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I was shopping in Boots yesterday with my two children who are 4 years old and 5 weeks old. I was supposed to be meeting my mum in law but I got there a bit early so I went into Boots to start my shopping. I had a list of things to get for the baby as long as my arm and £50 of Boots vouchers to pay for it all that I was given as a gift when the baby arrived.

 

I selected a couple of items and put them on the pram. My 4 year old starts to pester me about getting a new beaker to which I have to repeatedly say no. I ask her to put it down. The baby throws up and I grab a muslin cloth out of my bag and mop up the sick with it. The baby grabs the cloth in his fist so rather than wrestle it off him I just leave it with him. We walk around the corner and I start to look in the clothing section, I hold some dresses up to my 4 year old and can't decide so I drape them over the handle of the pram. I start looking at the baby clothes when I suddenly realised that we were supposed to be meeting Nanny so I put the clothes back and dash off to meet her with the intention of coming back once I was with her to finish off the shopping. I'm quite a way from Boots and 3/4 of the way to the meeting point when I am stopped by a security guard. I can't remember what he said to me but when I look down I realise that the muslin had obscured the goods that I had put on the pram and I had walked out with not only those but also the beaker that my 4 year old wanted which she had placed on the pram and had become obscured by her cardigan which either she or I (I can't remember) had thrown on there.

 

I was escorted back to the store who threaten to call the police. I was in tears. A criminal record would mean the end of my job :( I had no intention of stealing the goods, in my sleep deprived and frazzled new mum state of mind I had quite simply forgotten that the goods were on the pram. To cut a long story short, the security guard treats me like **** and won't listen to my side of the story at all. I ask to see the manager. She arrives and won't hear me out either. She tells me that she does not want to speak to me and that if I wish to take the matter up with head office then it would likely end in criminal proceedings as they would review the tape, come to the same conclusion as the security guard and decide to press charges :eek:

 

I was issued with a lifetime ban from all Boots stores nationwide and a letter telling me that the matter has been reffered to RLP.

 

My H went down to the store this morning to try and sort it out. They were as arsey with him as they were with me but he is very persistant and eventually he managed to get a few major points across.

 

Problem is both the security guard and the store manager are very pig headed and complete battleaxes. There was no way that they were willing to accept that it was an accident and they would not deviate from 'the company policy'.

 

H has managed to persuade the security guard to burn off a copy of the footage for the security guards boss to take a look at and review. He will then give the store manager his opinion and based on that the store manager may or may not lift the ban from the store.

 

The referral to RLP will still stand regardless.

 

We are still waiting to hear back from the store manager. I suspect that they won't bother getting back to us.

 

I have a few questions:

1. What happens now? Is it worth me writing to Boots head office to explain in the hope that they might back down?

2. If I don't pay the fine, what will happen?

3. How can they possibly stop me from going in all of their stores? They must have hundreds of shoplifting incidents nationwide every day so how can all those faces be memorised? The exclusion letter they gave me says that I am banned from this store not all stores so surely I can go into one in a different town?

4. How will this affect my carreer?

5. I have a Boots advantage card, I am a parenting club member, I use the opticians and the pharmacy on a regular basis. What will happen with all of that?

 

I can't believe that Boots have been so heavy handed and banned me for life for the sake of a few pounds worth of stock. I spend thousands of pounds with them every year and they have basically lost all of that trade for life now! Whatever the outcome of this whole mess, I will be taking my custom elsewhere :evil:

 

I hope someone can advise as to what my next step should be. I am not a criminal just a frazzled mum who got into a fluster and made an error.

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Hi hotfish, welcome the the world of mums who have been at the receiving end of Boots and their atrocious actions towards their most lucrative customer base!:-x

 

Very similar story to myself (I took my story off the forum as didn't want RLP to identify me) but basically I have been hauled across the coals by Boots and RLP.

 

What Boots in their wisdom do not seem to realise is that they are

ostracising themselves from their most loyal and luctrative customers.........namely 'Mother and Baby'.

 

In answer to you questions, this is my opinion...

1. Hold off writing to Boots just yet....hopefully some other experienced forum members will be in touch and ask you to contact them.

 

2. If you don't pay the fine you will most likely be subject to numerous threatening letters from the goons at RLP - if no response from you, they will then pass your details onto a debt collecting agency, namely Opos.

