Lowell , Hbos & overdraft

[snowy101]

Hi all

 

I`m looking for some advice if possible please.

 

After returning home from holiday i got a letter from HBOS informing me that they had handed the " debt" onto Lowell Financial

 

First of all i dont know what debt this is/ pertains too,if as they claim an overdraft no one has given me any details . & secondly Lowell were out of the traps quicker than a champion greyhound:D.

 

How do i handle this one

 

Many thanks

 

Middxx

Edited August 6, 2009 by snowy101
ajustment

[Pinky69]

Dear Sir/Madam

 

You have contacted me/us regarding the account with the above reference number, which you claim is owed by myself/ourselves.

 

I/we would point out that I/we have no knowledge of any such debt being owed to (insert company name).

 

I am/we are familiar with the Office of Fair Trading Debt Collection Guidance which states that it unfair to send demands for payment to an individual when it is uncertain that they are the debtor in question.

 

I/we would also point out that the OFT say under the Guidance that it is unfair to pursue third parties for payment when they are not liable. In not ceasing collection activity whilst investigating a reasonably queried or disputed debt you are using deceptive/and or unfair methods.

 

Furthermore ignoring and/or disregarding claims that debts have been settled or are disputed and continuing to make unjustified demands for payment amounts to physical/psychological harassment.

 

I/we would ask that no further contact be made concerning the above account unless you can provide evidence as to my/our liability for the debt in question.

 

I/we await your written confirmation that this matter is now closed. Otherwise I will have no option but to make a complaint to the trading standards department and consider informing the OFT of your actions.

 

I/we look forward to your reply.

 

Yours faithfully

[snowy101]

Thanks for the letter Pinky, ive added some rep for you as well

 

I will send recorded delivery 1st post tomorrow.

 

Just one more point if i may, my OH has just had one of those " hold on" moments. If they do come back with anything can we still dispute it with the original creditor or do we have to deal with Lowlife

Once again many thanks for taking the time to reply

 

Middxx

[Pinky69]

HBOS will not deal with it now that it has been passed on. They will just tell you Lowell has it and you should liaise with them.

[snowy101]

Hi Pinky

 

Sorry to keep bothering you

 

can i now subject access Lowlife for all information they hold [ if any was passed over] as this could add black marks on our credit file.

If they fail to produce any proof of this debt within 40 days [ ive been reading around the site for info] whats my next step?

 

Thanks again

 

Middxx

Edited August 6, 2009 by snowy101
spelling

[PGH7447]

you send a sar to hbos with the account details and ask for all statements etc for this alledged debt, it cost £10 and they have 40 days to comply, in the meantime if the pondlife from lowells get in touch just say account in dispute due to no knowledge of it and that you are awaiting response from the bank

[Pinky69]

The SAR goes to the original creditor, HBOS, as Lowell won't have that information. Just to explain, you send the "Prove it" letter to Lowell because they are the agency now pursuing the alleged debt on behalf of HBOS. But you send the SAR to HBOS because when they assign the debt to Lowell they only pass over the details of the debt, not the paperwork.

[snowy101]

The SAR goes to the original creditor, HBOS, as Lowell won't have that information. Just to explain, you send the "Prove it" letter to Lowell because they are the agency now pursuing the alleged debt on behalf of HBOS. But you send the SAR to HBOS because when they assign the debt to Lowell they only pass over the details of the debt, not the paperwork.

 

 

Hi Pinky

 

The problem we have is because we have no account details of this alleged debt with HBOS how do we ask them to provide the details.

 

We have no account number to quote or any info on any of this alleged debt.

 

Middxx

[Pinky69]

That being the case, all you can do for now is wait and see what Lowell come up with as a result of the" prove it" letter. If they ask you for any personal details, don't give them any - it is for them to prove the debt is yours, not the other way around. Print, don't sign your signature on the letter (DCAs are not above a bit of copyong from letters) and don't speak to them on the phone - insist everything is in writing. If they call, refuse to answer their security questions.

