Blackhorse/MFI claimform help - *discontinued**

[johno23]

Hi All

 

Would really appreciate some advice!

 

I ordered a kitchen & bathroom from MFI totally £8300.

 

I paid £2300 by credit cards & cash which left a credit agreement of £6000.

 

The bathroom had been delivered and the kitchen totalling £5500 never arrived due to MFI going into administration.

 

Blackhorse are now stating I owe 2600 as the kitchen that was only being delivered was for only £3800.

 

Amazing how they always get things wrong in their favour.

 

I am able to provide credit card statements for £2000 as proof of payment but i paid £300 in cash which is now lost as I cannot find the receipt of payment.

 

If i send a CCA request can i include how they come to the figure that they claim I owe them.

 

Also how would this be presented in a letter.

 

Many Thanks

[citizenB]

Just to let you know, site team are aware.. you havent been abandoned:)

 

Have sent out a couple of SOS messages as well for you.

[citizenB]

Hi johno,

 

I have asked another CAGer what to do and this is the recommendation.

 

 

I would think he'd need to ask Black Horse for a breakdown of how they arrive at that figure , but he needs to know what logic they're applying to the agreement-

I'd say a CCA with an extra sentence asking for a specific breakdown of the balance - then he can come back and ask whether they've got it right.......

You will find a template CCA letter in this link

CCA LETTER

hth

[johno23]

Thanks Citizen will send off letter and see what their response is.

 

Johno

[citizenB]

You can thank johnnymitch for the advice.

 

Please keep us updated.

[johno23]

Thanks all for your sound advice!

 

I have sent a CCA request off to Blackhorse on Mon 2nd and still waiting for a response.

I also added the extra bit in the request on how they managed to come to the amount stated in the agreement.

after the 14 days do I send an account in dispute letter off if no agreement is received by me, even though the agreement was made in 2008 (before April 07).

 

Many Thanks

[johno23]

received a reply today asking me to contact them immediately regarding my agreement.

 

Yes likely going to do that!!

[johno23]

Ok recieved my agreement and all in order as i expected. They have informed me that the statement of account will be with me shortly, however three weeks later nothing received.

 

I am disputing the amount that they claim i owe £2600. I have sent them copies of statements to the value of £2000 to show proof of payment.

 

However funny enough they are telling me to ask for the money back through a dispute with the credit cards and that I am still owe them £2600.

 

Why are creditors allowed to dictate procedures and mess up your credit file, when their is a clear dispute, wrong amount!!

 

I have sent a letter before action, can anyone else advise further

 

Many Thanks

[citizenB]

What, they are suggesting you can make a claim through your credit card provider ?

 

I am not sure what to advise you. Will look in later to see if you have had any response..

[johno23]

cheers citizen

 

In a nutshell, I purchased bathroom & Kitchen from MFI for £8300.

 

MFI went into administration, bathroom delivered but kitchen NOT delivered.

 

Credit agreement was for £6000 with Blackhorse.

 

Kitchen that was not delivered was £5695.

 

I also paid over £2000 in credit card payments.

 

Blackhorse chasing me for £2600 when only owe about £300.

 

I have forwarded credit card statements to Blackhorse to prove I made payments to MFI to value over £2000.

 

Blackhorse say I need to dispute my credit card payments in order to receive my payments back, but I have paid off my cards & closed the accounts.

 

I have paid MFI for the main of the bathrooms and it was the kitchen that was not delivered that I thought was for the agreement.

 

I believed that due to kitchen not being delivered and my payments of £2000 that my credit agreement should not by £6000 as signed by me, not £2600 as Blackhorse now state, but approx £300.

 

My questions would be why should I dispute my payments for my credit card when money has been received and evidence has been provided.

 

So frustrating for the consumer, originally I was told if I provided statements of payment that would be that, but then they seem to change the goal posts.

 

They basically sayi should dispute my payments to MFI with my credit cards and then pay Blackhorse. My belief was that MFI & Blackhorse should be sorting this out between themselves.

 

Many Thanks

[johnerog]

For starters i am not a lawyer; but I do have some remarks/questions.

 

1. Surely this is a multipart agreement.

2. Why not contact MFI receivers to find out how they allocated the debt/money you paid.

3. My opinion would be that you are not responsible for goods not received; it feels as if Blackhorse have a case with the receiver not you.

4. Ask Blackhorse for a copy if the underwriting sheet or any document saying what comission was paid, if any and to who. You should have been informed if there was. Its called fiduciary duty.

 

John

[johno23]

Ok. There is just one obstacle now in my battle with Blackhorse.

 

I made payments to MFI for approx £2000 on my HSBC credit card.

 

Blackhorse are stating that i need to dispute these payments with HSBC.

 

Am I able to still dispute payments after twelve months of the accounts being closed.

 

Many Thanks

Edited January 19, 2010 by johno23
Spelling

[johnerog]

Ok. There is just one obstacle now in my battle with Blackhorse.