 

3. They also advised me I was banned from all Boots stores, but in reality I don't think they can measure this. I believe their security guards work in several stores within a said area (the lout which stopped me advised me of this - little did he know I wasn't from that area, only there to catch a flight abroad)..........but do you really want to shop in any Boots store again??? They certainly won't be receiving my custom again, regardless of whether or not I feel brave enough to enter my local stores. (just out of curiosity, I worked out that I have probably spent well in excess of £7k in Boots in the past 6 years!!!:eek::eek::eek:) So in answer to your question, if you have several Boots branches in your local town/city, chances are the security guard who stopped you might be working in one of them at some point. I wouldn't put yourself through the embarassment of being asked to leave.

 

4. Look up RLP www.lossprevention.co.uk on the internet....this is what they claim...

 

"You are notified that the personal information we hold may be used in accordance with the Data Protection Act 1998 (DPA), to make employment decisions, decisions regarding the provision of credit and for the purposes of crime prevention and detection. Access to the information may be available to the Claimant, the Courts, legal advisors and RLP, where there is a legitimate reason for doing so in accordance with the Act."

 

There is also another thread on this forum headed 'Cireco Ltd - RLPS Other Business'.........look that up and click on the links.......it makes disturbing reading as to the use of data. They claim 'Integrity Screening' is used whereby employers can access this data to check what info is held for both new and existing employees. They have the audacity to claim should you have been unfortunate enough to be at the receiving end of RLP and their idiotic antics, you would flag up as RED ALERT - THIS PERSON IS ON THE DISHONESTY REGISTER!!!:-x

 

I WOULD SWEAR RIGHT NOW BUT I'LL PROBABLY GET BANNED FROM THIS FORUM SO I'LL HOLD MY TONGUE FOR NOW!!!!!:-x:-x:-x:-x:-x:-x:-x

 

5. Your advantage card will most likely be cancelled and any points you have on it will be declared null and viod.

 

Am sorry to hear of your situation hotfish, but it's good to hear other peoples stories and realise I am not alone. As the weeks go by, I am becoming more and more angry................this is my childrens summer holidays and what should have been a happy time for me has been blighted by the horrific actions of Boots and RLP.

Edited by Button1

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Thank you Button :) It is good to know I am not alone.

 

I am a well known and respected member of quite a few parenting forums online and groups in real life and I have a lot of fellow parents behind me already. So basically Boots came down too heavy handed on someone who made a genuine sleep deprived error and as a result they have lost a lot of customers who are quite happy to take their business to Superdrug or Tesco instead :D. My entire family will no longer shop at Boots either. That is going to be a lot of lost business for them. Nevermind eh?

 

I'm really angry though. Namely because a lot of my Christmas shopping is done in Boots and also I can only get certain products that I use from there. I've also got the vouchers that I was given for the baby to spend. Guess they will have to go on ebay now huh?

 

It has really knocked my confidence, I've been really anxious since the event, I'm sleeping less than I was and I'm not going to be able to go out shopping again for a long time.

 

:-x

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Thank you Button :) It is good to know I am not alone.

 

I am a well known and respected member of quite a few parenting forums online and groups in real life and I have a lot of fellow parents behind me already. So basically Boots came down too heavy handed on someone who made a genuine sleep deprived error and as a result they have lost a lot of customers who are quite happy to take their business to Superdrug or Tesco instead :D. My entire family will no longer shop at Boots either. That is going to be a lot of lost business for them. Nevermind eh?

 

I'm really angry though. Namely because a lot of my Christmas shopping is done in Boots and also I can only get certain products that I use from there. I've also got the vouchers that I was given for the baby to spend. Guess they will have to go on ebay now huh?

 

It has really knocked my confidence, I've been really anxious since the event, I'm sleeping less than I was and I'm not going to be able to go out shopping again for a long time.

 

:-x

 

Hi hotfish,

 

If I was you I wouldn't be overly concerned about not being able to do my Christmas shopping at Boots.............I would be VERY concerned about the use of my personal data on a DISHONESY REGISTER!!! How dare they play judge and jury and make these haphazard assumptions which could have an extremely detrimental effect on a persons life!

 

You say this only happened to you yesterday - write down every detail you can remember about the event - even the smallest insignificant thing. It's good you have people you can discuss things with - I haven't had the courage to tell my family or friends yet (just my husband and one other close friend), so this forum has provided a fantanstic source of help and support.

 

Hopefully you will hear from one of the more experienced forum members - please get in touch with them if they ask you to do so - there is help out there.

