Northern Rock unsecured loan PPI

[deb4tlj]

I took out an unsecured personal loan in the amount of £10k with Northern Rock in June 2006 and

 

since October 2008 have been on a reduced payment plan with them

- monthly payments should be £204.00 and I am now paying £110.00 pcm.

 

I have maintained these payments religiously but did receive a phone call from them last week

stating that they could put a charge on my home if they so wished.

 

They also informed me that the PPI I had on the loan does not cover me for anything

as I have a mental health problem and so cannot claim.

 

There was a payment of £2,480.60 Loan Protection on a statement that I received from them this month

- the only statement I have ever seen regarding this loan.

 

Currently my balance on this loan

- according to them

- stands at £8,820.99p which I don't understand either

- seems like I've not paid anything off.

 

I want to reclaim the PPI from them but do not want to "muddy the waters" a

nd end up with them putting a charge on my home

- it's recently been paid off and I need this PPI money to buy my husband an electric scooter as he cannot walk.

 

Any advice on what to do would be appreciated.

[middenmess]

Can you post up a copy of the agreement after removing personal details etc. so that we can see what is what?

 

Not sure if I understand the bit about statements and PPI--is it a refund to you or just a statement of account?

 

Who told you that the PPI would not pay out in the event of a claim--was this in a letter or over the phone?

[deb4tlj]

Can you post up a copy of the agreement after removing personal details etc. so that we can see what is what?

 

Not sure if I understand the bit about statements and PPI--is it a refund to you or just a statement of account?

 

Who told you that the PPI would not pay out in the event of a claim--was this in a letter or over the phone?

 

 

I don't have a copy of the agreement - this loan was taken out online and I can't find my copy - should look some more.

 

It was just a statement of account that said at the bottom about the PPI payment at the outset of the loan.

 

I was told the information about the PPI not paying out over the phone when they rang to see if my circumstances had changed. I told them at the time that I didn't even know I had PPI on the loan until I received this statement of account.

[middenmess]

''I told them at the time that I didn't even know I had PPI on the loan until I received this statement of account.''

 

Didn't you think that the interest charged on the loan was a tadge over the top then when you accepted the figures for the loan originally ?????

 

£10,000 + interest = £x

 

but

 

£10,000 + £2480.60 PPI + interest = a b***** sight more!!

 

How much did they originally send you in a cheque or whatever when you first received the loan--was it the full £10,000 or was it £7519.40?

 

You've only had ONE statement in 3 years--didn't you think that a mite unusual?

[deb4tlj]

''I told them at the time that I didn't even know I had PPI on the loan until I received this statement of account.''

 

Didn't you think that the interest charged on the loan was a tadge over the top then when you accepted the figures for the loan originally ?????

 

£10,000 + interest = £x

 

but

 

£10,000 + £2480.60 PPI + interest = a b***** sight more!!

 

How much did they originally send you in a cheque or whatever when you first received the loan--was it the full £10,000 or was it £7519.40?

 

You've only had ONE statement in 3 years--didn't you think that a mite unusual?

 

They sent me the £10k

 

I applied for and this isn't the only loan

I have never, ever received a statement for

- always paid by direct debit and never received statements

apart from this one which they said they were now required by law to send.

 

I was desperate for the money at the time to pay off a crippling credit card debt that didn't seem to be going down.

[middenmess]

It would sound like there were plenty of unlawful charges on the credit card that were possibly reclaimable and as it appears that you didn't make a claim for them I'm unsure as to whether you can now if the account is closed.

 

Why not post a new thread on the appropriate forum and ask the question?

 

Although I think that you have a good case with the loan, you need a more experienced cagger to answer this PPI question --why not click on the red triangle at the left of the post and seek help from the site team?

[deb4tlj]

Could not find the forum for Northern Rock so please feel free to move this post.

 

I have loan with Northern Rock with which I have been on reduced payments for the last couple of years.

 

On numerous occasions I have rang and asked them to freeze the interest to enable me to actually pay the loan off

- they keep telling me that they can't as the interest was "front-loaded".

