Baliff Vistit for council tax

[Barbarawoo]

Hi there,

Fell behind with council tax, amount oustanding £1200.25, Baliff put letter through door back in July, never knocked and dogs didn't react so sure he never knocked.

 

Phoned them and paid £600 and would pay rest in August, don't recall a date I would pay but as I get payed on the 25th I was going to do it then.

 

Balliff came again today and because of dogs would not put letter through box and left it at my front door, my neighbour came past and saw it and knocked and gave it to me letter states they want £827.75, checked with council I only owe £625.25, letter states all payments MUST be paid to the baliff and THE REMOVAL CONTRACTOR has ben arranged for 1.9.08 (yes 08)

 

I am willing to pay the £625 but don't feel £202 is fair charges.

 

Baliffs are Major Collections Limited

 

Baliff letter states he is Certified Bailiff but was unable to get a result back when I entered it online checker

 

How to proceede please

 

Thank you

Edited August 25, 2009 by Barbarawoo

[Guest Happy Contrails]

Pay the council online and print the receipt. Hand it to a bailiff if one returns.

 

The law only provides for bailiffs fees of £24.50 for a 1st visit and £18.00 for a 2nd visit but as there is compelling evidence the bailiff did not visit you (dogs) and a bailiff just handed a document to someone else these visit fees might not apply.

 

Keep windows & doors locked secure until this has been resolved.

[Barbarawoo]

Ok Council tax paid and letter by recorded delivery going off tomorrow to inform them of this along with request asking them to explain their charges and complaint about letter being left on doorstep.

 

Could some one please check for me if the attending bailiff is certified, I think I done it correctly but want to be sure...went to http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/CertificatedBailiffs/ but no results found. I can pm you with name to avoid posting it publicly.. thank you

Edited August 25, 2009 by Barbarawoo

[angmarie]

barbara

 

Is this council tax for 2009-2010 please.

 

 

Ang

[Barbarawoo]

2008 - 2009

 

2009 - 210 up to date

Edited August 26, 2009 by Barbarawoo

[angmarie]

Hi Barbara

 

Thanks for that, I missed payment recently for 2009-2010 and have had letter saying full amount now due in 14 days. Phoned them and they claim bailiff will be turning up on door after that date. A friend told me they never send bailiff during to collect current year as you still have time to catch up by end march. Im not so sure these days if they just scare monger you but im writing a very firm response today.

It just seems to me that during this current climate the bailiff threat seems to come far to quickly.

Hope you get yours sorted though, best of luck.

 

Ang

[socks&pants]

Ang

 

your friend is misled - my recent visit is due to this years bill and not last years. I had this conversation with the local authority that is was not actually due to be paid until March 2010 and the reply I got is that it is actually due in April 2009 unless you chose to pay by installments in which case as soon as you fail to make a payment they are entitled to pass the case on to the bailiffs

[Barbarawoo]

Thank you for your responses, getting support realy helps.

 

I have done a further check on the bailiff and it seems he is certifed.

 

I have produeced this letter and ask for any comments or sugesstions to it's content, all advice and critism welcome

 

 

Address

 

 

 

26 August 09

 

 

 

F.A.O Admin

Major Collections Limited

London House

216 Tooting High Street

London

SW17 0SG

 

 

 

Dear Sir / Madam

 

Re: XXXX

 

Let me start by explaining the facts as they are, I received a letter through my letter box stating you had called, I was home at this time and can assure you your bailiff did not knock, just posted, your letter stated that you were working on behalf of Ealing Council to recover Council tax arrears.

 

I contacted you and made part payment in July with the agreement I would pay the remaining balance of £562.25 in August, at this time I don’t recall a specific date but would have thought it would be on the 26th as this is my salary date and have had no further communication with you or from you.

 

Yesterday, 25th August your bailiff, Mr Russell Booker arrived and promptly left a letter stating he wanted £827.75 and that the REMOVAL CONTRACTOR has been arranged for 1.9.08, (yes 08, I would guess he has some means of time travel)

 

The letter was brought to my attention by a neighbour who kindly knocked and handed it to myself explaining a gentleman had pulled up in a silver grey van, left engine running, car door open and leave the letter on the window sill outside my front door, yes that’s right, outside my front door for any and all to have access to.

 

I am not sure of the implications of this but more on that later.

 

Now the figure he has quoted is £827.75 and upon checking with Ealing Council they confirm the arrears were £562.25, you will note I stated were and not are as I have paid the sum of £562.25 to Ealing Council on the 25th August therefore your request for £827.75 is null and void.

Upon reading the letter I promptly contacted several organisations, Cab, Debt Advice Line and The Consumer Forums to name but a few and intestingly it seems you can charge £24.50 for your first visit and £18.00 for your second visit so I am some what perplexed how he arrives at a charge £265?

 

I have also been advised that as no bailiff has entered my premises at any time he has not been able to do a Levy or a walking possession agreement so am even more perplexed about The REMOVAL CONTRACTOR attending, I would also advise you that I am not sure if I will be home on the 1.9.08 as I don’t have access to time machine myself.

