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    • we need the exact particulars of claim, not what you have put please.  
    • Thank you everyone for your quick responses I just wish I posted here in the first place    I probably shouldn't have filled in the claim form however on the letter it said I had limited time to do so and because I was dealing with CST law trying to come to an agreement with paying off the debt I didn't think it would get to this point and now I have probably made my situation worst. Of course, I would have posted here first before sending it off had I not been in communication with CST to set up an agreement.    I sent the letter back to the court as some point in early August, the issue date on the claim form is 28th July and the most recent letter I have received 'Notice of fast track' is dated 18th November    If I am honest I can't fully remember what I wrote word for word in my defence, it would have been along the lines of why I left, my reasons and the fact I returned to my old career in an office plus taking a pay cut to do so. There wasn't much room to write a long winded defence so I kept it relativity short.   The above document Andy has posted is the exact document I am now looking at very confused in what exactly I put where    I just want to re-iterate I never agreed with this money I owe due to the training bond but it has gone on for so long at this point I'm happy to set up a payment plan if the balance can get reduced or a small one off payment upfront and this is exactly what I was trying to do prior to receiving the most recent letter    I have had zero communication from CST law, Centrica advised me to deal with them directly and I was waiting for a response from CST with the offer we had put across to Centrica - I chased it multiple times the following weeks and they kept telling me they haven't had a response and when they do we'll contact you which they still have not   Ideally I would rather not give them any money however I feel like I am out of options at what I probably should have done years ago is attempt to get it reduced and set up a payment plan    Please let me know if I have missed any critical info out    Thanks again for everyones help    What is the claim for – the reason they have issued the claim? I left a British Gas apprenticeship within the first 12 months of starting and went back to my old career in an office , my reasons for leaving were down to the completely differant job role which I realised quikcly was not for me and it was impacting my mental health massively. The claim is for a training bond which was in a contract I signed based on a sliding scale Year 1 - £9,000 year 2 £6,000 year 3 £3,000     What is the total value of the claim? £13433    Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ? Yes   Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred? No  Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account? Training bond due to leaving an apprenticeship before 3 years    When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? After   Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? They have sent me a virtually signed document with the contract   Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/Equifax /Etc...) ? No   Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Centrica are claimant, CST law are dealing and the court   Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? I believe so yes   Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? I have had multiple letters like everyone else who has been on the forum over the years regarding this matter   Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Sums in Arrears”  or " Notice of Arrears "– at least once a year ? I am unsure, but when I left I had contested the original claim as I was dealing directly with Centrica’s collection team and they never got back to me after the final email I had sent and didn’t hear anything until years down the line   Why did you cease payments? N/A   What was the date of your last payment? N/A   Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? Correct I oringinally contested what was owed back in 2017 and gave my reasons for leaving and I assumed the matter was closed   Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? No  
    • OK thanks again Andy.   And understood 👍😉
