Direct Legal & Collections - more threats

[M1sterP]

I've today received a threatening letter from DL&C (again) despite not missing any payments to them for as long as I can remember.... well, ever, since my payment plan was agreed.

 

The letter starts:

 

"As you have failed to maintain acceptable payment instalments on your account, we have made enquiries with the local Land Registry and have received formal confirmation that you are a home owner.

 

It is now our intention to commence legal proceedings against you for non payment of this account. Once a County Court Judgment has been obtained, a further application will be made to secure this debt against your financial interest in your property by way of a Charging Order."

 

They go on to use the usual old waffle about calling them to "discuss the situation".

 

My wondering is this - does this seem like one of their usual automated and sent in error letters? I've had plenty in the past accusing me of not making payments, however none like this where they talk of obtaining info from the Land Registry.

 

I have written back saying they should check their records as payments have never ceased and that I find their letter disappointing both in tone and content.

 

Also, surely they wouldn't seek a CCJ if I've been making regular payments?! My debt comes from a credit card with Egg which defaulted at about £9,000. After outrageous penalty fees, this ended up with DL&C at about £10,500 and now my account stands at just over £5,000.

 

Given I've paid back 50% of the debt and probably more than DL&C bought the debt for, would they take things a step further even though I'd been making regular payments?

 

Thoughts would be appreciated.

 

Thanks

[WelshMam2009]

Have you ever CCA'd them MisterP??

 

Also, it's more a question of IF a CCJ is obtained, not ONCE...the cheeky beggars!!

[PGH7447]

have you ever requested a cca of dlc, give them something to think about

[Bazooka Boo]

So long as you have proof of your continued payments and haven't defaulted then, yes I am inclined to agree with you that it is probably just some computer generated 'threat error'

 

I would ask them for their complaints procedure and use it to the maximum, have you put in a claim for the charges applied on the account??

[M1sterP]

Not gone down the CCA route with any creditors. I know it seems to be the stock response on here and maybe I've been naive in not doing it to date - maybe it's something I'll consider later.

 

However, I just wondered if anyone could shed some light on whether they'd seriously try the CCJ route even though I'd not missed any payments and cleared over half the original debt....

[WelshMam2009]

Not gone down the CCA route with any creditors. I know it seems to be the stock response on here and maybe I've been naive in not doing it to date - maybe it's something I'll consider later.

 

However, I just wondered if anyone could shed some light on whether they'd seriously try the CCJ route even though I'd not missed any payments and cleared over half the original debt....

 

If they believe there's equity in your property then yes, I believe they will.

 

If they then progress to obtaining a charge on the property they may also be entitled to interest @ 8% which is a nice little earner for them.

 

Giving what you've said above though, I'm wondering if you might be better off reclaiming your charges. Also, you've not signed any agreement with DLC so am not sure how they have managed to add £1.5k to your debt either!!

[Huff&Puff]

Definitly CCA them, there is a good chance that any agreement will be unenforceable, if they even have one at all. Yet again a DCA's greed may end up with them turning a regular payment into nothing

[Deb T]

I'm not sure DLC can actually apply the charge to the property, they're the collecting agent not the OC...but I may be wrong, probably am.

 

If they're not the collecting agent and they own the debt or at least they think they do then you really do need to see the assignment from

egg to them etc....

[Pinky69]

All DCAs are desperate now because no one is paying them. DLC tried to put pressure on me a couple of years ago and didn't get another penny from me for their stupidity and greed. I wouldn't pay them a farthing unless they proved they had the right to collect the debt and there was an enforceable agreement.

[WelshMam2009]

I'm not sure DLC can actually apply the charge to the property, they're the collecting agent not the OC...but I may be wrong, probably am.

 

If they're not the collecting agent and they own the debt or at least they think they do then you really do need to see the assignment from

egg to them etc....

 

Depends on the type of assignment as you say, absolute or equitable.

 

Either way they could instigate proceedings either for themselves (absolute assignment) or as agents for the OC (equitable assignment) although this would need to be clearly stated on the claim forms.

[Mrs E Blackadder]

Just thought I would stick my oar in on this one as I have charging orders on my property - one by a dca that took its chances and got what it wanted. Basically, my ex paid no heed to anything these beggars sent to him, and eventually they realised that if he wasn't paying them any attention, then he probably wouldn't respond to them applying for a charging order and they were correct. They are now in line for around £6,000 when this house is sold, and they have done virtually nothing for it other than try to deal with a man who stuck his thick head in the sand.

