Mazda - Life Threatening Defects, My Fault!? Say Mazda

[medievil2003]

Hi Heliosuk, welcome back to the topic.

 

I have asked Mazda Motors UK for the DFMEA and other documents you mentioned above. They ignored it, Mazda europe replied and said they do not allow this information to be released to the public (have an email of this) & Mazda Japan have not answered my email nor letter.

 

I'm going to put my points forward to the MP's whereas i find neccessary. Any tips would be much appreciated.

[medievil2003]

Just to add,

 

If i have health related issues such as stress from this case, being that i will be visiting the doctors this week...would it strengthen the case/result if i come to win?

[aradam]

I was in your position, I gave up but kept my health, it very hard to get justice, and way to complicated, Just watch your health, I never thought I could let go to anything so unfair, but I can tell you although, I bumped my head I am quite releived that I quit the whole thing, health is un-replacable, a car is

[heliosuk]

Hi Heliosuk, welcome back to the topic.

 

I have asked Mazda Motors UK for the DFMEA and other documents you mentioned above. They ignored it, Mazda europe replied and said they do not allow this information to be released to the public (have an email of this) & Mazda Japan have not answered my email nor letter.

 

I'm going to put my points forward to the MP's whereas i find neccessary. Any tips would be much appreciated.

 

I would try to find a way to force the issue and you need a good solicitor on this. You need a copy of this document and I cannot stress the importance of this. You must also make sure that there are no revisions to it i.e. you need the original and all revisions.

 

Check for instances in the USA of this fault because if there is and someone is taking legal action then there will be a suspension notice. Try to find out what suspension notices have been served on Mazda as a whole. This means that any document they hold in relation to the issue must not be destroyed or deleted and this includes e mails.

 

Again, the DFMEA should list what happens when the owner fails to operate the car according to the handbook, how this is identified, alerted to he user and what to do PLUS what the potential effects are.

 

You need to find a way of getting hold of it. Interestingly, you say that it is not a document they will release so ask why or if you feel inclined ask your solicitor to apply for a court order in some way.

[medievil2003]

Hi Aradam / Heliosuk,

 

Aradam, i have been following you're posts on here for a while and we have emailed previously. I am really sorry that you didn't get the result you wanted after all the fight you gave. Just put it down to it being life!?

 

Heliosuk, thank you as always for your valued posts. You're right, im going to chase this up with my solicitor - i done it my self on a few occasions and even contacted a company in the USA who deal with those aspects, their reply is below:

 

I don't have that information, but even if I did I couldn't give them to

you. Those are Mazda proprietary documents. And I seriously doubt anyone in

the forum has any of them, or if they do will give them to you. That is

Mazda information and it is proprietary information that you won't be able

to get your hands on unless you know someone within Mazda, and even then

they'd probably be breaking their confidentiality clause if they did give

them to you.

 

To get that information you'd probably have to be suing them for something

related and try to get them through a court order or something like that.

 

Sorry I can't help.

 

Regards,

Elsmar.com

 

Where Mazda are taking no notice of my requests, to be honest why would they! I will definetely chase this up. Is this not going to be a fight on it's own to get this information? do you think it's better to request these to the courts that will be hearing the Mazda case or apply seperately so we can this info ready and study it before hand?

 

Are these documents not legally signed as confidential, whereas only for internal use only & not to be given to the public? Surley if they gave the docs to me they would be worried i'll distrubute/leak them even if i was bounded by terms not to, this in mind they would do everything in their power not to give this out.

 

My insurance have now approved the barristers fee on my case and we are started to finally issue legal proceedings against the dealer....Helios, i know my case is not actually against Mazda Motors UK Ltd but am i allowed to request that Mazda Motors UK also come to the courts for questioning? or perhaps in everyones experience that's not a good idea?

 

I have started to plan and organise all my files and knowledge on the case ready for court even though it may be in months to come. Any tips?

 

Thank You!!

 

 

Mehdi

[medievil2003]

Hi Guys, hope everyone is well.

 

Now, a quick question - My solicitor has asked Mazda for the docs needed i.e the DFMEA etc - but they are failing to respond. Before i hear back from my solicitor i just wanted to know what the next step would be? Does a court have to now apply for these if Mazda are not answering our request?

 

How does it usually work? Can we apply for a court date and then get the court to request these documents from Mazda before the actual court date to avoid any further delay?

 

If they are ignoring my solicitors requests then i am sure that will benefit me slightly?

 

 

Thanks!

[heliosuk]

Hi Medivil,

 

I don't know of the legals in obtaining this but I do know they will fight not to release it based on intellectual rights etc. The answer to your overall problem will lie in this document........did they take into account someone whose driving style did not meet that recommended in the manual.

 

Your solicitor should also ask Mazda for the process documentation with regards to suspension orders and what has been issued in the last 8 years.