 

I've written letter after letter to every department I can think of asking them to please freeze the interest

- latest letter being 29th August in which I stated;

 

Thank you very much for accepting my offer of a reduced repayment.

However, I am disappointed that you have not agreed to freeze the interest being added on my account.

I am sure you will appreciate that, if the interest is not stopped, then the balance of the account will continue to increase and I will never succeed in repaying the debt.

 

I therefore ask that you reconsider your decision and advise me accordingly.

 

Thanking you in advance.

 

Needless to say it has been completely ignored as have all the others. I will never repay this loan at this rate and nobody seems prepared to help. All advice would be gratefully received.

[maroondevo52]

Hi,

 

I know that Northern Rock have said they agree to freeze all interest on debts owed by customers entering Debt Management Plans, don't know if this is an option you've thought about.

[deb4tlj]

I'm trying to manage my debt myself without resorting to debt management companies and Northern Rock already know this - they still refuse to freeze the interest however.

[maroondevo52]

I'm trying to manage my debt myself without resorting to debt management companies and Northern Rock already know this - they still refuse to freeze the interest however.

 

Yes, I know they can be a nightmare to deal with, I was talking about the free DMP companies, are there any charges or PPI on the loan ?

[Terminator]

Contact Northern Rock Asset Management (NRAM) who is the old Northern Rock.

[deb4tlj]

In short took out a loan with Northern Rock about 5 years ago

and a few years into that fell into financial difficulties through hours being cut at work etc.

 

Have been on a mutually agreed payment plan with them

paying just above the minimum they wanted and have never missed a payment

and all payments have always been on time.

 

Was contacted by the now NRAM before Xmas with a questionnaire to possibly claim back the PPI on this loan.

 

Filled in the questionnaire and sent it off not really expecting to hear anything.

 

After a little reading on here decided last week to send them a SAR (with fee) then lo

and behold! yesterday receive a looooooong letter from them re my PPI.

 

In a nutshell they agree my PPi was mis sold and will repay all payments

 

I have made up to now (to best of my knowledge last time I received a statement from them

the PPI was paid in full up front!) and will pay 8% interest on that

 

BUT if I accept the refund they will take enforcement action against me for all arrears on the loan,

will now expect monthly repayments of £662.49 in order to repay the loan over the agreed term

(oh, and inform the tax man to boot) however,

 

if I use the PPI to pay off some of the arrears on the loan they won't take any action against me!

 

I am on an agreed payment plan, they have my budget sheets and everything.

I suffer from mental health problems (one of the reasons they agreed to repay my PPI)

and this has left me very distressed and physically ill.

 

My husband is a pensioner and is disabled and I don't have this sort of money.

 

I was going to use any PPI refunded to clear some of the arrears anyway

- although they obviously didn't know this.

 

With their letter they have included two acceptance declarations

- one for me to get the money

one for them to have the money

and it states quite clearly on the "pay off your arrears" one;

 

"I acknowledge that NRAM has offered me a full reimbursement of premiums as an alternative,

and has not required me to use the refund to clear the arrears."

 

Yeah, not much they haven't!!!!!!

I am so angry and upset about these bullying tactics:mad2:

[ims21]

Hi

 

Sadly they can set off against notified arrears.

 

What is the amount of arrears and what is the ppi offer amount.

 

Have you checked that the offer is correct?

 

ims

[deb4tlj]

Seems to me that this is totally a retaliatory gesture

- how can they suddenly demand payment when I have adhered to the terms of my repayment plan?

 

Surely they owe me a consideration of care that they are not causing me financial hardship?

 

I feel that I am being bullied into paying the PPI refund off the arrears

- never mind if I want to or not!!!

 

If I don't use the PPI refund to pay off some of the arrears

then they are demanding £600.00 odd pounds a month payments

- my bloody wage isn't that a month and they darn well know it

- they've had enough budget sheets from me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

surely this falls under unfair treatment of myself as a customer

- they are now reneging on an agreed instalments payment arrangement?