    • Thank you for this. The first thing to be say is that this means that you are winning. It is pretty well unheard of in my experience for the bank to give way and finally return the money. The fact that they have done this under the threat of a judgement for breach of statutory duty indicates even more that they are worried about their position. Nowhere have they indicated that they have complied with the requirements of the Proceeds of Crime Act and informed the National crime agency. I don't believe they have and this is a very serious breach of statutory duty. Not only that it is a very serious breach of the FCA BCOBS regulations in that they are required to treat you fairly. Treating you fairly in this case means that they must comply with the rest of their statutory duties. It appears that they really haven't done this at all and that they have acted in an arbitrary way in disregard of the law and that they are hoping to get away with it. I find myself wondering how many other hundreds of people have been treated in exactly the same way – and you are probably the first ever to have stood up to them and to get them worried. I think I've already indicated that a press contact of mine in the Sunday Times would be very interested in this story. He has already run stories about the very poor standards applied by banks when deciding that their customers are involved in some fraudulent behaviour. The first thing to say about the letter which you have received is that they are trying to apply conditions to releasing your own money. It's your money and there should be no conditions and my suggestion is that you object to this. Secondly, not only are they threatening to continue to withhold your own money – but also they are saying that if they release it to you you will simply have the net figure without any kind of interest or compensation. It's clear that while they have had your money, they have invested it and earn money on it. They have probably been lending it out at between 16% and 20% and although the usual rate of interest is 8%, it seems to me that justice can only be served by repaying you your money plus the commercial rate of interest – at a compound rate. Normally the 8% is calculated at simple. Thirdly, they are not offering to pay you any compensation and clearly they are hoping to get away with it without any kind of sanction or not even a slap on the wrist.   Fourthly, they had the nerve to impose a seven day deadline. Don't worry about their deadline. It's a load of huff and puff. This is all part of their bluff game designed to intimidate you. At the end of seven days – what? Are they then going to insist on going to court?   If they really believe that they had done everything correctly and that the money was fraudulent, then they would not offer it to you back under any circumstances. It would be illegal for them to do so. You can be certain that these people do not want to go to court. In fact they probably wish they had never started.   Finally, they want the matter to be kept confidential – and I can't say I blame them. I would be ashamed if people knew that I had treated somebody else in this way and I'm sure they are worried about reputational damage. I'm also sure that there are extremely worried about what will happen if you get a judgement against them for breach of statutory duty. It will have to be reported to the FCA. It will have to be reported to the NCA. And of course it should be reported to the newspapers because people need to know what is going on. If you want, you can simply accept their proposal – get your money back, given confidentiality – and that's the end of the matter. However, you have no idea how this will impact on your record in the future. I imagine that they will bar you from ever opening an account with them again. – But at least you will have your money and you can get on with your life. However, if you want you can stand your ground and make it clear to them that you are going to be mucked around and treated like this and that you are prepared to go to court if they won't make a proper offer. I understand that you need to pay a court fee of about £350 in the next seven days. I expect that the bank is making this offer now hoping to dissuade you from spending any more money and hoping that you will back down. If you have the money to proceed then I would suggest very strongly that it will be a very serious sign of strength that you tell the bank that you're not interested in that you are paying the fee for the next stage of the court process. If the bank knows that you've called their bluff on this and that you have been prepared to invest further money in moving this legal action forward, then they will start to reflect and I can perfectly well imagine that they will make you another more interesting offer – once again on conditions of confidentiality. Without seeing any further offer, I'm already suggesting that you will probably be best off turning it down. In any event, I would remind you going back several months that I already predicted that the bank would make you confidential offer – and that has happened. I'm not saying that I'm always going to be right here – but I think that now basically the bank have pretty well admitted that they need to pay you your money, there is no chance of you losing it. You will get your money and it really is just a question of how much else you will get in addition. If you'd like to continue then let me know and I will suggest a draft response to them.
    • The cost of living in Britain over a person's lifetime is over £1.5m, new findings have claimed as the nation feels the squeeze amid soaring energy costs and dismal interest rates on cash savings.View the full article
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Totally Lost and In trouble. Debt Managers and Barclays