 

 

Based on the above facts any attempt to enter my premises will be treated as trespass and attempted robbery and the police will be called.

 

Returning back to the unsecured letter I would like you to advise me of what Trading Association you come under as I wish to make a formal complaint regarding this.

 

I would also request you send me a breakdown of all charges.

 

I could say more but |I will save that for my follow up letter to your letter of response as I am sure you will no doubt have a different view on this.

 

Thank you

 

 

Sorry for the length of it

Just to mention also that the council refused to take my payment at first and told me to deal with the baliliffs, I informed her I would not be paying the bailiffs a penny and was in dispute with them over charges and therfore the council would not be getting their money any time soon, she promptly took payment.

Edited August 26, 2009 by Barbarawoo

[Guest Happy Contrails]

Dont waste your time complaining to trade associations, bailiffs subscriptions pay their mortgages and feed their mouths.

 

Use this letter and see what you get back. Ask the bailiffs to pass the truth test. They can refund you and mitigate committing defrauding you with their fees, or ignore your letter - and guilt can be inferred by their silence if you decide to file a claim against the council. NEVER sue a bailiff - always reclaim unlawful bailiffs fees from the council, and the council will suspend or terminate the bailiffs contract - it makes lots more noise than any trade association is capable of making.

 

Send this by email and by post.

 

The Managing Director

Major Collections Limited

London House

216 Tooting High Street

London

SW17 0SG

 

BY POST AND BY EMAIL

 

DATE

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Re: [YOUR NAME + REF]: Your fees.

 

I write following visits by your bailiff however there appears to an irregularity with your fees and I am writing to ask you to provide me the following within seven (7) days:

 

1) The name of the court that issued the certificate for the bailiff in charge

 

2) Written confirmation of a) your fees, and b) the original debt

 

3) The name and address of the organisation that instructed you

 

4) a) Truthfully confirm in writing your fees are lawful and comply with legislation or b) refund me the unlawful fees plus reasonable compensation for being cheated by your certificated bailiff with his fees by midday the seventh day from the date of this letter.

 

A bailiff or any other person who dishonestly charges for work that has not been done will be committing an offence under the Fraud Act 2006. Section 2 of the Act specifically describes a person dishonestly makes a false representation and intends, by making the representation, to make a gain for himself or another, or cause a loss to another, or expose another to a risk of loss therefore, if no satisfactory refund is made to me by 12.00 midday seven (7) days from the date of this letter I will automatically file a complaint to police under the 2006 Fraud Act and the Proceeds of Crime Act 2002. If you have charged VAT on unlawful fees then you may be reported for VAT fraud and your documents will be given in evidence. If your bailiff is certificated, a Form 4 will be filed.

 

I am not asking you to disclose personal data about me as defined under the Data Protection Act 1998, therefore, this letter is not a Subject Access Request and does not require payment of a fee.

 

This letter is delivered by Royal Mail and deem it good service upon you by the ordinary course of post under Section 7 of the Interpretation Act 1978. It now is your responsibility and in your best interests this letter is handed to the relevant person within your organisation.

 

Yours Sincerely

 

YOUR NAME

 

[Barbarawoo]

Thank you for that prompt reply and elegant letter.

 

I have not paid the bailiff any monies other than £600 instalment for council tax of which the council have recieved and £24.50 first letter payment back in July, I have withheld the £265 charge so is this still the correct letter?

 

Many thanks for the support and reply

[Guest Happy Contrails]

Yes its still OK because the bailiff has tried to defraud you, the law also encapsulates attempted fraud in the meaning of the Act. Remove clause 4(b) from the letter if you have not paid disputed bailiffs fees. Find out officially from the council how much of that £600 reached them, if they give you a different amount then the bailiff's goose is cooked.

Edited August 26, 2009 by Happy Contrails
typo

[MRSWESTHAM]

Hi sorry to but in on a thread but i read above that it is down to the council to pay your fees back. I have it in writing that once the acount is cleared the responsilbilty of the fees is the bailiff company. The bailiff company set the fees and recieve them this is how they make their money. They make the council aware of their fees (Although my local council had a very different set of fees to those I was charged!) ALWAYS forward a copy of your complaints to your council though as it is them who decideds whether the bailiff company continues to work for them. I am sorry to contradict what you say Happy contrails and in no way tryig to be funny or rude, only going by what i have been told

[MRSWESTHAM]

And ...(Sorry!)

 

Do not file a form 4 against an individual bailiff for fees, my case was dismissed on this basis as the Judge (and I kind of agree) stated it was the company that my grievance was against as the bailiff was collecting what fees were added by them.

 

TT is helping me now and I am going to persue the company through the small laims court should they not reply by the 7 days they were given ! (Which incidently is tomorrow!)

 

KEEP BADGERING THEM AND PAY NOTHING !!!

[Guest Happy Contrails]

The bailiff company set the fees and recieve them this is how they make their money. .... I am sorry to contradict what you say Happy contrails and in no way tryig to be funny or rude, only going by what i have been told

 

Bailiff companies do not set their fees, the law does: Regulation 14(2) and Regulation 45(2) of the Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) Regulations 1992.

