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tinku333

Box Junction PCN.Help

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I have been issued a PCN for Entering and stopping in a box junction when prohibited in The Broadway/Herbert Road, Southall (3).

 

I was travelling behind a car which suddenly stopped (that couldn't cross box) after I had already entered into the box.So on the ground that at the time I entered into the box, the exit was not blocked by stationary traffic, can I appeal? As there was a car behind, I couldn't reverse as well :-(

 

Please see below photo. (there are 2 cars in the box junctions and mine is the 2nd car ie. at the back side of box)

 

http://parkingcmlive.ealing.gov.uk/pics/387759/0000000003565083.jpg

 

As per photo looks like, the car in front of me in the box was blocked by the blue car which turned from left street, which caused issue both of us. I think the car in front of me also got the PCN as that was stuck on the box as well :-(

 

Is there any possibility here to appeal?

 

Thanks

Nishant

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I wouldn't think you could appeal that. Your exit is blocked, and you are stopping cars entering or leaving the street on your left which the box is obviously there to allow.

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Hi Conniff ,

Thanks a lot for your response. Just to clarify again that when I entered into the box, the car infront of me was moving but then suddenly it stopped which caused me to stop.

If still u think that there is no benifit for me to appeal in my condition, I would go by your advice.

 

Cheers

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That's just my opinion tinku, I should wait for replies from the likes of Lamma who knows more about the regulations than I do.

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This does not constitute legal advice and is not represented as a substitute for legal advice from an appropriately qualified person or firm.

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Hi Conniff ,

Thanks a lot for your response. Just to clarify again that when I entered into the box, the car infront of me was moving but then suddenly it stopped which caused me to stop.

If still u think that there is no benifit for me to appeal in my condition, I would go by your advice.

 

Cheers

 

 

I wouldn't say there is the slightest chance of you appealing that.

 

Just because the car in front of you was still moving does not mean he will manage to clear the junction before having to stop, and most certainly you can't possbly know it is true that you will clear the junction until you can assess what space is available beyond. Therefore you should have approached across the front of that side road in a manner that allowed you to stop prior to it, unless you were absolutely sure you could proceed beyond it.

 

Irrelevant of it having a yellow box across the junction, good driving dictates that you should never allow yourself to get caught blocking a junction and causing an unnecessary obstruction to vehicles wanting to turn into or out of that side road.

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looks like the blue car pulled out for the side road and was a cause. Only the video will show if this is appealable. IF it happens its a moving contravention that occurs upon entry to the box. The still does not show any relevant information at all as it is after the alleged event. Have made other recent posts about this contravention, http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/parking-traffic-offences/214883-motoring-fines-admin-charges.html#post2367604 . Understand the contravention fully and accurately and then go so the video.

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I don't think that would help on the appeal though lamma as tinku was driving the second vehicle to get stopped in the yellow box. There doesn't appear to ever have been any hope that he would be able to vacate the box irrespective of the action of the blue car coming from the side street.

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when I learnt to drive I was taught to only enter a yellow box if the exit was clear for your car. Not if it only looked like it might be clear enough for you to get through.

 

Good luck if you do appeal, but you are in the wrong.

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the video has to be viewed otherwise we are all guessing.

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Looking at the photo, even if the Blue vehicle hadnt turned out of the side street, the first stationary car in the box junction would barely have cleared it, no chance the second one would. The driver should have taken far more care when approaching the junction.

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the video has to be viewed otherwise we are all guessing.

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The contravention is on entry.

If the video show that the traffic is moving when you entered and that there is a subsequent change than AFAIK there has been no contravention. As others have said, you need to see the video of the whole event.


********************************************

Nothing in this post constitutes "advice" which I may not, in any event, be qualified to provide.

The only interpretation permitted on this post (or any others I may have made) is that this is what I would personally consider doing in the circumstances discussed. Each and every reader of this post or any other I may have made must take responsibility for forming their own view and making their own decision.

I receive an unwieldy number of private messages. I am happy to respond to messages posted on open forum but am unable to respond to private messages, seeking advice, when the substance of that message should properly be on the open forum.

Many thanks for your assistance and understanding on this.

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Hi everyone!

 

After examining the pic, I can say that the blue car has obviously turned to it's left into stationary traffic and has caused the problem. However, it has cleared the box junction when the pic was taken. The vehicle which is behind the blue car could be argued as already having entered the box junction when there was sufficiant room for it to clear the other side and the blue car has pulled out in front obstructing the first car's progress (obviously this is where the video evidence could play a part). If this is the case then it may be possible for the 1st car behind the blue car to appeal successfully.

 

However, the second car has no chance. The court would say that it was travelling too close thus giving no allowance for the first car to clear the junction as well as itself as crem has correctly pointed out in post #7.

 

In conclusion, I would advise you not to contest this in court as you may end up with points on your licence as well as paying costs.


Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

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court ? its not a matter for the court. the relevant 'evidence' is the video not the still. the still is irrelevant. "points on licence plus costs" - what ? ? ?

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court ? its not a matter for the court. the relevant 'evidence' is the video not the still. the still is irrelevant. "points on licence plus costs" - what ? ? ?

 

This offence is dealt within the fixed penalty system and as such can be dealt with without going to court. However if the fixed penalty is challenged then it would normally mean it being dealt with in the magistrates court who could apply 3 penalty points in addition to the fine. Obviously it would be up to the court to decide if the still is 'irrelevant' or not. From looking at the still, it is fairly obvious that the second car has followed the first too closely into the box with heavy traffic being present on the other side of the junction.

 

So in my opinion (which the author of this thread has asked for), I would pay the ticket. Obviously if he/she wants to contest it, then it is their decision and I wish them luck!


Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

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what thread are you talking about ? this is a PCN issued by a council not an FPN. Without seeing the video we are all guessing, that includes you too sam.

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OK, but it can also attract a FPN from the police. My point is that the first car may (with video evidence) have a case. I cannot see how the second car has because it was obviously travelling too close to end up in the position it is in the still. BUT, like I said in my previous post, feel free to contest it and let us know the outcome!


Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

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only the video will show. we haven't seen that. not heard of the police trying to issue an FPN for this for a long time, especially since councils started to enforce under applicable legislation.

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only the video will show. we haven't seen that. not heard of the police trying to issue an FPN for this for a long time, especially since councils started to enforce under applicable legislation.

 

Only last week in Wolverhampton- a lorry obstruced a box junction preventing an ambulance getting through so the police pounced on it! I agree that normally though, they would probably would'nt of been interested since the councils have been given the job of traffic enforcement.


Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

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