ashbash
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Hi

 

I just don't know where to start. I am student in my 3rd year of my degree well about to begin but can't understand what to do.

 

I'll make it short. Last year I was duped into by some con artists to take money out my barclays account. I have no overdraft apart from £200.00, they deposited £5000 into my account then asked me to withdraw it, then on the same day they told me they had deposited another sum of £5000 which they told me to withdraw and I did.

 

However it transpires that they never deposited the second sum, but the bank still gave me the £5000 over the counter without any questions at all.

 

Now I am in a terrible situation and have no idea what to do Debt Managers have sent me a letter saying they are taking me to court in pursuant to the county courts act 1984.

 

I have my last year of my degree to do but am terrified of going back to uni. I don't have nay money and they want my student loan. I have tried to speak to the barclays they said tough we dont care, I told the police and they said I have no chance of proving anything, I spoke to debt line and they said go bankrupt, Im a student and my life is messed up so much already. Please can someone help me.

 

Im sorry if this is in the wrond section.

Thank you

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No. you are in the right place. Are your parents around? If they are it might be a good idea to level with them and see what advice/help they can give.

Also, you can contact your student advice Office at your University. For you the important thing is to get throught your degree. Overdrafts are not covered by the CCA 1974 as loans - they are at the behest of the bank and have to be repaid. You are not the first person to be taken in by this [problem] and you won't be the last.

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Hi

 

I just don't know where to start. I am student in my 3rd year of my degree well about to begin but can't understand what to do.

 

I'll make it short. Last year I was duped into by some con artists to take money out my barclays account. I have no overdraft apart from £200.00, they deposited £5000 into my account then asked me to withdraw it, then on the same day they told me they had deposited another sum of £5000 which they told me to withdraw and I did.

 

However it transpires that they never deposited the second sum, but the bank still gave me the £5000 over the counter without any questions at all.

 

Now I am in a terrible situation and have no idea what to do Debt Managers have sent me a letter saying they are taking me to court in pursuant to the county courts act 1984.

 

I have my last year of my degree to do but am terrified of going back to uni. I don't have nay money and they want my student loan. I have tried to speak to the barclays they said tough we dont care, I told the police and they said I have no chance of proving anything, I spoke to debt line and they said go bankrupt, Im a student and my life is messed up so much already. Please can someone help me.

 

Im sorry if this is in the wrond section.

Thank you

what happened to you was a con nothing more or less I would insist the police investigate, you say they deposited 5 grand first in your account, was it cash, cheque what, there must be some way of tracing that transaction, why did the bank allow you to withdraw 10 thousand pounds in one day, without alarm bells ringing. you have been the victim of fraud and you seriously need to back to the police and demand action.

do you know these people? phone nuimbers? anything?

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Have a read of Debt Relief Order - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia It may look drastic but it's not as bad as it sounds.

Anthrax alert at debt collectors caused by box of doughnuts

 

Make sure you do not post anything which identifies you. Although we can remove certain things from the site unless it's done in a timely manner everything you post will appear in Google cache & we do not have any control over that.

 

Vir prudens non contra ventum mingit

 

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Why did you do this for these people? What were you supposed to gain by allowing them to use your bank account?

 

I really don't understand how the bank would release funds which weren't there. What is their explanation?

 

You must get the police involved if the bank haven't done that already.

 

DD

Edited by Desperate Daniella
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I'm sorry to hear of your plight but you have to be so careful these days, especially with money laundering etc

 

If the £5k doesn't form part of your student loan, and you don't own any assets to speak of, then I would be inclined to investigate Cerber's suggestion of a Debt Relief Order.

If you feel I've helped then by all means click my star to the left...a simple "thank you" costs nothing! ;)

 

Restons MBNA -v- WelshMam

 

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I'm really desperate, these people befriended me through my 1st year and I thought they were my friends but they were just setting me up.

I told the police everything and they said they even know who these people are but I would get arrested and they would get away with it, i could only sit there and cry when they did the interview becuase there was no hard evidence.

I can't tell my parents they wont be able to handle it.

My loan is to get me through the last year and pay my rent but the bank never gave me anything they just happily gave me 5k even though I don't have any facility arranged wih them.

 

Is my only option to do the DRO thing? I tried to get a job during the summer but there are non anywhere what is going to happen? i'm really messed up.

 

Thanks for listening

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I'm really desperate, these people befriended me through my 1st year and I thought they were my friends but they were just setting me up.

I told the police everything and they said they even know who these people are but I would get arrested and they would get away with it, i could only sit there and cry when they did the interview becuase there was no hard evidence.

I can't tell my parents they wont be able to handle it.

My loan is to get me through the last year and pay my rent but the bank never gave me anything they just happily gave me 5k even though I don't have any facility arranged wih them.

 

Is my only option to do the DRO thing? I tried to get a job during the summer but there are non anywhere what is going to happen? i'm really messed up.

