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Quick question about eBay returns


Fenris
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Hi folks,

 

Quick question: when something turns up and is subsiqently found to be not as advertised, who has to foot the bill for the return? I've checked on eBay's help pages and found this:

 

In general, the seller is obliged to pay for the return shipping unless they have specifically provided, within their returns policy, that they require the buyer to pay for it.

 

But then PayPal suggests the buyer (moi!) has to pay to return it.

 

The thing is the seller says he'll refund the purchase price (£28 ) but won't refund the original postage cost (£12.50). If I then have to pay to return it to him (£12.50) I'll have ended up paying nearly the price of the item just on postage so I'll still be out of pocket by £25.00, which, for an item I can't use because it was missrepresented, is a bit out of order as far as I can see.

 

Oh and as far as I can tell he's a private seller.

 

Any ideas?

 

Ta! :)

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Paypal will refund the total amount you paid- the cost of the item plus the postage. Unfortunately you will have to pay for returning it. MAKE SURE you send it be trackable means- Either Recorded Delivery or Parcelfore 48.

 

You can then start a small claim for the return costs if he wont repay you. ;-)

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Paypal will refund the total amount you paid- the cost of the item plus the postage. Unfortunately you will have to pay for returning it. MAKE SURE you send it be trackable means- Either Recorded Delivery or Parcelfore 48.

 

You can then start a small claim for the return costs if he wont repay you. ;-)

 

Ah, there's a thought I hadn't considered. Seems a bit of way to go, but I am sick of being taken for a ride by eBay sellers who think nothing of selling items under false pretences.

 

Escalate this to a claim with Paypal.

 

Have done so. Sick of this idiot now. Keeps contradicting himself and then had the audacity to ask "why didnt you just read the listing in the first place?" Well, I did read the listing and he clearly stated that the item was legal. I do so love people who try and turn things around when they know they're the ones at fault!

 

The cost of returning the goods is rarely even close to what you were charged by the seller for them to be sent out in the first place. You probably won't be out of pocket to the tune of £12.50.

 

No, but the cheapest I can send it back for is £6.90. That means I've paid £6.90 for the pleasure of being shafted! :D But then I might just do as noomill060 suggested. It'll cost me nothing as I'm on IS and will show this plonker that he can't get away with these lies. That gives me a warm fuzzy feeling! :lol:

 

Just out of interest, is there some kind of guarantee that PayPal will refund me once the item is back with the seller? Because I don't want to get to the point where he's got the goods and the money and I'm out of pocket to the tune of almost £50.

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Once you provide the tracking number you should get your money back.

 

BUT - Please ensure that that send it back by Recorded Delivery.

 

Keep the receipt as you will need it for your small claim.:D

 

Good, that's fine thanks.

 

And yeah, I intend to send via Parcel Monkey as I've used them a lot and they always seem to give a good service. And I'll keep all the paperwork! ;)

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If you send it by Parcelforce- MAKE SURE that you send it by Parcelforce48. This is the only trackable service they offer.

 

Its got to be trackable, so you can give Paypal the tracking number and they can then check it on Parcelforce's website.

 

It must be heavy if you gonna use Parcelforce?

 

The ordinary parcels service is NOT trackable.

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If you send it by Parcelforce- MAKE SURE that you send it by Parcelforce48. This is the only trackable service they offer.

 

Its got to be trackable, so you can give Paypal the tracking number and they can then check it on Parcelforce's website.

 

It must be heavy if you gonna use Parcelforce?

 

The ordinary parcels service is NOT trackable.

 

No, not touching Parcel Force, I use Parcel Monkey: Cheap low price parcel delivery courier service | UK wide, Europe & International Shipping | Next Day £7.13+VAT! | Parcel Monkey They usualy send a DHL or Fed-Ex van. ;) Can't remember the last time I sent anything with Parcel Force!

 

It's actually not too heavy, but the seller charged me £12.50 sending through Parcel Force so it's still cheaper my way.

 

Ha! Just posted this and looked at what happened. I typred in http://www.parcel monkey.co.uk (without the space) and it put that ad-link in! Lol!

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Should also make sure that the delivery company is one that is recognised by Ebay/Paypal otherwise that could lead to difficulties.

 

 

Is the seller a business seller?

 

If he is not registered as such then check their feedback to see if they sell in quantities or value that would indicate that they are a business.

 

Be aware that the seller might refuse to accept/sign for the item and you would need to show proof of their refusal to ebay/paypal.