 

So, yes this could well be a genuine ploy on their part to ensure they get their money back from you. HOWEVER, they might be onto a bit of a loser with yourself as you have kept to your repayment plan and not missed any payments with them so I'm not sure that a judge would agree that they have grounds to get the charging order applied. If the charge was applied, interest can only be added if it is over a certain amount, which from memory is about £5,000. As your debt is about this amount, you could probably argue that they are actually in a better position accepting your continued payment as they are getting their money rather than waiting for your home to be sold at some future date. Again, I think this is something a Judge would take into serious consideration.

 

I think you need to go down the CCA route because you may well find the debt is unenforceable, however in the meantime please keep your wits about you over the charging order. Once applied for they can be notoriously difficult to stop and you will need very good grounds, which may well be why the DCA have gone down this road and they consider it a good way of 'protecting their investment'.

 

If it goes ahead, The Land Registry will write to you, notifying you that an interim charging order has been made by the DCA in xxx County Court (this can be done without you even knowing about it) and you can now object. Object if you like, but it is a waste of time because the Land Registry NEVER takes heed of any objections from what I can make out but at least your objection will be on file. You will then get a hearing date from the Country Court for the full charging order and it is at this stage you can start tackling things from the court side.

 

I don't want to be all doom and gloom and it is more than possible that in your case it is all empty threats, but I thought I would let you know that it is quite possible for dodgy debt collectors to apply for and be granted a charging order on your property, so please keep your wits about you. You want to tackle your problems which is excellent - my ex didn't so the dca took advantage.

[M1sterP]

Just thought I would stick my oar in on this one as I have charging orders on my property - one by a dca that took its chances and got what it wanted. Basically, my ex paid no heed to anything these beggars sent to him, and eventually they realised that if he wasn't paying them any attention, then he probably wouldn't respond to them applying for a charging order and they were correct. They are now in line for around £6,000 when this house is sold, and they have done virtually nothing for it other than try to deal with a man who stuck his thick head in the sand.

 

So, yes this could well be a genuine ploy on their part to ensure they get their money back from you. HOWEVER, they might be onto a bit of a loser with yourself as you have kept to your repayment plan and not missed any payments with them so I'm not sure that a judge would agree that they have grounds to get the charging order applied. If the charge was applied, interest can only be added if it is over a certain amount, which from memory is about £5,000. As your debt is about this amount, you could probably argue that they are actually in a better position accepting your continued payment as they are getting their money rather than waiting for your home to be sold at some future date. Again, I think this is something a Judge would take into serious consideration.

 

I think you need to go down the CCA route because you may well find the debt is unenforceable, however in the meantime please keep your wits about you over the charging order. Once applied for they can be notoriously difficult to stop and you will need very good grounds, which may well be why the DCA have gone down this road and they consider it a good way of 'protecting their investment'.

 

If it goes ahead, The Land Registry will write to you, notifying you that an interim charging order has been made by the DCA in xxx County Court (this can be done without you even knowing about it) and you can now object. Object if you like, but it is a waste of time because the Land Registry NEVER takes heed of any objections from what I can make out but at least your objection will be on file. You will then get a hearing date from the Country Court for the full charging order and it is at this stage you can start tackling things from the court side.

 

I don't want to be all doom and gloom and it is more than possible that in your case it is all empty threats, but I thought I would let you know that it is quite possible for dodgy debt collectors to apply for and be granted a charging order on your property, so please keep your wits about you. You want to tackle your problems which is excellent - my ex didn't so the dca took advantage.

 

Thanks for your comments.

 

Believe me, I've been there and stuck my head in the sand too a few years ago which basically put me in a lot of trouble. I already have a charging order on my property thanks to Link Financial's threatening behaviour but I'm surprised DL&C are now taking this route bearing in mind I've cleared over £5,000 off my debt and haven't missed payments.

 

I've had threats from them before and on questioning them I get the "automated sent in error" response so I'm hoping that will be the case again. After all, if I've read correctly as per the amount these b**tards buy debts for, they're probably already well in the money on my account.

