Is This Legal

[1984ReturnsForReal]

And as I mentioned previously, I do not deal with financial matters or tax on the site. But, if we need to put these details on the site, we will look into it.

 

 

Putting your trading address & VAT number on a website is not a financial matter.

 

It is a legal one.

 

& it means XL Trading are trading illegally in the UK.

[XLTrading]

Putting your trading address & VAT number on a website is not a financial matter.

 

It is a legal one.

& it means XL Trading are trading illegally in the UK.

 

Which we can assure you - we are looking into now.

If this means a lot more to clients, of course we will do so.

If it needs to be there, it will be added.

[Conniff]

These are the legal requirements of internet selling:

 

Your business name, postal address and email address

Your VAT number if applicable

A description of your goods and services

Price, including all taxes

Delivery costs

Arrangements for payment

Arrangements for the delivery of goods or services

Information about the right to cancel the order

How long any price or offer remains valid

Minimum duration of a contract to supply goods or services continuously or recurrently (such as a monthly book club)

The costs of any premium-rate lines customers have to use

 

The rights to cancel ie; Distance Selling Regulations must be shown.

[XLTrading]

These are the legal requirements of internet selling:

 

Your business name, postal address and email address

Your VAT number if applicable

A description of your goods and services

Price, including all taxes

Delivery costs

Arrangements for payment

Arrangements for the delivery of goods or services

Information about the right to cancel the order

How long any price or offer remains valid

Minimum duration of a contract to supply goods or services continuously or recurrently (such as a monthly book club)

The costs of any premium-rate lines customers have to use

 

The rights to cancel ie; distance selling regulations must be show.

 

Then I believe the only thing missing on the site is the postal address and VAT details if these are applicable.

The rest I believe we have covered on the site, but we are always open to improving at all times.

[1984ReturnsForReal]

Anyway guys.

 

this is a PM I got from XL Trading whilst on the Legal Banter Website

 

Come on coward respond.

Are you not curious as to WHY others from MSE are not posting on here at present?

It is just you.. on your own, with us being able to catch you out with any details we wish to have.

Over to you.

 

He has also dug out old posts of mine & insinuated I am a racist.

 

 

WARNING STAY WELL CLEAR.

[Conniff]

Then I believe the only thing missing on the site is the postal address and VAT details if these are applicable.

The rest I believe we have covered on the site, but we are always open to improving at all times.

 

Don't forget the Distance Selling Regulations ie; can return for any reason as long as notified with 7 days from the day after the day received, but in the case of software, it must be unopened.

[XLTrading]

Don't forget the Distance Selling Regulations ie; can return for any reason as long as notified with 7 days from the day after the day received, but in the case of software, it must be unopened.

 

We do need to put more effort into advertising this fact on our site.. clearly we do and of course we shall.

 

We would need to look into the ins and outs on the 'unopened' part however as we do not wish to make a loss on any product not being fit for purpose again.

[Conniff]

Others may think I am mad, but I am going to tip your scales for sheer endurement.

We have had so many private parking companies responding to posts only to make a few crass comments and then disappear, you have not done that.

[XLTrading]

Others may think I am mad, but I am going to tip your scales for sheer endurement.

We have had so many private parking companies responding to posts only to make a few crass comments and then disappear, you have not done that.

 

LOL! Many thanks for that - most appreciated.

I have enjoyed tonight, I would rather have a sensible and balanced debate and it has been excellent mostly.

 

I hope people understand, that while I have come across as a bit of a prat (lets be honest) I am protecting something which we work bloody hard for.. so if it is described as illegal, we get offended by that.

 

I would NEVER work for a company that scammed or in any way, stole, committed illegal acts, or in any way, had a negative influence on the UK public.

 

If we need to adjust the store slightly to acomodate more legal details, then so be it if this will publicly give a more professional and positive appearance.

 

We only ask that people question the copyright law in the UK .. someone really does need to clarify the full law on what we can or cannot do as consumers as there are many grey areas that should not be there.

It should be made clear and concise for all to see.

[BankFodder]

I think that an important question to ask you is not whether the selling of this copyright material is illegal but rather what is the source of your licence to copy it and to resell it.

[XLTrading]

I think that an important question to ask you is not whether the selling of this copyright material is illegal but rather what is the source of your licence to copy it and to resell it.

 

We have to make it clear.. we do not sell any copyrighted material at all, as clients MUST already own the media they wish duplicated or serviced.