[snowy101]

OK i got a letter from Red informing me that unless i contact them

" we now intend to advise our client to issue a county court claim " also threats of a charge against my property. I presume they mean Lowlife, as they bought the debt from Halifax & i have ignored every attempt of contact from them................... any ideas, anything to worry about or just more threatogram BS? They claim i owe just shy of £1200.

 

Secondly i have a letter from DHS, Debt help services.

now i`m not the the worlds greatest brain but its set out like a mediator kind of letter , as in a third party who wants to "help me" but the top right hand corner of the letter is 1st credit`s address & telephone number.

They are suggesting i contact Payplan & something called CCCS

 

Again any ideas?

[palomino]

CCCS and National Debtline are both genuinely helpful. There are other sites and organisations that can (eg. your local CAB) but these two are probable the pick of the bunch.

Unfortunately they are also very busy so you might have to wait for them to deal with you.

 

www.nationaldebtline.co.uk

https://www.cccs.co.uk

[Guest wino]

You cannot continue to ignore the situation it won't go away. It will however get a lot worse.

 

Have you a thread on here about the original debt as we may be able to help you?

 

As Palomino has said the organisations you have been told about are incredibly busy but good at helping you sort things out.

 

What was the original debt for?

[snowy101]

You cannot continue to ignore the situation it won't go away. It will however get a lot worse.

 

Have you a thread on here about the original debt as we may be able to help you?

 

As Palomino has said the organisations you have been told about are incredibly busy but good at helping you sort things out.

 

What was the original debt for?

 

 

It was for an overdraft with Halifax, i would say 50 % is in bank charges.

Its a very long story but i lost my card [ pre chip & pin] & by the time i noticed it was gone [ approx 9 days] it had been savaged for cashback etc etc.

halifax opened a new account but were very unwilling to help, i encured charges for DD`s et all.

I reported it to the ploice had a crime number but they still wanted monies for the bank charges, so i changed banks & never bothered with it again.

[Bazooka Boo]

Secondly i have a letter from DHS, Debt help services.

now i`m not the the worlds greatest brain but its set out like a mediator kind of letter , as in a third party who wants to "help me" but the top right hand corner of the letter is 1st credit`s address & telephone number.

They are suggesting i contact Payplan & something called CCCS Again any ideas?

 

I'm a little confused, again, but did you instigate this response from DHS, or did it just happen to 'magically' land on your doormat the same time you ran into difficulties?

 

And yes 'Red' are Lowlifes, just one of their many names just a different desk, same office, probably the same person!

[Bazooka Boo]

I reported it to the ploice had a crime number but they still wanted monies for the bank charges, so i changed banks & never bothered with it again.

 

If these charges were as a direct result of the card being used fraudulently and you have a police Ref number, and they still wanted you to cough up the charges, then more fool them, you were quite right to change banks and ignore them.

 

However, now that it has reared it's ugly head again, have you ever put in a claim to get the bank charges back?

Did you raise a complaint at the time with the bank and it's complaints department?

I would be making a formal complaint to them, in writing (recorded delivery) see what they have to say about it, then using their own complaints procedure, keep escalating the complaint until you get the desired result, or you have to escalate further to the Financial Ombudsman.

 

Have a look through the Banking Code BBA – British Bankers' Association - Archived Banking Codes

 

And here is the FOS link also. Financial Ombudsman Service

[snowy101]

I'm a little confused, again, but did you instigate this response from DHS, or did it just happen to 'magically' land on your doormat the same time you ran into difficulties?

 

And yes 'Red' are Lowlifes, just one of their many names just a different desk, same office, probably the same person!

 

As you say it just magically landed on my doorstep, ive never contacted anyone about it.

[snowy101]

If these charges were as a direct result of the card being used fraudulently and you have a police Ref number, and they still wanted you to cough up the charges, then more fool them, you were quite right to change banks and ignore them.

 

However, now that it has reared it's ugly head again, have you ever put in a claim to get the bank charges back?

Did you raise a complaint at the time with the bank and it's complaints department?