 

Will wait and see what they say. May CCA them but the reason I've not really gone down this route with any of my creditors is because they have quietened down after a long time making my life a misery. I tend to think if I stir the hornets nest, I'm just asking for more of their nasty behaviour.

[Mrs E Blackadder]

Yes, I know what you mean about stirring the hornets nest, and sometimes it is a case of letting sleeping dogs lie. I don't think my ex faced up to many of his debts, probably because he was just totally overwhelmed by them all, but if you don't ask for help then you don't get it. You have, at the very least, realised that sticking your head in sand isn't the answer and are now aware that these lovely debt collectors can be more than just a little underhand!

 

If you have stuck to your payments then I really can't see why on earth they would suddenly want to start playing silly beggars, and like I said before I suspect that any self respecting County Court judge would take the same approach. As you already have a charging order then you will know the process, so I really think it is a case of keeping a watchful eye on what they might be playing at. As you have had letters sent to you in error by them in the past then it could have happened again, so perhaps you could write to them to find out.

 

Another quick thought is that if you have little or no equity in your property and they are actually going for a charging order, you could very well argue that they would be so far down the list of creditors if the property was to be sold that they wouldn't get their money anyway. Better that they carry on with the current arrangement!

[M1sterP]

I've just had an e-mail repsonse from them which doesn't really give much information but asks for new income / expenditure information. I've always ignored their requests for this but now I'm wondering if I should do it just to try and keep them from going down the CCJ route.

 

Their response is as follows:

 

We note from previous correspondence that we entered you into a concessionary arrangement in August 2005 for £40 and since October 2006 received £70 per month.

We now require updated details of your income and expenditure along with your new proposals to clear the above outstanding balance as the last information we received was back in 2006.

We do require the above information within 7 days, alternatively you can telephone our offices on 08443358450 to speak to one of our representatives.

 

Now with this, they've not provided a form for me to fill out which seems a bit strange. But I'm wondering...... do I bother with a response to them? I suppose I could completely make up the figures to suit my own case, but what are their rights in demanding this information? Should I do it just to try and ward off their latest threats?

 

I'd be grateful for some guidance here....

[Deb T]

Sound like they realise the charge route may not be applicable...or else they'd have gone for the jugular off the bat. I think I'd be tempted not to enter into the I&E route with them but instead write back that since the last form filling nothing has changed financially and that you have maintained your good payment record with them regardless.

 

In this day and age if a DCA is getting more than the agreed sum they should be thankful and leave the account well alone...

 

Don't play their game, play your own and at the same time I would look into Mrs E Balackadder's comment regards the minimum amount on a charging order re the interest, it may very well be that you're below it already and DLC know this and have now changed tact as there is nothing to be gained from the charging oprder other than costs to themselves for applying for it.

[Huff&Puff]

what are their rights in demanding this information?

 

They have no right whatsoever to demand this information, it's as simple as that. Only a court can order you to give I & E info.

[WelshMam2009]

They have no right whatsoever to demand this information, it's as simple as that. Only a court can order you to give I & E info.

 

I agree...I refused to supply mine to DLC but then I wasn't looking to negotiate a repayment plan with them.

 

If the OP wants to continue paying DLC then a review of I&E is a fairly common occurrence.

[NailPost]

And ask them to produce an agreement - and their complaints procedure.

[M1sterP]

Just as an update on this thread......

 

After the e-mail asking for an up to date I/E submission, I replied saying that of course I'd like to get rid of the debt but there was no way that I could up my payments.

 

Reply came back saying they'll therefore agree to keep payments at the same level for the next six months. So no CCJ as per their original threat.

 

No doubt I'll get something else off them in the not too distant future - be it letter telling me my payments aren't being made (lies), a nice looking stripey postcard asking me to phone a certain number, or another threat of legal action even though I am regularly paying them.

[Huff&Puff]

I still think you should ask to see an agreement. Even if you want to pay, knowing that the agreement is unenforceable or non-existent puts you in very strong negotiating position. Especially if they ever threaten you again.

[focus243]

I would ask for the CCA. My OH was paying them and never missed a payment then they asked for it to be increased which he couldn't and they said they would be taking legal action, which they did through Northampton court.

 

He defended the case as he had nothing to lose and they couldn't come up with a CCA. The judge issued a Stay. 6 months later he had a call from DLC saying they were dropping the case.