 

Now that's another to get them jumpy.

 

Provided time is on your side I wouldn't be worrying too much as if I was a gambling man I'd be putting money on the fact that the delay is due to going through earlier requested document and asking procurement for rather a lot of toilet paper!

[medievil2003]

Heliosuk, as always - thank you!! I have put the request forward to the solicitor, and now only time will tell how they want to play.

 

I shall keep you posted! If they fail to give these docs then i shall be questioning them on why, your correct.

 

 

Many thanks again.

[jista]

Hi guys

 

After reading this post with great interest can i point out my issues.

 

In 2008 i went to buy a new van i looked at different vans and the only one that was for me was a MB, thinking this will last the rest of my working life.

So i approached Bell Trucks and enquired about the sprinter and asked them can this van carry the weight of a 600 ltr reach & wash system and ladders and cleaning equipment (basically my job is window cleaner) i work in the newcastle, sunderland areas and i was quite strong what my job was, anyway the reply was that this van will last you for years and is great on fuel around the town (boy they were wrong)

 

 

All started at 6995 miles into my ever long lasting relationship with my beloved mercedes 315 2008 mwb sprinter i was at work and the oil warning light come on saying oil lvl to high, so i phoned bell trucks up they sent an engineer out, he said oil lvl ok needs to go in to garage was in for a day they phoned me saying all done come and collect your vehicle, so when i arrived at the garage, they said that will be £186 please £££ they informed me you put to much oil in so the price was £150 for the call out and £36 to drain the oil.

WHAT A LOAD OF CRAP I SAID Any way got that sorted.

 

Well anyway over the next 2 and a half years the van had been in the garage a number of times getting oil and filter changes and they also changed the injectors last october (or so i am lead to believe) but the problem is still there.

 

I was advised by MBUSA that !!

 

1 Avoid frequent short distance driving. (Window Cleaner)

2 Or large amount of idling. (I not an ice cream van)

3 Preform a major drive on the motorway every 500 kilometers to support DPF regeneration.

4 If this problem occurs, preform a premature oil service (YET MORE MONEY) on top of the £38,000 its costing me to buy this vehicle.

 

How about this Mercedes-Benz Sprinter ECO-START : STOP, START, SPRINTER

they call it the the best van for the urban user. i think that answered the first point MBUSA advised

 

My van has only done 27,571 miles

My job is a self employed window cleaner.

Do any of you guys think we have the RIGHT to be told of this problem before we spend this sort of money and they were informed what i do and where i worked.

 

And to top that all off i had it in garage for some warranty corrosion removal they wanted me to pay 55% and they pay 45% is that because it was the day before my warranty run out i don't know.

 

Thats just a bit among other lies i have been told about changing parts and they did not.

 

Well thats me done for now sorry for me going on a bit.

 

Jim

Edited July 11, 2011 by jista

[Conniff]

Oh for an SU hs4

[jista]

Whats an su m8

[heliosuk]

LOL and that was the worst of all of them Conniff!!!!

[scaniaman]

There is someone else on another thread who's vauxhall did the same thing when he had his kids in it. This diesel system could be lethal. Why are vehicle salesmen not legally required to warn people of this DPF carry on at point of sale? There are many diesel car owners who by their needs cannot regularly chase a car down a motorway every so often. Why are urban diesels not being manufactured? This climate change carry on is a no no. World climate will change every 1000?? years whatever man does. This process cannot be stopped but can only be slowed down by massive remineralisation of the soil.How do taxi firms cope with this DPF malarky???

[jista]

So basically what that means is people who tell them (DEALER) their intended use of the van or car does not in the slightest matter.

[Conniff]

LOL and that was the worst of all of them Conniff!!!!

Ah, so your not 21yo like you said

 

So basically what that means is people who tell them (DEALER) their intended use of the van or car does not in the slightest matter.

I would say that it would go in one ear and out the other (litterally if you like).

[jista]

So shall i take it you are talking about the dealer and not me !!!!

 

If so do you think the law should let them get away with that (but then again what law)

[medievil2003]

Hey Guys!

 

Jista, only just picked up the notification email with a response to this post, apologies for not answering earlier.

 

Firstly, at least you had a warning light that told you your oil levels were high I had nothing, just arguments from Mazda relies on weekly oil checks, infact - i would like to point out that my mistake in this whole post is that the handbook does not state "Weekly" it says "Periodically", defined as:

1. at regular intervals
   
2. from time to time; recurrently
   

Anywho, apart from that. As you guys have been following my case and have given me a huge amount of advnatage and advice, in regards to the x4 documents i.e. the DFMEA, its been 2 weeks now and Mazda have not replied to any of my solicitors requests for them - now, my solicitor is telling me that it will be very expensive and another road to take if we needed to get these from them...How true is that? I thought it should be all in one case and my legal insurance should increase the reserve as these docs would be extremely important to the case.

