Cabot : Has anyone ever tried this .....

[cashins]

Well at least they took you seriously Fred!

 

I assume they sent you a copy of what you already have, in which case I would say they were struggling.

 

david

[Fred Bassett]

Well at least they took you seriously Fred!

 

I assume they sent you a copy of what you already have, in which case I would say they were struggling.

 

david

 

Quite correct David, that's what they sent. I didn't expect anything else to be honest.

 

Regards.

 

Fred

[Fred Bassett]

So if the original copy has been destroyed, how are they going to proceed? Surely they would have to produce the original in court in order to prove it was properly executed?

 

Fred

[cashins]

Surely they would have to produce the original in court in order to prove it was properly executed?

 

You never know with judges these days!!

 

What they would need is something better than what they have now and judging by their comments they can't get it.

 

I think they are up the creek with this one!!

 

David

[angry cat]

A LEMON:

A "lemon" refers to an item or device which does not function properly.

 

AC

[mysticpols06]

Fanbloomintastic response hun!

[sunflower99]

Subbing! Hope you have some luck Fred! Barclayshark crapital one and MBNA ignored similar offers from me to view my alleged agreements! Love the letter!

[Fred Bassett]

Theres some lovely pubs in West Malling Fred...but somehow i doubt you'll hear anything so i reckon your buying your own lunch lmao !!!!:D:D

 

Just been to a lovely pub in Farningham and had a couple of excellent pints of real ale. Very nice indeed. Nice part of the world this. Not as nice as Dorset though!

 

Fred

[GamekeeperToPoacher]

Personally I am impressed by such a rare display of honesty from the DCA

 

I had something similar from Ellie a while back and now just get the odd call or 3 from Debit A*se every now again who get really upset when you say :

"please give me your details while I record this call - more often than not the phone hits the deck before their jaw does.

 

Well done sir and good fortune.

 

GK

Edited August 17, 2009 by GamekeeperToPoacher
Spelling *SHAMED*

[vjohn82]

Inspired work indeed...

[sunflower99]

Cabot Financial

PO Box No 241

West Malling

Kent

ME19 4NA

FAO xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

13th August 2009

 

 

Dear xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx,

 

With reference to your letter dated 12th August 2009. Thank you for confirming that you do not have a copy of a properly-executed agreement in relation to this account.

 

I trust that you will now accept that this account is in serious dispute because of your failure to provide this information. I trust also that Cabot will now obey the law and cease collections activity on this account until such time as you are able fulfill your legal obligations in this respect.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

 

Fred Bassett

Good on you Fred! its great they admittted the originals probably been shreeded! silly beggers!

[sunflower99]

So if the original copy has been destroyed, how are they going to proceed? Surely they would have to produce the original in court in order to prove it was properly executed?

 

Fred

Hi Fred

This is a quote posted this on another thread should the beggers try and get a microfilch copy enforced-If they try and fob you of with getting away with microfilch copy and dont bring original into court my thoughts on this and from reading threads on other forums is that you could point out to DJ these things repectfully!This quote- As i saw on another forum this point was made - A copy birth certificate is unacceptable to obtain a pass port and driving licence.A copy of divorce papers is not acceptable to obtain a passpoert or driving licence ,A copy of land deeds are not acceptable as proof of ownership of land and you cant send a copy of your driving license to prove you passed your test even if you swear on oath to say you have passed it.You must produce the original,So why should this be any different for something as importand as a credit agreement? .It can be argued on this basis that a copy of an agreement is not acceptable as proof of a debt!so this argument can be brought out in court as well and which i will be doing

[sunflower99]

Another useful point i gleaned from this thread was this point that could be made using case law and which i will be using- taken from a thread -Also if you read the Wilson v First Counties Trust it says in this ruling and says specifically " a document" signed by the debtor NOT a "copy" of a document signed by the debtor... and as everyone knows a comma can make a difference to the meaning of a sentence and especially in law and this is very significant.

Quote from Wilson case- IN effect- the crediter - by failing to ensure that he obtained a document signed by the debtor which contained all the prescribed terms -must (in the light of the provisions in section 65(1) and 127(3) of the 1974 Act) be taken to have made a voluntary disposition,or gift , of the loan monies to the debtor,The crediter had chosen to part with the monies in circumstances in which it was never entitled to have them repaid.

The conclusion to be drawn from this quote is case law and consumer law meant - A "Document" signed by the debtor containing all the prescribed terms", not a copy.If you have not got the document you not got an agreement

[sunflower99]

Also could point out that banks themselves dont like to accept faxed copies of things either!

[Jeff2000]

Hi sunflower,

 

 

You could also provide the court with a photoshopped agreement containing, for example, the solicitors name and address etc to demonstrate exactly why the original agreement is required. (Somebody has actually done this!)