Edited by Button1

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hotfish im sure joncris will be asking himself any day now.

 

if you could contact either joncris or martin3030 (probably joncris martin gets alot of pms and ussually has a full in box)

 

the reason for this is alot is going on that cannot be shown on the forums incase retail loss spies what we are upto.

 

best bet is to contact joncris click here

 

explain everything or point to the thread


Please note:

 

  • I am employed in the IT sector of a high street retail chain but am not posting in any official capacity,so therefore any comments,suggestions or opinions are expressly personal ones and should not be viewed as an endorsement or with agreement of any company.
  • i am not legal trained in any form.
  • I have many experiences in life and do often use these in my posts

if ive been helpful kick my scales, if ive been unhelpful kick the scales of the person more helpful :eek:

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apologies, post edited as posted on wrong thread!

Edited by Button1
written on wrong thread

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A quick update: I've had a letter from RLP today demanding £137.50. Should I pay it and put an end to this awful nightmare? I've been losing so much sleep over this :( If I pay it, what are the consequences?

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Those who HAVE contacted Boots have had some good responses.I think you certainly have nothing to lose.Send the letter recorded,keep a copy.

Even if you DID agree to pay this £137.50,we understand that that adverse data is being collected and recorded-which is something currently being looked into,and is equally a real concern.

RLP have not yet been able to substantiate these fees as being a genuine pre estimate,and as we have continually said,how can these fees be a realistic figure when they are the same demand in every instance-regardless of store,location,or incident ?

We do not advise anyone to pay their demands until they are clearly able to demonstrate proof,clarity,and have evidence beyond any doubt that the shoppers actions were to intentially defraud,deprive the store,or incur losses.


Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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Thank you Martin :)

 

Would someone please be able to tell me what excatly to expect if I don't pay RLP?

 

Right now I'm just wanting to put everything behind me. I don't think writing to Boots will do any good seeing as I did actually remove items from the store albeit unintentionally. For all intents and purposes anyone viewing the CCTV footage of me in the store would probably come to the conclusion that I did it on purpose (unless the person viewing is extremely sympathetic and had possibly been in a similar situation themselves :()

 

I've been getting so worked up over this, I've been losing sleep and I've been constantly anxious. There is no way on this planet that I will be able to go shopping without another adult being present for a LONG long time. It has really affected me and so I want to try to move on. In that respect I am thinking of paying RLP. My current job is safe as long as I don't have a criminal record. I'm on maternity leave at the moment and I won't be looking to change employment until my baby is in school (5-6 years time). I'm pretty sure that a potential employer in my line of work would not be looking at RLP's databases anyway. And if they did...well we probably would have moved house by then.

 

So I'm just trying to figure out if it is worth my sanity to not pay them. On the one hand, we don't really have the money at the moment but on the other I just want this ordeal to be over :mad:

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You are likely to get a couple more letters.

We are currently looking at a change of tac by RLP to determine future responses.

There are as yet unsubstantiated reports of RLP now selling on alleged"debts" to a third party DCA.

This is clearly a worrying situation if indeed it is true.

 

None of the 30+ cases we have seen on CAG have materialised into any Court action,and I would not expect to see that of your case go anywhere near a Court.

Irrespective of whether you pay or not,it is reasonable to assume that your data will continue to be processed.

If you DO pay,then it can be seen as your acknowlegement and agreement that RLP have acted correctly in imposing these fees.

 

Although you may say that you feel some responsibility,RLP have not proved their case in asking you for £137.50.

 

No one pays money out to anyone without knowing exactly what it is for,and that it is justified.


Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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Hotfish, I feel exactly the same as you - I just want this whole situation to go away!

 

On the other hand however, I would welcome the viewing of CCTV - I have faith in the justice system in this country and believe that most people would see what you did as a mistake by a stressed mum rather than the actions of a thief.

 

I don't think moving house would change anything - you could still be easily traced so I don't think that would be a way around it.

 

It's been a month since my incident, and if its any consilation to you, it does get easier - anger replaces the fear! It's early days yet - you've got 21 days to respond to them so keep an eye on the forum and see what transpires.

 

Keep your chin up and enjoy this time with your new baby! x

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RLP had a case taken to the High Court this week where they tried to get some guy for 'stealing' a 25p banana. I would think your circumstances (and the video evidence - don't forget to get that) would be in your favour.