I would be making a formal complaint to them, in writing (recorded delivery) see what they have to say about it, then using their own complaints procedure, keep escalating the complaint until you get the desired result, or you have to escalate further to the Financial Ombudsman.

 

Have a look through the Banking Code BBA – British Bankers' Association - Archived Banking Codes

 

And here is the FOS link also. Financial Ombudsman Service

 

I have never done any of the above, when it originally happened i got so peeded off having to do everything myself & the attitude of Halifax was appaling, having been a customer for over 25years,

i just thought " feck it" & moved banks.

TBH i would just like to know the likelyhood of Lowlife/Red actually going for a CCJ, i`m more than happy to get on with my life & let them write to me as much as they like but obviously if they do go down the court route then i would have to do something, i dont own my property but they dont know that.

[Bazooka Boo]

As you say it just magically landed on my doorstep, ive never contacted anyone about it.

 

:eek:REALLY!!

 

Then the OFT will be very interested to know this, your the second CAGger this week that it has been done too.

 

The Office of Fair Trading: Contact us

 

Deceptive and/or unfair methods

2.7 Dealings with debtors are not to be deceitful and/or unfair.

2.8 Examples of unfair practices are as follows:

f. passing on debtor details to debt management companies without the

debtors' informed prior consent

The guide is here:The Office of Fair Trading: Debt collection practices

 

Clearly they are on the books of lowlifes then! This really really MUST be reported to the OFT, not only is it in breach of their debt collection guidelines but it is very clear that these 'reputable debt management companies' are now in cahoots with DCA's, utterly shameful,what sort of a service are people going to get from a DMC that has been passed the details of the debtor from a DCA:-x

 

I would also make a formal complaint to Contact Bond Partners UK for Debt Help Services telling them you know where they got your details from and you have reported them to the OFT their Head Office Directions

and the Information Commissioners Office;Complaints - Privacy & electronic communication - ICO

[snowy101]

:eek:REALLY!!

 

Then the OFT will be very interested to know this, your the second CAGger this week that it has been done too.

 

The Office of Fair Trading: Contact us

 

 

The guide is here:The Office of Fair Trading: Debt collection practices

 

Clearly they are on the books of lowlifes then! This really really MUST be reported to the OFT, not only is it in breach of their debt collection guidelines but it is very clear that these 'reputable debt management companies' are now in cahoots with DCA's, utterly shameful,what sort of a service are people going to get from a DMC that has been passed the details of the debtor from a DCA:-x

 

I would also make a formal complaint to Contact Bond Partners UK for Debt Help Services telling them you know where they got your details from and you have reported them to the OFT their Head Office Directions

and the Information Commissioners Office;Complaints - Privacy & electronic communication - ICO

 

Hi Boo

I think ive confused matters here.

I have recieved a " letter" proporting to be from DHS [ Debt help services]

But as i outlined in my OP it looks like i could be an inhouse job from 1st credit.

I`m sorry i cant scan it up for you to have a look at, but briefly it says they want to be my bestest friend & to give them a ring to talk over my debt [ what debt] but its a 1st credit phone number & address [ Reigate]

My OP was a two parter, sorry for any confusion, or have i made this more confusing?

 

Middxx

 

Ps

any thoughts on Lowlife / red actually going ahead with the threat of a ccj?

[snowy101]

Got a letter from Red AKA Lowell informing me that they are going to advise their clients [ lowell] to issue a claim in the county court [ ccj ]

Now they claim i owe just shy of £1200 [ overdraft] & i have never replied to any of there letters or phone calls, don't intend to either.

 

my question is are they bluffing or do they actually take people to court for this amount.

[PGH7447]

who is the OD with, and are there any charges to dispute

[hungrybear]

Got a letter from Red AKA Lowell informing me that they are going to advise their clients [ lowell] to issue a claim in the county court [ ccj ]

Now they claim i owe just shy of £1200 [ overdraft] & i have never replied to any of there letters or phone calls, don't intend to either.

 

well when they get cocky and tell you that an od isnt covered by the cca let me know and i'll give 'em a good kick for you.