 

the amount of arrears is £2,992.29

the remaining balance is 3,974.96 (that includes the arrears amount)

they are offering me PPi premiums of £1,940.60 and 8% interest of £489.68

 

I don't believe this is correct as I remember them stating that the PPI was always paid off first

before anything came off the loan itself but I guess I'll have to wait for the SAR paperwork.

 

I have no intention of agreeing to anything or signing anything until I have all the information to hand.

[gemspan]

I would consider that to be unfair treatment by the bank.

 

They are giving you no options really other than to repay the loan using the PPI repayment.

 

You could however look at it another way and say to them,

if you hadn't mis-sold me the PPI then perhaps I may not have landed in severe financial hardship

as I wouldn't have had to pay the payments on the PPI.

 

You may be due more than they are saying.

 

Do you have the original agreements?

How long have you been paying it?

 

Shocking and shoddy behaviour from them.

 

While I agree they are allowed to offset against any arrears or loans,

this is something completely different and, yes, it is bully boy tactics.

 

They may say they will take enforcement actions but remember its what a judge decides...not them!

 

A judge may say you pay off the loan at £5 per month.

 

I would write back to them and say you will not be bullied into accepting their offer

and that you are awaiting the information you requested under a DSAR.

 

Once you have that to hand,

youl will be able to calculate whether their offer is reasonable in terms of your PPI payments and interest.

 

I would also remind them about the Unfairness Regulations.

 

If you do a little search you should find it.

 

You can propose to them what part of the loan you want to pay off with the PPI repayment.

..but certainly do not be bullied by them.

 

How dare they! It may well have been their premiums that made the difference

between you being able to pay the loan amount monthly or not.... cheeky sods.

 

Gemspan

[bigkacker]

This is typical of Northern Rock, I would write to them explaining that you are not prepared to be bullied into accepting anyting untill you have your SAR. I would also raise a complaint as you are clearly being treated differently for simply making a compliant this contravenes FSA Treating Customers Fairly Guidelines

[deb4tlj]

How does this reply to them sound? Not sent it off yet so can still be tweaked.

 

I have recently received a letter from the PPI Review Team regarding PPI on the above account. I suffer from mental health problems (hence the uselessness of the PPI policy) and am very distressed and disappointed with the tone of this letter and the thinly disguised bullying tactics used herein.

It is made blatantly clear in the letter – a copy of which I enclose with the relevant sections highlighted – that if I do not use the PPI refund to pay off some of the arrears on this account that;

 

“enforcement action is likely to follow against you, and you will be liable for any additional costs NRAM incurs as a result of such action”.

 

My other “alternative” is;

 

“NRAM could use all of the PPI refund to reduce the current arrears on your account. NRAM does not require this, but if you select this option, this will reduce the risk of enforcement action against you, and it is likely to improve your credit rating.”

 

 

I would like here and now to state that this is clearly bullying tactics to make me clear the arrears on the account. You are clearly giving me no option but to use the PPI to repay the arrears. If I had not been mis-sold the PPI in the first place I would not have found myself in the position of having to make reduced payments – it may well have been these premiums that made the difference between my being able to make the monthly repayments or not. You have absolutely no reason or grounds to take enforcement action against me, I am on a mutually agreed repayment plan and have missed no payments and all payments have been made on time.

I will not be bullied into accepting this offer and am currently awaiting all the information I requested with my SAR that was received by yourselves and signed for on 23rd January 2012 (you will of course be aware that you have 40 days to comply with this request). I will then be able to calculate whether your offer is reasonable in terms of the PPI payments and interest. May I also take this opportunity to remind you of the Principles for Businesses (PRIN) FSA Handbook 2.1.1 specifically;

 

Principles;

2 Skill, care and diligence A firm must conduct its business with due skill, care and diligence.

6 Customers' interests A firm must pay due regard to the interests of its customers and treat them fairly.

 

 

I do not believe I am being treated with care or fairness and as such will be taking further advice about this matter. I am also sending a copy of this letter to Marie Jones of the PPI Review Team. Please be aware that I will not accept phone calls regarding this matter – all communication must be by letter only.