 

Don't pay RLP one penny, they have no right to this and eventually will come a complete cropper.

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So do I send a letter asking them to justify their charge? Or do I just ignore them and hope they go away?

 

You say 30+ cases not gone to court - how long has the longest one been going on for? Will I be looking over my shoulder for the rest of my life? I can't risk any blemishes on my credit file either as I'm likely to be applying for a mortgage soon....

 

What will happen if I mark all correspondance from RLP as return to sender? Would they be able to track me down? If so how?

 

And how did RLP get a case to high court? Surely that is for high profile murder cases and such. Thought this was a civil issue? Do you have a link to story sillygirl1?

 

Button1 - thanks, I'm trying but I'm turning into a paraniod wreck. It has affected my milk supply too so baby is screaming all the time. It never rains, it pours :( That is why I am thinking of paying because at least I won't have to be worrying everytime the letterbox or doorbell goes :(

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It was the Crown Court, link here - doesn't actually state RLP were behind it but shows how much these spurious claims can cost money. Don't pay them as under the circumstances you would possibly be cleared by a Crown Court.

 

Taxpayer funds £20,000 court case to prosecute man for stealing 25p banana... he is found not guilty | Mail Online

 

You now need to write to Boots Head Office and ask for the security tape from that day as they are threatening prosecution and you want the evidence to be seen... include RLP's letter with it and then see what happens.

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You would need to make the application via a SAR for a copy of the tape,which can be in a format of your choice-ie DVD.

Perhaps you should write asking for details of the process required to obtain this since an application for stills or captures of CCTV images can often mean filling out one of THEIR forms.

Since RLP have been engaged and authorised by Boots,they share a responsibility to address your complaints.

RLPs sister company Cireco are also involved in tracing-moving house or changing names therefore would not take you off their systems.

You need to write 3 letters.

1 To Boots asking them to clarify that they are in agreement to RLPs actions being acceptable.

What the process is to obtain CCTV images/footage.

2.A letter to RLP asking them to furnish a breakdown of the fees they are demanding,which shows clearly what the £137.50 is for.

That you require details of any third parties to which your data is being collected stored or processed,including the names of any of their associated companies.

A copy of their complaints procedures.

 

3.A letter to the ICO making a formal complaint,and seeking clarification as to whether RLP and its associated companies are within their remit to process,share or pass on your data without your permission.


Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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Oh gosh! That is a lot of letter writing! I'm worried about pushing it with Boots as they did threaten to involve the police if I took it further. At the end of the day I did commit a criminal act abeit unintentionally and they did have every right to involve the police. If I got a caution then it would be the end of my job so I really, really can't risk getting the brunt of a the store managers bad mood :( So basically I have to pay it don't I?

 

With regards to the change of address, I meant for the purposes of an employer searching RLP's databases. If I pay now, then this address will go on their database. We will have moved in a few years time and so a potential employer will have my new address. Therefore if they do search RLP's databases nothing should come up as RLP will have not have my new address. Does that make sense? I know what they are doing is wrong but I'm just trying to limit the damage IYSWIM.

 

Can I still make a complaint to the ICO if I do pay them?

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Your complaint to the ICO would inevitably be viewed in a different light if you did pay this £137.50

 

Secondly,yes maybe RLP would not have your new address,but dont forget the credit reference agencies obtain info from 1000s of different sources.

Information sharing is such that they would not have too much difficulty updating your details.

 

Its your choice as to what you want to do.

There is more than enough in these forums to give you the answers to those questions that you are asking.

Only you can decide whether you are prepared to pay their fees or not.

You have expressed concerns about the consequences of having your data adversely processed,this will not sort itself out by paying their fee.

Therefore if it is your thinking that paying the fee will end RLP and their associate businesses processing of your data,then you are mistaken.

They make it quite clear that they are entitled to do this,and it forms a good part of their reliance of those on their files to make payment.

Edited by MARTIN3030

Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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I'm not sure I understand? Why would they need to update my details if I have paid? They must have sooooo many people on their databases, are you telling me that they check and update peoples info daily?

 

My credit file is impeccable. I have been with the same bank for years and I have only ever had one credit card which is rarely used. I don't use catalogues and the last loan that I had was paid up in 2005. Would / could RLP out something on my credit file even if I have paid? And if they did would my bank really care given my past history with them? How would RLP have access to my credit file anyway?