 

I do agree, we need clarification on this - however, again, someone needs to look into this majorly to clarify 'the law' on backups and running a service as a duplication agent.

 

At the moment, I do not believe we need a licence to do so but this remains to be tested.

[BankFodder]

Well in that case I believe that you do need a licence.

 

I'm sorry to see that you don't appear to have checked up your legal position and that you feel that you still need to clarify your position.

While I expect that one of the acts permitted by copyright is to make backups for personal use, I do not think that it is an act permitted by copyright to make backups which are

• multiple backups
  
• not for personal use
  
• for distribution
  
• which produces a commercial advantage for you as the copier or distributor.
  

I also think that it is unfortunate that you have chosen to challenge a lot of decent people on this site who have merely voiced their natural aprehension when it now turns out that you are not clear about your position.

I would have thought that being certain that you have a sound base upon which to trade would be the very first requirement for a valid business model.

 

I am sure that you will have clarified your position in the next day or so, so please do then come back and confirm quite what your position in respect of your licence is.

[XLTrading]

Well in that case I believe that you do need a licence.

 

I'm sorry to see that you don't appear to have checked up your legal position and that you feel that you still need to clarify your position.

While I expect that one of the acts permitted by copyright is to make backups for personal use, I do not think that it is an act permitted by copyright to make backups which are

• multiple backups
  
• not for personal use
  
• for distribution
  
• which produces a commercial advantage for you as the copier or distributor.
  

I also think that it is unfortunate that you have chosen to challenge a lot of decent people on this site who have merely voiced their natural aprehension when it now turns out that you are not clear about your position.

I would have thought that being certain that you have a sound base upon which to trade would be the very first requirement for a valid business model.

 

I am sure that you will have clarified your position in the next day or so, so please do then come back and confirm quite what your position in respect of your licence is.

 

I believe that you would need to look into this and prove this substantial though however

 

There is no law that regulates the providing of a service where legally owned media via a client coming to a site and requiring said item for the purpose of owning a 'safekeeping' copy, CANNOT legally ask anyone to do so as long as there are ground rules and terms to which the backup can legally be produced.

 

Again, someone needs to challenge this as at the moment - no one has I believe and the reason, why we have not been prosecuted I believe.

 

I do not believe I have challenged anyone on here tonight apart from the one or two who have tried to disrupt a very good debate. I have also not asked for the thread to removed UNLESS stupidity results, which is has in a small amount and has been dealt with - very admirably - by the modteam on here which I am very happy about.

 

Again, we throw down the challenge to anyone wishing to prove that the service we run for duplication IS illegal, as at the moment, we have not seen it to be the case and as such, we believe, when it cannot be proven so far.. cannot be deemed ILLEGAL for all intense purposes.

 

EDIT:

Also off topic but, I would like to thank you for helping me out with my bank charges back a LONG time ago on here.

So thank you

[BankFodder]

Adobe have informed me that they have taken action and that the site has now been shut down.

 

Microsoft have also told me that as far as they are concerned, the reselling of their products in this way was not authorised and was therefore unlawful.

 

In fact the only people who didn't respond at all were FAST - federation against software theft and who seemed to be about as useful as a dead donkey. Which is strange as they were the one organisation from which XLT claimed to have heard.

[1984ReturnsForReal]

hahahahahahaha

 

[1984ReturnsForReal]

Again, we throw down the challenge to anyone wishing to prove that the service we run for duplication IS illegal, as at the moment, we have not seen it to be the case and as such, we believe, when it cannot be proven so far.. cannot be deemed ILLEGAL for all intense purposes.

 

 

Your website provider seems to agree with Adobe (& all other software manufacturers & music makers) that your site is

 

 

 

ILLEGAL

 

 

Its a shame you didnt listen but instead threatened to sue people.

 

The wrong people I might add.

[2ltr16valve]

Adobe have informed me that they have taken action and that the site has now been shut down.

 

Microsoft have also told me that as far as they are concerned, the reselling of their products in this way was not authorised and was therefore unlawful.

 

In fact the only people who didn't respond at all were FAST - federation against software theft and who seemed to be about as useful as a dead donkey. Which is strange as they were the one organisation from which XLT claimed to have heard.

 

 

Thought as much

 

The fact they made threats of "having threads shut" etc from the outset rung my alarm bells that something was not right.