All advice gratefully received.

[ims21]

You could aslo mention your financial hardship.

 

You say you are on an agreed payment plan whereby you are making reduced payments. Has the interest been frozen?

 

Do you have their agreement to the reduced payments in writing?

 

ims

[deb4tlj]

Latest on the above

- wrote to NRAM at the beginning of June after receiving SAR paperwork.

 

After doing my sums I owe them 4,310.99.

 

They owed me 3,451.00 in PPI with simple 8% interest added.

 

I asked them to take this in full and final payment of the loan - no answer.

 

Wrote to them again beginning of July with figures amended accordingly

asking them again to take this in full and final for loan.

 

No reply as of today.

 

Where do I stand now?

 

Should I complain about their ignorance and treatment to a regulatory body and if so, which one?

 

They haven't even bothered to pursue my PPI claim as I did not accept their offer of January this year.

 

I'm stumped as to what to do now because at this rate they'll end up owing me money!

[ims21]

Fos would be the body to complaint to.

 

Tell them the whole story with all of the details and make sure that you make them aware of your health and financial problems as they may be able to hurry this all up for you.

[Guest GLW]

Should I complain about their ignorance and treatment to a regulatory body and if so, which one? They haven't even bothered to pursue my PPI claim as I did not accept their offer of January this year. I'm stumped as to what to do now because at this rate they'll end up owing me money!

 

There seems to be something of a pattern with Northern Rock - or NRAM as they are now - holding consumer protection laws in contempt and routinely attempting to ride a coach and horses through the regulation that are meant to protect consumers...

 

In particular they have little respect for those of us suffering from mental health issues - to which they often contribute - And I speak as one currently experiencing their policy of bullying and harassment. You don't live in Scotland by any chance do you Deb?

 

I am about to lodge a complaint against NRAM with the OFT - I am also hoping to alert my MSP and MP with a view to gaining their support.

 

Personally I intend by-passing the FOS as, whilst they would be able to address/intervene in an individual case (which the OFT can't) they do seem to be very much in the pocket of the banks and I have no confidence in them. - That is NOT to say I encourage anyone to take the same view; it's just my 2p's worth.

[deb4tlj]

No GLW I live in good old Yorkshire! LOL Well the latest from NRAM is that they just keep sending me the same acceptance forms as they sent me in January - with no figures amended of course! I sent them this at the beginning of July;

 

I am now resending the letter that I sent at the beginning of June 2012 to which I have yet to receive a response. Calculations have been amended accordingly.

Please find enclosed a spreadsheet to the beginning of July 2012 detailing all PPI payments made on the above account with 8% simple interest added.

The amount owing on this account as of the beginning of July 2012 is £4,180.99p. As you will see from the spreadsheet I am currently owed £2,608.77p (this figure includes 8% simple interest; £2,070.29p + interest at 8% = £2,608.77p) in mis-sold PPI.

Removal of existing PPI from the remainder of the account amounts to £855.79p.

Upon adding the mis-sold PPI owed to the PPI to be removed we reach a figure of £3464.56p to be subtracted from the balance on the above account leaving a grand total of £716.43p actually owing on the account;

 

£2,070.29p +

£855.79p

= £2,926.08 PPI loan

£2,608.77p +

£855.79p

= £3,464.56p

£4,180.99p –

£3,464.56p

=£716.43p

 

and asked them to take all the PPI and interest owed in full and final. Guess what - they sent me the acceptance forms and same letter from 16th January. I've since reported them to the FOS and sent this letter;

 

Please find enclosed a copy of the letter I keep sending and resending to your company. I received on Monday 23rd July, 2012 another copy of the letter dated 16th January 2012 from Marie Jones of the PPI Review Team with two acceptance sheets. As I have explained in letter after letter and numerous phone calls I am asking you now to accept all PPI and interest owed me in full and final payment of the existing loan as my financial position and impending job loss will make continuing payments on this loan virtually non existent. I will be forced to send a token payment of £1.00 a week to pay this loan off which, as I am sure you are more than aware, will take me forever and is not beneficial to mine or your interests. I feel as though I am being “fobbed off” by your company and will soon have no choice but to lodge a complaint with the FOS. Please do not send me any more copies of the Marie Jones letter Customer reference PPI/************** as I now have enough of them to wallpaper my living room.