 

We are at the stage now that the barrister as quite a few questions to put forward to the expert about his report, once we have all the neccessary information i believe we would be ready to take them to court. Such a long winded case though, i understand litigation is about patience but wow, i miss my car!

 

Jista, you've been unfortunate the same as me - i can understand your frustration, you've bought a van for work and your having all these issues with it to then find out your not driving it how it should be driven.....

 

I believe we have the right to be told about these vehicles, but from the dealers and manufacturers point of view if there is no law to tell us about this (apart from the whole product being mis-sold) if they told us, would you buy it? I certainly wouldn't have bought my Mazda if i were told of all this - but i would have taken it to my advantage if i do 7 day long distance driving. I wasn't even aware that oil levels could rise before i had this car!! nor about bio-diesel or DPF systems.

 

Have you questioned your dealer to why no-one told you? would you be prepared to reject the vehicle etc? What stage at you at now? have you paid for all repairs.....

 

 

Mehdi

[jista]

Hi Medievil

 

Yes m8 i have questioned the dealer they said they did not no about the DPF problem when they sold me the van now i no thats a load of bollocks, and no i have never paid for any of the work they have carried out.

Me and my solicitor have a meeting on the 26th of this month with a sales executive from MB but i no i wont get far with them BUT in the last 3 years i have had a load of problems with the dealer which has cost me thousands in lost revenue and stress, so the point i making is i want MB to see what kind of dealer they are and how they treat there customers then if i don't seem to be getting anywhere i will brand the SPRINTER not fit for purpose i will go to the papers (i will do anything in my power to let people see how the biggest know car/van manufacture in the world treats in customers.

 

P.S And yes m8 i would of not bought this van if i had of known of the problem i would of bought a petrol van you no sumit m8 if this thing has damaged my engine and continues my 1 man band business could not afford to repair this type of vehicle so which means i could have to close the business.

[aradam]

Hi guys it's a long time ago and in the meantime i drove thousands of miles because of a job role change, I am a very stubborn person and justice means everything to me, but my case cost a lot of money and nearly my health and my family. In the end I bailed out an got £1200 from somewhwere and bought an engine, it takes a bit to step over your proud and take your loss but my quality of life is so much better, in my situation this is the best I could have done, I got a lot of help aspecially from Heliosuk and Sailor Sam, I might be able to pick the case up again, the only regret is the dealer got away with it, it just cost him £200 that he never asked back. I don't think that the consumers are that well protected, if I read all of these stories, aspecially with a clear mind there are a lot off people in sort of the same situation, Midievil, don't let it ruin your live, I hope you nail the B's but don't let it go too far, otherwise fix the damn car and sell it so you get some money back, it's not worth your life.

[MrShed]

Question for my own sanity (having just read all of the thread for the first time). Given how long this has gone on, and the cost alraedy incurred, and given that the report you mentioned seemed to find mostly in your favour, why are you not simply giving them a letter before action, then proceeding to court? Part of your claim could be that the documents Helios refers to above have not been provided, so you have not been able to ascertain certain aspects of their defence thus far, and ask for these to be disclosed. Just seems to my mind that Mazda are giving you the run around, and that isnt going to change - the time for liasing with them has surely passed? OK this could end up being an expensive option, but perhaps no more or less expensive than continuing in your current approach? Sorry if this thought is rubbish, I have no knowledge on the specifics regarding cars, but from what you have said you may well have the evidence required to show the onus of proof required in a civil claim (balance of evidence) - although of course the court case would not be cut and dried. Your solicitor must be thinking this is an absolute cash cow right now...will follow this with interest.

[medievil2003]

Hi, Afternoon!

 

Ok, firstly - Aradam, sorry to hear that you lost on paying for the new engine, i was following your case and hate to hear its ended up like that. Thank you for your concern but my principals will always get the better of me + i have learnt just to take it with a pinch of salt to not let it bother me to much, the difference is that i don't have many tie-downs, still being young with no children & still living with the parents....i can fight this , i can on the other hand understand your frustration in the matter!!

 

Mr Shed, thank you for your post and intrerest in this with comments. Your completely right, i recentely had a meeting with my solicitor and after requesting the docs as Helios mentioned they have ignored us, this has been approx 1 month now with no reply. The solicitor needs to ask a few more questions to the expert obviously with a copy to Mazda due to the law on joint experts, just to clarify a few points on his report, then when this is back we will be issuing a letter before action including another request for the docs other wise it'll be a pre-action disclosure application.

 

The only down side is that because my case is now being funded my insurance, they use a panel of barristers and they are slow in responding which is why along side late replies from Mazda the case has been going on so long. I mean, i had my report carried out in Jan this year. Gone quick.