 

I'm sorry if I am being naive and I'm sorry for all these questions. I'm just trying to figure out the best path to take which gives me the least amount of stress as I'm about to have a nervous breakdown over all this scaremongering :Cry:

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How long would I be on RLP's database for? Is it a permanent thing?

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Credit files are not only used to view peoples credit ratings-they are also used to find other information-although there is a requirement that searches are done for good reasons-we know that many dont comply and abuse the rules.

I dont know how often they update their data-I am suggesting that Cedit reference agencies do it frequently an this info is given to them from many sources.


Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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I have a free legal advice helpline attached to my house insurance. I think it might be an idea to discuss the matter with them as I need to be absolutely certain that whatever I do has the minimum impact to mine and my family's future.

 

Thank you for all your help Martin and everyone else. I have spent ages reading through all the threads on here but I couldn't find anyone whose situation matched mine or was even close really. I have a lot to lose so am obviously very cautious about going in all guns blazing.

 

Thanks again.

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Ok good luck with it.


Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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I have a free legal advice helpline attached to my house insurance. I think it might be an idea to discuss the matter with them as I need to be absolutely certain that whatever I do has the minimum impact to mine and my family's future.

 

Thank you for all your help Martin and everyone else. I have spent ages reading through all the threads on here but I couldn't find anyone whose situation matched mine or was even close really. I have a lot to lose so am obviously very cautious about going in all guns blazing.

 

Thanks again.

 

Hotfish, it probably does sound like alot of scaremongering.....but that is what RLP rely on to force innocent people to pay up quietly!

 

Bottom line is if you pay up you go on their database for 6 years in England, 5 in Scotland. This is what they claim anyway. But who can believe them? No, infact, you'll be on their database already regardless of payment or not. Paying up quietly just re-itterates the fact that the defendent is guilty.

 

IMHO, I doubt very much if Boots would involve the Police at this stage. What you could do in the meantime if you you're really worried about the immediate repercussions is pay them but make it clear that this by no means admitting liability. This is just to put a stop to any further demands from them. Say that encashment of your cheque means they agree to your proposition. This gets them off your back with regards to the monetary side of things, and gives you a little breathing space to see what you want to do with regards to the use of your data.

 

I know this goes against the grain of this forum (I expect some backlash from forum users), but I understand your situation and being a new mum isn't easy at the best of times, let alone having this to contend with. This would just put an end to letters from them until you are strong enough to tackle them with regards your data.

 

You still have another 2 weeks before the 21 days are up. Pleanty of time to have a think about things, keep an eye on the forums and make a decision. You aren't alone - let us know what you decide.

 

Button

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"I know this goes against the grain of this forum (I expect some backlash from forum users), but I understand your situation and being a new mum isn't easy at the best of times, let alone having this to contend with. This would just put an end to letters from them until you are strong enough to tackle them with regards your data."

 

 

I hope we dont see any backlash.

People should be free to decide for themselves,whether they wish to act on advice given,or not.

This goes for all CAG forums.Although we do have some legally qualified members on CAG,for the most part advice and opinions offered should always be weighed up and balanced by those seeking it.Care should always be taken when deciding if you wish to take up or act upon advce given.

Often there is no universal approach and individual cases will rely on different approaches.

Of course there is nothing to lose by offering settlement without admitting any liability and asking for an undertaking that your data will cease to be processed.What you have to remember is that those who are in the business of information supplying,are making money from it too.


Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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"I know this goes against the grain of this forum (I expect some backlash from forum users), but I understand your situation and being a new mum isn't easy at the best of times, let alone having this to contend with. This would just put an end to letters from them until you are strong enough to tackle them with regards your data."

 

 

I hope we dont see any backlash.

People should be free to decide for themselves,whether they wish to act on advice given,or not.

This goes for all CAG forums.Although we do have some legally qualified members on CAG,for the most part advice and opinions offered should always be weighed up and balanced by those seeking it.Care should always be taken when deciding if you wish to take up or act upon advce given.

Often there is no universal approach and individual cases will rely on different approaches.

Of course there is nothing to lose by offering settlement without admitting any liability and asking for an undertaking that your data will cease to be processed.What you have to remember is that those who are in the business of information supplying,are making money from it too.

 

Martin, I'm not quite sure how to interpret that post?? I was just giving my opinion and a possible alternative solution - is that not what these forums are about??

 

I am certainely not making any money from giving my opinion it but perhaps I have mis-interpreted your post??

 

Thanks

 

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