 

When marking their DSR stars do not put '0' as that will not show--use a '1' if that is how you feel about the deal.

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Is it trackable on the internet?

 

It is, yes.

 

Should also make sure that the delivery company is one that is recognised by Ebay/Paypal otherwise that could lead to difficulties.

 

 

Is the seller a business seller?

 

If he is not registered as such then check their feedback to see if they sell in quantities or value that would indicate that they are a business.

 

Be aware that the seller might refuse to accept/sign for the item and you would need to show proof of their refusal to ebay/paypal.

 

When marking their DSR stars do not put '0' as that will not show--use a '1' if that is how you feel about the deal.

 

It'll be either DHL or Fed-Ex. I can't see how PayPal could dispute either of these companies.

 

I've been buying and selling on eBay since 2000 and it's geting worse from both standpoints.

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Ebay/paypal only recognise a number of companies when it comes to accepting tracking information. I'm just pointing out that if your seller who appears to not be one of the better ones on ebay says that you haven't sent the item back to him ebay/paypal might not accept the tracking from monkey whatever as proof of receipt and you might lose your paypal claim.

 

This obviously is a worst case scenario and hopefully your seller will refund you without the need for ebay/paypal involvement.

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Have done so. Sick of this idiot now. Keeps contradicting himself and then had the audacity to ask "why didnt you just read the listing in the first place?" Well, I did read the listing and he clearly stated that the item was legal. I do so love people who try and turn things around when they know they're the ones at fault!

 

 

are you saying he has sold you something he shouldn't have, if so you do not need to return it, you can take it to trading standards who will provide a cover note for you to fax to paypal and you will get FULL refund

 

ida x

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Ebay/paypal only recognise a number of companies when it comes to accepting tracking information. I'm just pointing out that if your seller who appears to not be one of the better ones on ebay says that you haven't sent the item back to him ebay/paypal might not accept the tracking from monkey whatever as proof of receipt and you might lose your paypal claim.

 

This obviously is a worst case scenario and hopefully your seller will refund you without the need for ebay/paypal involvement.

 

Oh right, I see what you mean now. I can't honestly see it being a problem if it's DHL or Fed-Ex. Despite who I use as an agent, it's still DHL/Fed-Ex doing the legwork. The paperwork has the DHL or Fed-Ex logo on, so PayPal can't say they're not recognised carriers.

 

The seller did say he'd refund without the involvement of PayPal, but only the price of the item and not the original postage cost. I want the whole lot back, which is why I involved PayPal. Plus, this numpty's contradicted himself so many times I wouldn't trust him to refund me as far as I can spit.

 

are you saying he has sold you something he shouldn't have, if so you do not need to return it, you can take it to trading standards who will provide a cover note for you to fax to paypal and you will get FULL refund

 

ida x

 

Well, it's slightly contentious really. Basically I bought a set of rear lights for my car. They're tinted, which is perfectly legal so long as all the lights show the correct colour and the reflectors reflect. Now, on the auction page he says, and I quote:

 

..HAS A SUBTLE TINT SO THE REFLECTORS ARE STILL VISIBLE AT NIGHT!!!

 

The lights are fine, but I checked the reflectors and wasn't sure about them so took them to my local Police station just to be sure. I've got better things to do with my time without being pulled every time I go out! Lol! Anyway, the officer I spoke to said the reflectors weren't legal as they didn't reflect enough light and that I should not use them. Fair enough. So the Police and I say they're not legal, but the seller insists they are. Well, he originally said they were, then he e-mailed me saying if I wanted them 100% legal I should add reflectors. Then he said they were fine as they were. Then he said he'd send me a reflector to make them legal! You see the problem I'm having here? So, to be honest with you I reckon I'd have to send them to Trading Standards first for them to look at, which means I'd have to foot the postage bill anyway, so broad as what it is long really. I'm not out to "get" the seller, so if he wants them back, fine. I just want what I paid refunded.

 

The seller reckons he's sold loads of these without complaints. Fair play, he's sold quite a few for Fords and Vauxhalls, but I've been through his feedback and can't find any mention of VW ones other than the ones I bought. So maybe all the other marques lights he's modded are fine, but it doesn't work on VW ones? I don't know. I'm more likey to believe that the majority of his customers are 17 year old lads who don't really give a toss so long as their motor looks good! I want mine to look good too, but not at the expense of my licence! Lol!