 

my question is are they bluffing well thats the million dollar question its USUALLY a bluff but yes it does happen or do they actually take people to court for this amount If they thought they could they'd ccj their own mother for £2.50 - the amount is not the issue.

 

Usually they are trying to get a response but yes like pgh says we really need more info

[snowy101]

who is the OD with, and are there any charges to dispute

 

Its with Halifax & yes there are charges, lots of them.

TBH, if i can avoid a lot of letter tennis i would sooner just ignore them,but do Red / Lowlife have a history of going the ccj route?

[hungrybear]

Here's some cca info for you re overdrafts.

 

I've never had a 'red letter day' so I cannot comment on the likelihood of court but its always a possibility and I'm not sure it's a fair question to try and put someone on the spot with. If you want to raise your head out of the bunker at some point then start with a cca request (that will confuse them) - yes you can for an od

 

this is an extract from a Court case (Coutts v Sebastyen) and is part of the summing up by the Judge in relation to effect on overdrafts and the function of the CCA in such circumstances;

 

“The Defendant provided an overdraft on the account;

a. The agreement was a regulated debtor-creditor agreement within the meaning of s.8 and s.13© of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, providing for 'running-account credit' within the meaning of s.10(1)(a) of the Act (in effect, a revolving credit within an agreed credit limit); and

b. That, as such, it was subject to the requirements of Part V of the Act (including the requirements as to documentation set out in sections 57 to 63 of the Act) save and in so far as it was excluded or exempted from such requirements.

 

Section 65 in Part V of the Act provides that an "improperly executed" regulated agreement is unenforceable by the creditor without a court order. It is common ground that a regulated agreement is "improperly executed" for this purpose if the requirements of sections 57 to 63 have not been complied with.

 

Section 74 of the Act provides for the exclusion of certain agreements from Part V. It provides as follows (so far as material):

"74. – (1) This part …. does not apply to –

(b) a debtor-creditor agreement enabling the debtor to overdraw on a current account, …

(3) Subsection 1(b) … applies only where the OFT so determines, and such a determination –

(a) may be made subject to such conditions as the OFT thinks fit …

(3A) …. in relation to a debtor-creditor agreement under which the creditor is …. a bank …. the OFT shall make a determination that subsection 1(b) above applies unless it considers that it would be against the public interest to do so.

 

THE DETERMINATION:

 

The Determination (which is signed by the Director of Fair Trading) is made under section 74(3) of the Act. I set it out in full:

"1. Under the powers conferred upon me by s.74(3) and (3A) and s.133 of the Consumer Credit 1974, I, the Director General, being satisfied that it would not be against the public interest to do so, hereby revoke with effect from 1st February 1990 the Determination made by me in respect of Section 74(1)(b) and dated 3 November 1983 and now determine that with effect from 1st February 1990 Section 74(1)(b) shall apply to every debtor-creditor agreement enabling the debtor to overdraw on a current account, under which the creditor is a bank.

2. This Determination is made subject to the following conditions:-

(a) that the creditor shall have informed my Office in writing of his general intention to enter into agreements to which the Determination will apply;

(b) that where there is an agreement between a creditor and a debtor for the granting of credit in the form of an advance on a current account, the debtor shall be informed at the time or before the agreement is concluded:

- of the credit limit, if any,

- of the annual rate of interest and the charges applicable from the time the agreement is concluded and the conditions under which these may be amended,

- of the procedure for terminating the agreement;

and this information shall be confirmed in writing.

© that where a debtor overdraws his current account with the tacit agreement of the creditor and that account remains overdrawn for more than 3 months, the creditor must inform the debtor in writing not later than 7 days after the end of that 3 month period of the annual rate of interest and charges applicable.

3. In this Determination the terms 'creditor' and 'debtor' shall have the meanings assigned to them respectively by Section 189 of [the Act]. The term 'bank' includes the Bank of England and banks within the meaning of the Bankers' Books Evidence Act 1879 as amended."

[ODC]

So the monkey at the Red desk spoke to the monkey at the Clownells desk behind him and said '' Our scary letter didnt work so whats next mate, a letter from the Hampton desk