 

A form 4 is a complaint - not litigation. If you want a refund then you ask the bailiff (letter above) then ask the council as they are liable for their agents. If the council says contact the bailiff then you file a claim against the council in the small claims track for the money you want back plus your disbursements.

 

The council can terminate the bailiffs contract for defrauding a taxpayer and its their prerogative if they ask the court for the bailiff or his firm to stand as a co-defendant.

[Barbarawoo]

So the folling is correct for me then:

 

The Managing Director

Major Collections Limited

London House

216 Tooting High Street

London

SW17 0SG

 

BY POST AND BY EMAIL

 

DATE

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Re: [YOUR NAME + REF]: Your fees.

 

I write following visits by your bailiff however there appears to an irregularity with your fees and I am writing to ask you to provide me the following within seven (7) days:

 

1) The name of the court that issued the certificate for the bailiff in charge

 

2) Written confirmation of a) your fees, and b) the original debt

 

3) The name and address of the organisation that instructed you

 

4) a) Truthfully confirm in writing your fees are lawful and comply with legislation.

 

A bailiff or any other person who dishonestly charges for work that has not been done will be committing an offence under the Fraud Act 2006. Section 2 of the Act specifically describes a person dishonestly makes a false representation and intends, by making the representation, to make a gain for himself or another, or cause a loss to another, or expose another to a risk of loss. If your bailiff is certificated, a Form 4 will be filed. If you have charged VAT on unlawful fees then you may be reported for VAT fraud and your documents will be given in evidence. If your bailiff is certificated, a Form 4 will be filed.

 

I am not asking you to disclose personal data about me as defined under the Data Protection Act 1998, therefore, this letter is not a Subject Access Request and does not require payment of a fee.

 

This letter is delivered by Royal Mail and deem it good service upon you by the ordinary course of post under Section 7 of the Interpretation Act 1978. It now is your responsibility and in your best interests this letter is handed to the relevant person within your organisation.

 

Yours Sincerely

 

YOUR NAME

Edited August 26, 2009 by Barbarawoo

[Barbarawoo]

Just noticed on letter from bailiff yesterday it says SEIZURE & REMOVAL NOTICE, not sure how i missed that but stressed about it all and not concentrating, this make any differance?

[MRSWESTHAM]

I am not sure filing a form 4 against an individual bailiff is a good idea only from what the judge at my case said butits your call , TT might be able to clarify.

[Barbarawoo]

Thanks for all your replies and comments.

 

Have checked further and a form 4 is a complaint so will be doing that.

 

I will be emailing and sending both letters, mine and the elegant one in the morning, mine basicly because I want them to know how I feel about them and reason of dispute and elegant one because it looks professional and is to the point of fact.

[Birmans220960]

Bailiffs work on the same basis as vampires in horror stories - i.e. they have to be invited in. They do not have the right to force entry to your home altough they may try and trick you into inviting them in by saying things like "Would you like to let me in so we can discuss this privately". They are not permitted to disclose their identity or the reason for their visit to you to neighbours or other third parties. The golden rule is do not open the door to them and do not talk to them and above all do not invite them in. If you allow them entry just once, they have the right to re-enter repeatedly after that. The only time when they have the right to force an entry is when they are re-possessing the house/flat in eviction proceedings - not in order to levy distraint on goods. If the goods or car etc do not belong to you or are rented, then they do not have the right to remove them. They can only take articles that are owned by you outright.

 

Hope this helps. Nil illegitima carborundum est (don't let the b*stards grind you down!)

[MRSWESTHAM]

Only me a gain ! a form 4 is a comliant about an individual bailiff and what they do is either warn the bailiff or if they feel the allegation is serious enough they get you to attend a hearing. (This is what I did) If you hae complaints about the individual bailiff (IE Threatening vilent etc) you might have a case but if its for fees alone its a waste of time and you might end up paying costs. I was lucky the bailiff I went against didnt claim her costs from me but the judge advised I bring my complaint against the company. PM Tomtubby if your confused as shes brilliant

[Barbarawoo]

Thank you for that clarification, if I make a complaint it will be about the bailiff leaving the letter for all and sundry to see.

 

Not sure if I will at this point do form 4 but vhave askd the company for their complaints procedure.

[lets fight bailiffs]

you should always go through the company complaints system first as the form 4 should be used as a last thing and it will go on your side if a judge cas see that you have tryed doing it there way first.

[Barbarawoo]

Just recieved this in reply to my email:

 

Dear Madam,

 

We are in receipt of your e mail and it has been passed to our manager for response. We have also confirmed with our client that payment of the council balance in the sum of £562.25 was paid to them by way of a card payment on 25.8.09 and has now ben allocated to your account.

 

Yours sincerely.

[bailiffbasher69]

That she is

[Barbarawoo]

Hi there,

update of sorts.

 

After giving the baliffs 7 working days and taken in to account the bank holiday I should have had a response from them yesterday and after waiting on post that came this morning I have had none from them or by email.

 

Should I let sleeping slugs lye or contact them via another letter and if so which one please.

 

Regards to all