 

Thanks for listening

 

 

Look Ashbash...nothing is ever as bad as it seems...honestly!! ;)

 

You have a choice here...to remain a victim or take control of your life and get this "inconvenience" sorted. There are no problems, only solutions!! :D

 

I would be inclined to say, without knowing your exact personal circumstances, that a DRO seems the way to go. However, I'm not sure what subject you are studying and how this might affect your professional studies later in life eg: finance, law etc.

 

Get yourself down to the Citizens Advice Bureau and make an appointment to see a financial advisor there. They will talk you through your options and I believe it will also help you to talk "face to face."

 

You need to get this distraction sorted so that it doesn't impair your studies.

 

Best of luck and let us all know how you get on!! :p

If you feel I've helped then by all means click my star to the left...a simple "thank you" costs nothing! ;)

 

Restons MBNA -v- WelshMam

 

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I know you are saying there is no hard evidence, but can I ask..who made the first deposit? how was it made? why did the bank hand over 5k when you did not have the funds to cover this amount? there must be some evidence of these transactions taking place. what did they offer you in return for putting this transaction through your account?

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Do you have your student loan paid into the same bank if you do you need to open another basic account to have that money paid into.

As said above CAB will help sort yourself out it is always better if you can talk to someone face to face.

If you can't talk to your parents about this is there another relative or good friend who you can tell it really does help to talk about things.

You must also insist that the police investigate this matter.

You also should be able to find a Solicitor who could give you advice most Solicitors will give you at least a half hour consultation for free.

Please try not to worry I know it's hard but you have found this forum and you will get plenty of help, advice and a shoulder to cry on should you need it.

DG

I have no legal training my knowledge comes from my personal life experiences

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I know you are saying there is no hard evidence, but can I ask..who made the first deposit? how was it made? why did the bank hand over 5k when you did not have the funds to cover this amount? there must be some evidence of these transactions taking place. what did they offer you in return for putting this transaction through your account?

 

The main problem that the OP has is that ignorance is no defence in the eyes of the law which is probably why the Police advised him that he would be the one who would be prosecuted.

 

There are loads of these money laundering scams going on and either through innocence or greed, people are being scammed daily.

 

I do have to question the bank's involvement in all this although, even if funds have cleared, they will subsequently be reversed if fraud is proven.

If you feel I've helped then by all means click my star to the left...a simple "thank you" costs nothing! ;)

 

Restons MBNA -v- WelshMam

 

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Because when a cheque is shown as cleared on an account, is isn't actually cleared through the clearing system, a fact a lot of people don't know. A bounced cheque or fraudulent instrument can take two days longer and more to be returned to a bank via the clearance system. The banks now pay money out earlier than they did previously because customers were moaning about how long it took cheques to clear. The OP drew the funds on the understanding that whatever was presented had cleared and it hadn't. It's not the bank's responsibility to monitor a customer withdrawing funds from their account. For the amounts that were withdrawn, ID would have been asked for and photocopied.

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I am still unclear how this fraud works. If the first £5,000 cheque was deposited, and funds withdrawn against it (despite it never clearing etc) then I could understand. But how could a bank pay out £10K, on the basis of only one 5,000 cheque "in the system".

 

I think Ashbash is a VICTIM in all this and I do not understand the police statement. Anyway, the police do not prosecute - prosecutors do. Are they really going to prosecute a VICTIM when the perpetrators themselve are not in the dock? I don't think so. They may allege that somehow Ashbash "colluded" with the fraudsters - but he seems to be the one who has lost money, so that does not add up.

 

I would be more "proactive" in my status as a victim. Write a formal letter to the police on this, ditto for the bank. Maybe write a letter to your MP re the police response. What about an article for your Student Newspaper setting out how you were the victim of a fraud and warning others.

 

If they did take you to court on this (and you produced letters, articles, interviewfrom your school paper etc) showing you were the VICTIM OF A FRAUD I very much doubt a judge would just find against you without a lot of other evidence. Get the bank employees in to tell how they failed in their duties etc.