 

Is it true that in litigation cases i cannot claim for compensation? just for the cost of the car......

 

Also, just for theory purposes - if Mazda were to come and give me an offer to avoid court and that offer was to refund me the full cost of the car & i still have an outstanding finance from it which has been 65% paid how does that work if i were to get a refund......

 

Do any of you think for arguments sake, after all of the hassle and time i have been put through being that i may win, a reasonable person should be compensated more than just the cost of the car??

 

 

Many thanks for keeping interest in this and your continued answers, its much appreciated as usual.

 

Mehdi

[medievil2003]

Just a quick bump!

[scarter123]

Hi Medievil2003, well I've just read through it all and all I can say is I really feel for you. As you said, the problems we're having with Parks of Hamilton regarding used cars is very different so I can't offer much in the way of suggestions. But there are some common areas. One thing that I picked up on is this:

 

"I believe we have the right to be told about these vehicles, but from the dealers and manufacturers point of view if there is no law to tell us about this (apart from the whole product being mis-sold) if they told us, would you buy it? I certainly wouldn't have bought my Mazda if i were told of all this - but i would have taken it to my advantage if i do 7 day long distance driving. I wasn't even aware that oil levels could rise before i had this car!! nor about bio-diesel or DPF systems."

 

There IS a law that requires them to tell you about this. The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations, 2008 (CPR's). The CPR's were introduced in 2008 and they cover exactly this kind of thing. Now it's not something that you can take action over yourself. Trading Standards must do this for you. They aren't obliged to take legal action in every case but the DO have a duty to enforce the CPR's - whether that be through education, Trade Associations etc. If the company refuses to cooperate then my understanding is that they MUST take action to force compliance.

 

Here's a quote from the relevant section:

 

Giving insufficient information

to consumers (misleading

omissions – regulation 6)

4.5 It is a breach of the CPRs to mislead

consumers by failing to give them the

information they need in order to make

an informed decision before the sale6

(misleading omissions).

 

If you aren't aware of this and want more information just ask.

 

The CPR's seem to cover areas that are common to us all. Unfortunately, those that are responsible for enforcing them seem not to do a very good job. Whether that's down to lack of education, budgets, workloads or just poorly thought out legislation I don't know. It is all very new. But this is one area where I think we can all pull together and apply pressure to have something done about it. If we each focus on just one dealer/manufacturer we're going to struggle to get the number of complaints we need. If we all band together to complain about the same issue BREACHES OF THE CPR'S and failure of TS etc to do anything about it then it will help all of us.

 

BTW - have you thought about setting up a facebook PAGE (rather than just a normal account)? I think you'll spread the word faster that way. You can put a little button on your website asking people to 'like' your facebook page. That lets a lot more people find out about it - and you'll find people much more willing to 'like' a page than they are to send a friend invite to a stranger. Also consider twitter. Perhaps if you get a page set up can you pop something in your signature here saying 'please like my facebook campaign page'.

 

I don't know if any of these suggestions help, but I have some idea of the frustration you feel. Good luck with it all.

[medievil2003]

Hi Scarter, Many apologies for not getting back to your last post. I appreciate the time you have spent reading this and including all the above info.

 

From when this happened in August 2009, trading standards didn't want to know - they say you must try and deal with this first. I explained the whole situation to them on numerous occasions and have all references and dates noted. For the CPR's i have printed a ton of information on them all in respect of litigiation cases, this information is freely available for anyone to print so the weekend has been a busy one.

 

I was in the VW dealership on saturday as we've had a lot of problems with it from leasing it new, its had to go in for the same problem about 10 times now. The van also had an engine run-away just like my car but to my surprise without question change the whole engine and gave the van back and told us to let them know if anything else goes wrong, which it did - the same problem....they took the van back and adjusted the service intervals due to oil rising too fast and them not knowing why!! got straight onto VW customer service and said im not happy the lady on the phone said take the van and we will try and find another solution from the German tech team, if there is no other solution then we will talk monday (today) to escalate your issues on a higher scale.

 

I am amazed on the difference of customer service!! VW have been amazing.

 

Ok, i think your completely right about coming together to make the dealers change their attitude and way they sell the cars! Why should it be down the the customer to ask questions about a car they do not know?? That should in theory take the title of a 'Sales Man' away from their name.

 

I will get onto the FB page today and i can't believe i didnt think about the 'Like' before! Your suggestions are perfect - keep them coming??

 

I don't know if trading standards will want to look at this case now because i have a solicitor involved? Do you know anything about finance agreements?

 

 

Many thanks again,

 

Mehdi

[medievil2003]

Hi Scarter, have just done the FB and Twitter side of things on the site - what do you think?

 

www.mazda-campaign.co.uk