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Anyone who buys to resell is a business and should be registered as such and adhere to all relevant consumer laws and regulations so that consumers can exercise their rights.

 

The Distance Selling Regulations would apply if this was a 'Buy It Now' but would not if it was an auction or if you are also a trader as business to business transactions are exempted.

 

Ebay's rules and regulations are irrelevant in English law if deemed as unfair.

 

Trading standards would opine as to the legality of the item and if in your favour it might negate the need to return the item.

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he is deff a trader, 421 sales in last 12 months with 4 negs and 2 neutrals does'nt seem to bad at first look.

 

do you not have a local trading standards that you can pop into?

 

or maybe advising warrey that if he is not going to do full refund plus return postage then you are going to trading standards with them making sure he agrees to pay return postage first seperate from your paypal claim

 

ida x

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As it has now been established that he is a trader and you rejected the item within 7 days, the contract is cancelled and you should start a small claim for the full amount paid under the Distance Selling Regs.

 

You dont have to return it yourself- it is for him to make arrangements collect it if he wants it back.

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You have far more rights with Distance Selling than you can shake a stick at.

 

 

2.18 Sales by private individuals not acting for business purposes are not

covered by the DSRs.

But if it's from a business.....

 

If it was a Buy it Now and not an auction then the trader has to give you written info about their policy on returns--if they do not do this in writing then you can reject the item form ANY reason [changed your mind etc] up to 3 months +7 days later.You do not have to return but just take 'reasonable care' of the item and make it available for collection.

 

http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/business_leaflets/general/oft698.pdf

 

if you the trader do not give the required written information at all (or give it

after the three month period mentioned above), the consumer’s

cancellation rights will end after three months and seven working

days from the day after the day the consumer received the goods.

 

 

3.57. If the goods are faulty or do not comply with the contract, the trader will have to pay for their return whatever the circumstances.

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Anyone who buys to resell is a business and should be registered as such and adhere to all relevant consumer laws and regulations so that consumers can exercise their rights.

 

The Distance Selling Regulations would apply if this was a 'Buy It Now' but would not if it was an auction or if you are also a trader as business to business transactions are exempted.

 

Ebay's rules and regulations are irrelevant in English law if deemed as unfair.

 

Trading standards would opine as to the legality of the item and if in your favour it might negate the need to return the item.

 

Ah, well, I am a business seller on eBay. And it was an auction, so I'm out on both counts there!

 

My business is in the Gothic and Pagan gift market, so I didn't buy these lights for business use so I don't know if that would make a difference?

 

he is deff a trader, 421 sales in last 12 months with 4 negs and 2 neutrals does'nt seem to bad at first look.

 

do you not have a local trading standards that you can pop into?

 

or maybe advising warrey that if he is not going to do full refund plus return postage then you are going to trading standards with them making sure he agrees to pay return postage first seperate from your paypal claim

 

ida x

 

I was going to "out" the seller, but it looks like you've already found him!

 

I think my local TS office is in Norwich, which is a 70mile round trip. Mind you, I'm after some more seaweed from the market, so it may be worth the trip. ;)

 

As it has now been established that he is a trader and you rejected the item within 7 days, the contract is cancelled and you should start a small claim for the full amount paid under the Distance Selling Regs.

 

You dont have to return it yourself- it is for him to make arrangements collect it if he wants it back.

 

So, what you're saying is that I should not bother with the PayPal claim but go straight to Small Claims? I'm just a bit concernd that, even if I were to win a SCC, it's not a guarantee that he'll pay up.

 

You have far more rights with Distance Selling than you can shake a stick at.

 

 

2.18 Sales by private individuals not acting for business purposes are not

covered by the DSRs.

But if it's from a business.....

 

If it was a Buy it Now and not an auction then the trader has to give you written info about their policy on returns--if they do not do this in writing then you can reject the item form ANY reason [changed your mind etc] up to 3 months +7 days later.You do not have to return but just take 'reasonable care' of the item and make it available for collection.

 

http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/business_leaflets/general/oft698.pdf

 

if you the trader do not give the required written information at all (or give it

after the three month period mentioned above), the consumer’s

cancellation rights will end after three months and seven working

days from the day after the day the consumer received the goods.

 

 

3.57. If the goods are faulty or do not comply with the contract, the trader will have to pay for their return whatever the circumstances.

 

Ah, but it was an auction which means, as far as I can gather from the above, I've got no rights at all.

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