 

I made payments to MFI for approx £2000 on my HSBC credit card.

 

Blackhorse are stating that i need to dispute these payments with HSBC.

 

Am I able to still dispute payments after twelve months of the accounts being closed.

 

Many Thanks

Can you post a copy of the original agreement? (take out anything that may identify you first).

I do not see how you need to dispute payments with HSBC if you have the statements to prove it.

Records should be kept for six years so obtaining anything you want from HSBC should not be a problem, although they may wish to charge you.

John

[johno23]

Thanks John

 

The agreement is enforceable.

 

The original agreement was for £6000 to Blackhorse, for items purchased through MFI.

 

I have made payments to MFI, and also items were not delivered the kitchen.

 

The amount owed was reduced to £2605 to a Blackhorse Credit Agreement.

 

Blackhorse are stating I should make a dispute to the credit card companies to get my money back.

 

The think is my credit cards are now paid off and closed, so can I still dispute payment.

 

Or is it straight forward that MFI should pay Blackhorse directly, and they are just playing a game as they have gone in to administration.

 

Thanks

[johnerog]

Thanks John

 

The agreement is enforceable.

 

The original agreement was for £6000 to Blackhorse, for items purchased through MFI.

 

I have made payments to MFI, and also items were not delivered the kitchen.

 

The amount owed was reduced to £2605 to a Blackhorse Credit Agreement.

 

Blackhorse are stating I should make a dispute to the credit card companies to get my money back.

 

The think is my credit cards are now paid off and closed, so can I still dispute payment.

 

Or is it straight forward that MFI should pay Blackhorse directly, and they are just playing a game as they have gone in to administration.

 

Thanks[/quote

]

I seriously recommend that you ask the receiver AND blackhorse if any commission was paid to MFI on this deal. If commission was paid for using BH you should have been informed. If they paid commission to MFI without informing you they have committed an offence.

 

I believe that your CC company may be liable for any purchase over £100 and they have to keep records for at least six years; have you sent them a subject access request?

[johno23]

I have today received court papers today and would firstly like some advice on the following, looking at all angles that I can defend the claim.

 

I have received two default notices below, but still do not have a default on my credit file.

 

Many Thanks

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[johno23]

Hi All

 

would really like some advice as really struggling.

 

I have received court papers for Blackhorse fro approx £3000.

 

The particulars of claim:-

 

The claimants claim is for the balance due under a credit agreement regulated by the consumer credit act 1974, following default in payment.

Date of agreement 6th Oct 08

 

The claimants claim is for the balance due>>>>>

 

 

Now I have received a valid agreement however it is dated 17th sept 08, does this matter that the date is wrong.

 

Also i am only disputing the amount I owe as I have made payments and hold receipt of these payments made.

 

How do i go about this?

 

And lastly I require a breakdown off blackhorse for all items that have been purchased and prices on how they get to the amount owed as it is wrong.

 

If I send in a CPR how do i informt the court that I am awaiting information to be able to put in a good defence.

 

Many Thanks

 

Johno

Edited May 3, 2010 by johno23
wrong date of agreement

[cerberusalert]

You can disregard the earlier DN as it's been replaced, it was in order in any case. Unfortunately the second one is too as they have allowed more than prescribed time to remedy.

 

Have they demanded full repayment beforehand by any chance? Because if they have it could be seen as unlawful rescission of contract & you would have the later DN proving it.

[johno23]

Cheers Cerbs

 

No only ever demanded the arrears.

 

I have received court papers and have started a new thread regarding this

 

Thanks

[The Mould]

Hi All

 

would really like some advice as really struggling.

 

I have received court papers for Blackhorse fro approx £3000.

 

The particulars of claim:-

 

The claimants claim is for the balance due under a credit agreement regulated by the consumer credit act 1974, following default in payment.

Date of agreement 6th Oct 08

 

The claimants claim is for the balance due>>>>>

 

 

Now I have received a valid agreement however it is dated 6th sept 08, does this matter that the date is wrong.

 

Also i am only disputing the amount I owe as I have made payments and hold receipt of these payments made.

 

How do i go about this?

 

And lastly I require a breakdown off blackhorse for all items that have been purchased and prices on how they get to the amount owed as it is wrong.

 

If I send in a CPR how do i informt the court that I am awaiting information to be able to put in a good defence.

 

Many Thanks

 

Johno

 

Hello johno,

 

Firstly, you had better acknowledge receipt to the court.

 

Secondly, have a good read of Civil Procedure Rules, and have a good read of Pre-Action Conduct Practice Direction, you can find this info on the Ministry Of Justice web site.

 

Just acknowledge the court first, in the court bundle is there a 'List of documents' that the claimant's claim is to rely on?

 

If not send a CPR request to the claimant requesting for disclosure of the documents that they say they are going to rely on in their claim, send this request by recorded post.