 

I would NOT run to get DRO just yet (although a good option to consider down the line) but I would ensure you build up a "paper trail" thatyou can present in court showing you are a VICTIM.

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The first £5000 was actually deposited - it was the second £5000 that didn't clear. It's an old trick and,no - the bank are not responsible if you draw funds on something that doesn't reach it's final clearing date. What the student has to concentrate on now is finding a way to repay the money which the so-called friends scarpered with and get through the degree. The police haven't taken it up because the student would also be charged with fraud and the bank haven't made a formal complaint, so it is not as bad as it could have been.

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Clearly some of you know how this particular [problem] works, but I don't.

 

How can the bank have paid out £5,000 without checking that there were cleared funds available?. If they did this they were negligent and I can't see how ashkash should be being blamed for this.

 

Funds can be cleared Daniella and then subsequently discovered to have been fraudulent.

 

I'm not sure how it worked in Ash's case, and my sympathies are genuinely with him, however, it may have been a stolen/forged cheque or credit card deposit and there were sufficient funds available to allow the monies to clear.

 

However, once the deception is discovered, the monies will be recovered.

 

As Pinky said above, it is an old [problem] to pay genuine monies in the first time in order to build trust and confidence. Normally, the second payment is for a higher sum, which did not occur in this instance.

If you feel I've helped then by all means click my star to the left...a simple "thank you" costs nothing! ;)

 

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But how could a bank pay out £10K, on the basis of only one 5,000 cheque "in the system".

 

Two deposits were made Stephan.

If you feel I've helped then by all means click my star to the left...a simple "thank you" costs nothing! ;)

 

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The best example that I can think of, to try and describe this is if, when you are travelling abroad, someone asks you to take something back to the UK for them.

 

If you are stopped at customs and found to have been carrying drugs, you will be prosecuted. You are unlikely to have any hard evidence of actually being given the drugs and your gullability will not protect you from prosecution.

If you feel I've helped then by all means click my star to the left...a simple "thank you" costs nothing! ;)

 

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Sorry, I do understand about the funds being reclaimed if the deposit is discovered to be fraudulent - I confused things by referring to cleared funds when what I actually meant was that there were, according to ashbash, no funds. He says the second deposit didn't happen, so there was only one deposit.

 

So "they" paid in £5,000, and ashbash took it out.

 

Then "they" didn't pay in another £5,000, but the bank gave ashbash £5,000 when there was no money to withdraw.

 

Doesn't make any sense.

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Sorry, I do understand about the funds being reclaimed if the deposit is discovered to be fraudulent - I confused things by referring to cleared funds when what I actually meant was that there were, according to ashbash, no funds. He says the second deposit didn't happen, so there was only one deposit.

 

So "they" paid in £5,000, and ashbash took it out.

 

Then "they" didn't pay in another £5,000, but the bank gave ashbash £5,000 when there was no money to withdraw.

 

Doesn't make any sense.

 

Thats why i am thinking troll.

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Phil, CAGERS have discussions about what has happened in cases all the time - there are no trolls amongst us. You are not 5 minutes on the site and you are calling members you know nothing about "trolls". If you have nothing constructive to add to the advice given to the poster then I suggest you say nothing.

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Phil, CAGERS have discussions about what has happened in cases all the time - there are no trolls amongst us. You are not 5 minutes on the site and you are calling members you know nothing about "trolls". If you have nothing constructive to add to the advice given to the poster then I suggest you say nothing.

 

Well said Pinky!! ;)

If you feel I've helped then by all means click my star to the left...a simple "thank you" costs nothing! ;)

 

Restons MBNA -v- WelshMam

 

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Its quite a common con, the cheque appears as a balance before it clears, and is a form of a con the banks used for years to make loads of money.

 

The term "it's not rocket science" is more true than you think. The banks version of this "con" was originally dreamed up by moonlighting rocket scientists not bankers (or so I heard).

 

You borrow on money that does not actually exist, the "trick" is convincing people it does, AKA securitization.

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