 

Will lodge a complaint with the OFT this week. Am seriously p***ed off with their stalling tactics!

Edited July 29, 2012 by deb4tlj

[Guest GLW]

Stonewalling seems to be one of the key tactics NRAM / Northern Rock employ. They're not alone in that of course. And they get away with that because most people (myself included until relatively recently) are blisfully ignorant of just how dishonest these companies have become.

 

I was in the situation where my cashflow was so difficult that I needed to take the money rather than reduce the balance ( we used it to eat!) - There is also some doubt as to whether I actually got the loan in the first place! So I felt fully justified in requiring the money back.

 

In your own case I would take the view that the broader difficulties you face may well be in part attributed to the extra burden they imposed with the mis-sold PPI. Therefore any refund needs to be taken by you to mitigate your wider difficulties rather than simply discharge an alleged liability to one lender.

 

So again; I would feel fully justified in taking the money rather than offsetting the 'loan'. The money they wrongly took from you may well have been the straw that broke the camels back in terms of you falling into difficulties...

 

I would encourage you to complain to the OFT. But bear in mind they won't deal with your complaint directly as such - i.e. the complaint may prompt NRAM to 'straighten up and fly right'; and might well help - but the aim is more to alert the OFT that there IS a wider problem with NRAM; as I say they seem to be totally out of control!

 

The FOS , I fear, are simply going to take NRAM's side; I would be happy to be proved wrong on that though! - But I've no confidence in the Financial Ombudsman Service.

 

I have recently also complained to the OFT about Barclaycard... This is how I opened my complaint.

 

"I am writing today to lodge a formal complaint against Barclays Bank PLC Trading as ‘Barclaycard’ – Hereafter referred to as ‘Barclaycard’, in respect of unfair and improper business and debt collection practices.

I ask that you review their fitness to trade with a view to revocation of any authority in this respect that the OFT might grant, sanction or influence"

Note that this isn't, asking them to resolve my particular issues - I'm asking the OFT to consider whether this organisation is fit to trade.

 

My letter goes on to give a timeline of events, and lists various specific instances where Barclaycard have breached OFT guidelines. It's a somewhat 'oblique' approach...

 

I will use a similar structure when I put my complaint in about NRAM; which I shall by the end of this week.

 

If the OFT ignore these specific breaches of their regulations - which might be evidenced by continued inaction on the part of Barclaycard - then I would have questions to raise with my MP (and MSP)...

 

THUS - I hope complaining to the OFT will produce an indirecteffect.

 

What particularly irritates me is that NRAM are CLEARLY happy to exploit people facing serious health difficulties that they themselves might be instrumental in causing...

Edited July 29, 2012 by GLW

[deb4tlj]

Update;

Well, they are still ignoring all my letters and all efforts to get this loan paid off. Found out they were part of the UKAR Holding company so sent a complaint to them aswell.

 

http://www.ukar.co.uk/

 

Copy and paste of email sent back;

Thank you for your email into the Press Office. I referred this to Customer Relations who advised that a final response letter had been issued on the 9th May 2012 outlining various options in relation to the refund of your PPI. As stated in the letter this decision is final and been conducted in line with FSA guidelines however if you decide not to resolve matters at this stage you can refer your complaint to the FOS, which I noted from your email that you've done so already.

 

I'm sorry that you feel NRAM have fobbed you off, but I can assure you that all complaints are taken seriously and we have a robust process in place and strive to resolve issues as they arise. In cases where we cannot resolve the issue customers are made aware of the options available i.e referal to FOS.