 

So you intend to admit part of the claim, then you need those doc's so you can compare with your own record.

 

The court is not going to over act or even act at all regarding the dates of the agreement, its probably a simple mistake on their part.

 

What about the Default Notice, do you have your copy, if so, can you post it up so we can rip into it, I mean so that we can have a look at it, you know, to make sure that it was properly executed in accordance with legislation, you never know, the Default Notice could be flawed, and that would be good news for you.

 

Anyway, don't panic, I am sure that you are not, please up-date, when you can, or post up some more questions, there are loads of good guys and girls on cag who would be willing to help you as much as they can.

 

Kind Regards

 

The Mould

[johno23]

Cheers Mould

 

I have had my default notices that are posted on my Blackhorse thread by cerbs and they are all in order.

 

The question is i am disputing the amount as I have made payments.

 

Do I use the CPR route to ask for them to provide a sales invoice of a breakdown of all products and prices that they claim to be the amount owed.

 

Do i do this by CPR 31.18 letter. Also do I write to the court just to inform them about this, if the time is getting close to putting in a defence, due to awaiting relevant documents.

 

Many Thanks

[The Mould]

Cheers Mould

 

I have had my default notices that are posted on my Blackhorse thread by cerbs and they are all in order.

 

The question is i am disputing the amount as I have made payments.

 

Do I use the CPR route to ask for them to provide a sales invoice of a breakdown of all products and prices that they claim to be the amount owed.

 

Do i do this by CPR 31.18 letter. Also do I write to the court just to inform them about this, if the time is getting close to putting in a defence, due to awaiting relevant documents.

 

Many Thanks

 

Morning johno,

 

When did you get the court papers?

 

Send the CPR request to the claimant asking for disclosure of the doc's their claim relies on, when you inspect the doc's you can compare the amount, did they not list the doc's the claim relies on?

 

Have you sent the acknowledgment of receipt to the court yet?

 

Kind Regards

 

The Mould

[johno23]

Morning Mould

 

Received court papers yesterday Friday.

 

The particulars of claim are:-

 

The claimants claim is for the balance due under a credit agreement regulated by the consumer credit act 1974, following default in payment.

Date of agreement 6th Oct 08

 

The claimants claim is for the balance due>>>>>

 

I have received the CCA and all in good order, I am only disputing the amount. It was for products purchased through MFI which i have made payments and the credit was through blackhorse.

 

MFI went in to administration and only part of the goods were delivered.

 

Blackhorse seem to be saying to me to dispute my payments made to MFI through a credit card dispute, but I have refused as payments were made to MFI before signing the CCA.

 

Hope that is clear, hard to explain, so complicated and difficult!

 

Many Thanks for your help!

[johno23]

The gist of this mess is as follows:-

10th November 2009

Agreement No:- ?????????

I am writing to you regarding my dispute on the above agreement number.

On the 14th May 2008, I entered the MFI store in Lancaster and ordered a kitchen and two bathrooms for £8300.

Ensuite:- £1405.00

Bathroom:- £1200.00

Kitchen:- £5695.00

On the 19th August 08 I made a payment of £1300 and on the 6th October 08 I made a payment of £737.85 to MFI Furntiure Centre Lancaster (HSBC statements enclosed) and also £262.15 cash payment (cannot find receipt)

Credit Agreement signed on the 6th september 10.

I received delivery of the bathroom and ensuite but the kitchen failed to be delivered, due to MFI going in to administration.

£8300 - £5695.00 (kitchen not delivered) = £2605

Payments made £1300 + £737.85 = £2037.85

£2605-£2037.85 = £562.15

I believe as MFI have gone in to administration I am not liable to pay for the insurance for the bathrooms £133.09 + £145.60 = £278.69.

£562.15 - £278.69 = 283.46 owed to Blackhorse.

[The Mould]

Morning Mould

 

Received court papers yesterday Friday.

 

The particulars of claim are:-

 

The claimants claim is for the balance due under a credit agreement regulated by the consumer credit act 1974, following default in payment.

Date of agreement 6th Oct 08

 

The claimants claim is for the balance due>>>>>

 

I have received the CCA and all in good order, I am only disputing the amount. It was for products purchased through MFI which i have made payments and the credit was through blackhorse.

 

MFI went in to administration and only part of the goods were delivered.

 

Blackhorse seem to be saying to me to dispute my payments made to MFI through a credit card dispute, but I have refused as payments were made to MFI before signing the CCA.

 

Hope that is clear, hard to explain, so complicated and difficult!

 

Many Thanks for your help!

 

Ok johno,

 

So you have paid some money to MFI, you have only received some of the goods and Blackhorse want the full amount from you for the full balance, so who arranged for the credit facility, was it MFI?

 

Sorry if that sounds a bit stupid, but a demand is being made on you to pay off/clear the debt, but the goods have not all been delivered, so therefore you need only pay for what has been delivered, does that make any sense?

 

Kind Regards

 

The Mould