 

Oh well, another one bites the dust.

[electron99]

Adobe have informed me that they have taken action and that the site has now been shut down.

 

Microsoft have also told me that as far as they are concerned, the reselling of their products in this way was not authorised and was therefore unlawful.

 

In fact the only people who didn't respond at all were FAST - federation against software theft and who seemed to be about as useful as a dead donkey. Which is strange as they were the one organisation from which XLT claimed to have heard.

 

As I mentioned in post number 21 of this thread, Adobe said they were trading illegally.

 

When I e-mailed Adobe, they replied within 30 minutes, and like Bank Fodder, I am still waiting to hear from FAST.

 

I will shortly be e-mailing FAST again, asking wHy members of the public should bother reporting possible piracy, if they will not even bother to acknowledge such reports.

[underlay_guru]

The XL holding page says temporarily offline, which makes me wonder if they will be back once the adobe 'backup' products are deleted. Someone better inform Mr Bristow, sorry, XL on their Twitter page that their website is down.www.twitter.com/xltrading .

 

Regarding 'backup' copies of software - we are aware that an owner of the original copy of the software has the right to keep one backup copy for his/her own purposes...

...but only one copy....Therefore If XL own the original, they can only make one backup copy of this, therefore producing only one sale from each original copy IYSWIM. The onus is also on the seller to ensure that their customers are purchasing for legal backup use only. Morally, the seller must request proof that the buyer already owns the origianl version of the software...without this indicates that the seller is willing to sell to anyone.

 

...but of course, the seller is well aware that 99.99999% of buyers don't own the original....

 

Oh, and another thing: XL never released a geographical address on their website, which is legally required to abide by the DSR's. No website can legally sell anything without it.

Edited October 9, 2009 by underlay_guru

[1984ReturnsForReal]

The XL holding page says temporarily offline, which makes me wonder if they will be back once the adobe 'backup' products are deleted.

 

Someone better inform Mr Bristow, sorry, XL on their Twitter page that their website is down.www.twitter.com/xltrading

 

 

I bet he already knows...

 

Did you see the legal bit on his forum?

 

3 organisations were already on to him with many more in the pipeline.

 

As for FAST..

 

He did post their email up & said it confirmed he was doing nothing illegal.

 

Anyone with half a brain would of read the last two sentances of the email & realised what they were doing.

 

I will contact [email protected]/xltrading to let him know just in case..

 

I expect that to go down next & the facebook page..

[2ltr16valve]

What I find amusing is the persons silence since LOL !

 

Worth more than a 1000 words

[mikefu08]

Could anyone pinpoint me where he posted the e-mail stating that FAST cleared him? Can't find it... thanks

 

I bet he already knows...

 

Did you see the legal bit on his forum?

 

3 organisations were already on to him with many more in the pipeline.

 

As for FAST..

 

He did post their email up & said it confirmed he was doing nothing illegal.

 

Anyone with half a brain would of read the last two sentances of the email & realised what they were doing.

 

I will contact [email protected]/xltrading to let him know just in case..

 

I expect that to go down next & the facebook page..

[Hairy_g]

Helllo everyone, i just found this so thought i'd sign up.

he is now using his .net address, looks like it's all being switched over.with regards to one of my posts on mse, this is the reply I had from paypal:

Dear xxxxxxxxxx,

 

Thank you for contacting PayPal with your concern regarding sales that

potentially violate PayPal's Acceptable Use Policy. We will investigate

the matter and take appropriate action as necessary.

 

Sincerely,

Ryan

PayPal, Acceptable Use Policy Department

PayPal, an eBay Company

[1984ReturnsForReal]

.net has now been closed also.......

[2ltr16valve]

Helllo everyone, i just found this so thought i'd sign up.

he is now using his .net address, looks like it's all being switched over.with regards to one of my posts on mse, this is the reply I had from paypal:

Dear xxxxxxxxxx,

 

Thank you for contacting PayPal with your concern regarding sales that

potentially violate PayPal's Acceptable Use Policy. We will investigate

the matter and take appropriate action as necessary.

 

Sincerely,

Ryan

PayPal, Acceptable Use Policy Department

PayPal, an eBay Company

 

 

Just tried .net instead of .co.uk and still get the holding page, so think his whole account is suspended pending investigations I would expect from a google of "xl trading" it seems he has been providing sky cards as well !! which IS a big opppps... links to a thread on mse.