 

Thank you again for your email. If you need any further information please let me know.

 

Regards

 

 

Replied this morning;

 

Thank you very much for your prompt reply. You do at least endeavour to reply to your customers which is more than can be said for NRAM. I raised a dispute with them about the amount of PPI refunded to me - I sent a Statutory Access Request and worked the figures out accordingly. I have since sent them at least six letters outlining their wrong calculations and asking them to take all PPI owed me and 8% simple interest in full and final payment of my account. They have ignored every letter, are continuing to send me their so-called PPI "options" letter - still with the wrong figures - and are now fobbing me off on the phone. I only want what is owed to me through their obvious mis-selling of PPI - I have serious mental health problems which would automatically preclude me from ever claiming any PPI on anything. I am not even asking for the money to be returned to me - I am asking them to take all that is owed and just go away and leave me alone! My health is deteriorating considerably because of this whole debacle and my mental health problem has been exacerbated terribly because of all this. I just cannot get a straightforward answer from anybody! I have now lodged a very strong complaint with the FSA and the OFT who I believe have fined NRAM in the past in their guise of Northern Rock. I have also sent all details to my local MP and to Lord Prescott who I believe has an especial dislike of financial institutions asking them to raise questions regarding NRAM's lack of duty of care towards their customers - initially deceiving me into taking out totally useless PPI cover and then ignoring my offer and my degenerating state of health. I am facing possible job loss so will be no longer able to make the payments on this account which is why I am trying to get them accept my full and final offer - it will be one less thing for me to worry about. I am not trying to avoid payment of my debts, far from it - I am trying to find solutions! I just cannot understand why they are ignoring all my efforts to pay off this loan. I am afraid the only options open to me now are the media and possible court action to actually get them to admit their figures are wrong. I will not let this drop until this debt is gone.

 

I am getting sooooooooo p***ed off of this company - they don't give a toss for their customers!

[Guest GLW]

I am not trying to avoid payment of my debts, far from it - I am trying to find solutions! I just cannot understand why they are ignoring all my efforts to pay off this loan.

 

Read my own account Deb - They seem to imagine they are above the very law of the land.

 

NRAM - routinely in my experience - simply ignore correspondence. Even at the very highest level. I wrote to their CEO the other week, I know he got the letter as it was sent by Special Delivery - Not even the common courtesy of an acknowledgement!!

 

At best they reply cryptically...

 

I'm sorry that you feel NRAM have fobbed you off, but I can assure you that all complaints are taken seriously and we have a robust process in place and strive to resolve issues as they arise. In cases where we cannot resolve the issue customers are made aware of the options available i.e referal to FOS.

 

The FOS of course being absolutely in the pocket of the financial institutions, there to rubber stamp matters that are very often in breach of the law! Perhaps they should be renamed the "Fobbing Off Service"?

 

My guess - and it is just that - is that there are operational procedures at play within NRAM that are primarily designed to feed the demands of statistical analysis. I cannot talk of sources; however I have good reason to hold the opinion that operators are pressurised into responding to letters of complaint by rote; that is to say that rather than sit down and compose a reply - they are given so little time to consider matters and are so constrained (lacking in authority), that all they do is populate template letters - These very often only serve to obfuscate matters...

 

I think they work on the basis that if they 'stonewall' and 'threaten' people frequently and sufficiently they will 'fold' - Even to the extent they are happy to abuse the court system.

 

In my case they contributed to stressors that almost lead to my death; and are fully aware of it. Still, they remain dedicated to obfucatious and obstructive tactics. Ultimately, being involved with NRAM not only very nearly cost me my life; but actually did lead (or at least contributed significantly to) to the ending of a professional career - thus destroying my income...

 

Counter productive? absolutely! It's clear to me that NRAM are 'totally out of control'; and the OFT need to act before someone DOES lose their life as the result of them unfairly and unlawfully pressurising debtors...

Edited August 17, 2012 by GLW