court case, Durant v FSA. However, we are able to print off a copy of the standard terms and conditions from our customer management and billing system via your account. I understand that is what you will recieve from the team referred to above.

 

I am sorry for any inconvenience and confusion caused but I hope that you have now referred the relevant information. Of course, if you are still unhappy, then you have the right to complain to the Information Commissioner as you have advised.

 

Amanda Chandler.

 

 

 

 

Well the copy of the contract they gave me was sated as signed 1.9.06, somehow not the agreement i signed in July 2005 and DID NOT have my signature on it at the bottom, i am looking for the original copy of my contract that I signed. Do they have to provide it to me or can they fob me off with this letter?

 

ANYONE??

[callumsgran]

Yes they do have to provide the original contract(copy of it) if its indispute, which it is! write to the IC see what they say

[Lizzy]

It really sounds as though they do not have your copy. They are trying everything they can think of to get out of this. Fancy sending you something dated 1/9/06 fools.................good evidence if ever I saw it. I think you realise they have not got it. I would NOT furnish them with a copy of your signed agreement. Why not just go for a Letter Before Action as they are really trying on the delaying tactics and have have not provided the documents you require. As SurlyBonds says even if they are on the moon they put them there and should go fetch. They don't have them they are lost. If they had them they would have now given them to you with glee.....sitting there smug and pretty.

He who laughs last laughs longest. Be brave

[SurlyBonds]

After sending the above letter, this is the response i got from Vodafone.......

 

Dear Oliver

 

REQUEST FOR SUBJECT ACCESS

 

Thank you for your letters of 3rd August and 1st September 2006. I am sorry that you have not recieved an earlier request. I had contacted the team that had originally agreed to send out your contract/airtime agreement and asked them to progress this matter. I had not realised that they had not done this. I have chased this matter with them and I understand that this request should have been actioned.

 

There seems to have been some confusion over how and where we store a copy of the terms and conditions. My understanding is that the acutal copies of the signed airtime agreements are stored in secure archive, which as I advised before, is not organised in a manner that is covered by the definitionof "personal data" as defined in the recent court case, Durant v FSA. However, we are able to print off a copy of the standard terms and conditions from our customer management and billing system via your account. I understand that is what you will recieve from the team referred to above.

 

I am sorry for any inconvenience and confusion caused but I hope that you have now referred the relevant information. Of course, if you are still unhappy, then you have the right to complain to the Information Commissioner as you have advised.

 

Amanda Chandler.

 

 

 

 

Well the copy of the contract they gave me was sated as signed 1.9.06, somehow not the agreement i signed in July 2005 and DID NOT have my signature on it at the bottom, i am looking for the original copy of my contract that I signed. Do they have to provide it to me or can they fob me off with this letter?

 

ANYONE??

 

And just HOW in all of God's wordly creation, do they think they would defend your case in Court when they have no original contract??

 

A screenshot showing your contract details counts for jack in a court - they have to show a judge a certified copy of the original contract.

 

They CANNOT (as in criminal offence otherwise) UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES disclose your personal data (e.g. financial account status) details to a CRA without your mark upon their contract. It is illegal under the criminal code of the DPA and can land the directors of that company in prison and/or very heavy fines.

 

So, if there's no contract, then there's no permission, so they have two choices:

1) Either miraculously rustle up your contract and prove their case to the Court - in which case they will look very silly for wasting the Court's time...and you'll win on the fact that they are now out of time for the production of their exemption notice.

2) They won't have your contract, so you will win by default.

 

Go get them, but do put them down mercifully, even animals deserve a painless ending.

 

 

Also, throw this into the stew for them:

SCHEDULE 1

THE DATA PROTECTION PRINCIPLESPART ITHE PRINCIPLES

7. Appropriate technical and organisational measures shall be taken against unauthorised or unlawful processing of personal data and against accidental loss or destruction of, or damage to, personal data.

[orfoster]

Many thanks, i will try and be nice to them. They have sold the debt off to Wescot Credit Services because i havnt paid them a penny simply because they have NOT sent me a breakdown of the charges and also havent shown me a copy of the original contract so im not paying till they show me that.

 

Also i have now got a copy of my equifax report showing vodafone = (D) which means default, they have not sent me any letter telling me that there was a default put on my file and also in the memo list they sent me it doesn't show anything about a default notice being added or even that my account was sold off.

 

So just one question if Vodafone cant show me a copy of my contract does this mean that the whole debt is void??? I really want to take them to town on this simply because i know they are lying to me and are in the wrong. So whats the next i need to take? Information Commissioner or solicitors for advise???

[buzby]

This is a side to Vodafone I've never seen before. The mere fact that they are doing all they can to avoid the DPA is one thing, and they may even be right in what they assert, however if called in court to prove a contract exists, the DPA provisions won;t matter - a copy of a signed contract is the very least they have to produce. (Of course, if the debtor still has his copy under the matress, this would be a useful double-check....)

[orfoster]

No when i moved house i lost alot of paper work. They have sent me so many copies of new contracts its really un real, they could just make it easier and supply it. I just figured that they HAD to give me everything they hold on me.

 

I didn't think they would be like this either and its really confusing me about what to do next, any ideas? Not sure how to respond to the above letter.

[orfoster]

Anyone?

[orfoster]

I have decided from reading on other threads i will send in a Consumer Credit Act request into Vodafone asking them to provide the signed agreement to provide me rolling credit on the account. I understand this will apply in the Consumer Credit Act as they still aren't playing ball with this copy of original contract.

[Tinkerbelle]

I have decided from reading on other threads i will send in a Consumer Credit Act request into Vodafone asking them to provide the signed agreement to provide me rolling credit on the account. I understand this will apply in the Consumer Credit Act as they still aren't playing ball with this copy of original contract.

 

Aren't Voda claiming that they are not covered by the CCA though?

 

See posts # 1 & #3 in this thread.

 

Well one person says they are, the other is saying they aren't. Who knows

 

I guess it would be worth trying that to see what they come back with.

 

Keep us posted!

[dayglo]

Vodafone will reply to say that the airtime contract is NOT a regulated product as defined in the Consumer Credit Act 1974

 

'Customer Services' teams are being retrained as we speak.