Hi Ccj Issue :)

[Fiscalawareness]

Hi everyone

 

i have just had a CCJ in defualt from Howdens

 

I had a few months back April i think court papers through but i made a payment scheme with them so it didnt go to court

 

however they would only except the payment paid of in three payments and ignored my request to use a income exp form.

 

these payments of 600 plus were not affordable and i could not continue to pay

 

i do not pay for two months and have recently recieved a CCJ in defualt

 

Howdens did not reissue a court date and i had no paper work at all, until i recieved the CCJ.

 

I am now applying for a N244 and have stated i recieved no warning or payment scheme

 

however i cannot argue that i do not own the money

 

any thoughts cheers james

[chauvesouris]

On the basis that you haven't got any argument that you don't owe the money there wouldn't seem to be much point in applying for a set-aside as it will only lead to you being defeated in a full hearing even if initially successful.

 

The only exception to this would be if Howdens were willing to settle out of court - so that, after the set-aside, they didn't then go to a full hearing. However, I can't think why they would want to do that as they've got a rock-solid judgment debt now.

 

On second thoughts there is another option - if you could get the set-aside and then pay the debt back in full before the full hearing, you would avoid a CCJ against you.

[foolishgirl]

Hi fiscal

 

It sounds as though Howdens may have applied for judgment despite the agreement they made with you to accept payments.

 

What was your debt in connection with? eg a credit card, loan etc?

If so, you need to consider the following to decide if you have a case for a set aside:

 

1. Have you ever had any unlawful charges aplied to your account eg over limit, late payment? If so, have you ever reclaimed them?

 

2. Have you ever applied for a copy of your credit agreement? If so, is it enforceable?

 

3. Have you ever received a default notice prior to terminating your account/court action? If so, did it fully comply with statute eg. no of days given for rectifying; amount claimed etc.

 

4. Has the debt been assigned & if so, did you receive a notice of assignment?

[debbbbsy]

On the basis that you haven't got any argument that you don't owe the money there wouldn't seem to be much point in applying for a set-aside as it will only lead to you being defeated in a full hearing even if initially successful.

Sorry, but I disagree, whether you owe the money or not, these companies have to follow court procedures.

If they haven't issued the correct default notices, & more importantly you were not given the opportunity to defend this claim. This gives you the opportunity to apply for a set a side.

Owing the money is a moral issue. Following Court procedures is a legal requirement. Courts should only deal with the law.

 

I would suggest you use CPR 31.14. Forcing them to provide you with all paperwork they would require to enforce this debt,loan agreement, default notices...They have 7 days to respond.

 

Good Luck

[r&b]

I would suggest you use CPR 31.14. Forcing them to provide you with all paperwork they would require to enforce this debt,loan agreement, default notices...They have 7 days to respond.

 

Good Luck

 

CPR 31.14 can only be used when already in proceedings. if that is not the case CPR 31.16 would be the better option:

 

THREADS:

 

31.14:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/159445-getting-them-reveal-their.html

 

31.16:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/173201-why-you-shouldnt-use.html

 

should the £10 fee not be a problem i would also suggest a SAR to the original creditors regstd address, sent recd del with printed or disguised signature. however, this will only be of use should the case go further as they get 40 days in which to reply, outside your time to apply to set aside.

 

you really need to answer FGs questions in order to see if u have grounds to set aside this judgment.

CPR part 13 deals with this:

http://www.justice.gov.uk/civil/procrules_fin/contents/parts/part13.htm

[Fiscalawareness]

wow guys thanks for the advice, howdens is a kitchin company its a trade account, the main problems was i was thye asked for me to pay the balance to quickly ie 4 months 600 a month

 

they had a court date and i recieved the papers

 

i then contacted them and agreed to pay the 600 and made the first payment

 

i could not make the second payment as it was not a fair payment and left me a risk of not paying the mortgage

 

I recieved the CCJ a month later in default

 

i never recieved a new court date with the new balance owed and so did not put in a defence or set up monthly payments

 

I am putting in a set aside to agree payments that are reasonable and fiar based on my income / exp and other debters

 

Plus i am stating the court procedure were not followed correctly

 

cheers james

[foolishgirl]

 

I am putting in a set aside to agree payments that are reasonable and fiar based on my income / exp and other debters

 

Plus i am stating the court procedure were not followed correctly

 

 

IMO this won't get you your set aside.

 

Can you answer the questions in post 3 & post up details of the POC & the judgment (minus personal details)?

 

Also did you acknowledge the claim to the court i.e. send back the form that came with the POC? And did you submit a defence? Or did you just phone Howdens & come to an 'agreement'?

[supasnooper]

as foolishgirl has already advised, the reason you propose for a set aside is not valid.

 

have a look at these links for info -

 

Setting aside the original CCJ of your CCA

 

CCJ removal inc. step by step guide

 

As advised, do post up the Particulars of Claim (POC) and the Judgment Order.

[chauvesouris]

You had a court date and didn't realise that it was still on because you thought you were still in negotiation with the creditor. This might, at a push, be a good enough reason to get a set-aside. But even if it is then, as I have already said, you still have to face a full hearing. As you don't have any defence this would seem rather pointless - and will mean you will incur extra costs when you lose (which you will).

 

Would I be right in thinking that your main concern is that you are unable to pay the judgment debt within 14 days? If that is the case then I think your best bet is to apply for a variation order - where the court can order that you pay the debt off in instalments rather than all at once.

 

Debbbbsy: I wasn't suggesting that the claimants shouldn't follow the proper procedure - but it seems from what James has said, that they have followed the correct procedure and have left their court date (which he was aware of) open and then turned up when he defaulted again. This is all within the proper procedure. Moreover, if the proper procedure hasn't been followed then the court have to allow the set-aside (they don't have any discretion). But my point is that the set-aside is not an outcome - in this case it is, at best, a delay of the inevitable (and an increase in costs).

[foolishgirl]

 

I wasn't suggesting that the claimants shouldn't follow the proper procedure - but it seems from what James has said, that they have followed the correct procedure and have left their court date (which he was aware of) open and then turned up when he defaulted again. This is all within the proper procedure.

 

That was my thought too chauvesouris - all legal just not above board. :-|

 

If the assumption is correct, chauvesouris is right fiscal, you would be throwing good money after bad to look for a set aside. Go for the variation & move on with your life.

[Fiscalawareness]

thnaks everyone great help, i have tried for set aside, if that fails and i think it will i will try for a variation or should i do that now, papers went in before the advice never mind, live and learn

[Spamalot]

Pardon me for poking my nose in, and I may be talking out of my hat here..but..

 

How long ago did you apply for the set aside... is there any way you can contact the court and stop it??

 

'As an LIP you made an error in the procedure and it was a Variation order you wanted and not a set aside'.. maybe if it hasn't gone to far you may be able to withdraw it... just a thought..

 

I'll stand back now while I'm pelted with rotten tomatoes by the 'informed' caggers...

 

Spam.

[foolishgirl]

Good point spam.

 

Phone the court fiscal & see if it has been processed, they may take pity on you & it would save you another fee.

[Fiscalawareness]

sorry for not getting back to everyone, thanks for the advice will contact them and ask, its not due till 4th Jan

 

odd thing howdens legal keep calling to confirm my address over the phone

 

i have not spoke to them

 

cheers James