 

(I'd mark this copy "FOR DEMONSTRATION PURPOSES ONLY!" in some way if I was you.)

 

 

Jeff.

[sunflower99]

Hi sunflower,

 

 

You could also provide the court with a photoshopped agreement containing, for example, the solicitors name and address etc to demonstrate exactly why the original agreement is required. (Somebody has actually done this!)

 

(I'd mark this copy "FOR DEMONSTRATION PURPOSES ONLY!" in some way if I was you.)

 

 

Jeff.

Hi Jeff

Thanks! Thats a great idea! Have you got a link to that thread! Would love to see how they went about this.I have received a court summons from Restons so grateful for all the ideas! someone has given me a file of a properly executed MBNA agreement which they told me i should print out for demonstration purposed only:) and include in court bundle and in court compare it with the microfich copy of my alleged MBNA agreement which seems to have aquired an alleged reverse with terms on back of an application form:rolleyes: and refers to terms not present!

[GamekeeperToPoacher]

Hi Fred

This is a quote posted this on another thread should the beggers try and get a microfilch copy enforced-If they try and fob you of with getting away with microfilch copy and dont bring original into court my thoughts on this and from reading threads on other forums is that you could point out to DJ these things repectfully!This quote- As i saw on another forum this point was made - A copy birth certificate is unacceptable to obtain a pass port and driving licence.A copy of divorce papers is not acceptable to obtain a passpoert or driving licence ,A copy of land deeds are not acceptable as proof of ownership of land and you cant send a copy of your driving license to prove you passed your test even if you swear on oath to say you have passed it.You must produce the original,So why should this be any different for something as importand as a credit agreement? .It can be argued on this basis that a copy of an agreement is not acceptable as proof of a debt!so this argument can be brought out in court as well and which i will be doing

 

An inspired quote Sunflower - dinged

 

Also I was considering the possibility that a judge may comment that the defendant is attempting to avoid payment by making use of a loophole. I am thinking along the lines of a response such as " Yes Sir, with respect, I am merely using the same tactics as those used by everyone in business and, in fact, in government. Are not the MOD trying to avoid making additional payments to service personnel injured whilst defending our country? Are the US government refusing to pay the Congestion Charge as they see it as a tax which diplomats do not pay? I am happy to ally myself with them in using the law as it is written.

 

I will, of course, be taking a book and my toothbrush!

 

GK

[sunflower99]

An inspired quote Sunflower - dinged

 

Also I was considering the possibility that a judge may comment that the defendant is attempting to avoid payment by making use of a loophole. I am thinking along the lines of a response such as " Yes Sir, with respect, I am merely using the same tactics as those used by everyone in business and, in fact, in government. Are not the MOD trying to avoid making additional payments to service personnel injured whilst defending our country? Are the US government refusing to pay the Congestion Charge as they see it as a tax which diplomats do not pay? I am happy to ally myself with them in using the law as it is written.

 

I will, of course, be taking a book and my toothbrush!

 

GK

Good point Too! Gamekeeper!

[sunflower99]

Banks can not talk anyway! They use every loop hole they can think of to levy horrendous interest rates on peple and unfair penalty charges! and they would not hesitate to use ant loophole to get more money out of their customers if they could get away with it!

[Jeff2000]

Hi Jeff

Thanks! Thats a great idea! Have you got a link to that thread! Would love to see how they went about this.I have received a court summons from Restons so grateful for all the ideas! someone has given me a file of a properly executed MBNA agreement which they told me i should print out for demonstration purposed only:) and include in court bundle and in court compare it with the microfich copy of my alleged MBNA agreement which seems to have aquired an alleged reverse with terms on back of an application form:rolleyes: and refers to terms not present!

 

 

 

 

Hi,

 

 

Off the top of my head I can't remember which thread it was but if I find it I'll let you know. Other Caggers may also be aware of it.

 

P.S. On the back of your demonstration agreement you could also copy any terms and conditions that you see fit! (Two can play at their game;)!)

 

 

Jeff.

[Jeff2000]

Hi sunflower,

 

 

You could also provide the court with a photoshopped agreement containing, for example, the solicitors name and address etc to demonstrate exactly why the original agreement is required. (Somebody has actually done this!)

 

(I'd mark this copy "FOR DEMONSTRATION PURPOSES ONLY!" in some way if I was you.)

 

 

Jeff.

 

 

 

Hello sunflower,

 

 

I have found the thread mentioned in one of my previous posts. I got it slightly wrong in that it was a copy of a statement that the O.P. altered to show that it belonged to the sols. This was because they couldn't produce a CCA containing all the prescribed terms and so tried to say the statements proved the alleged debt was owed.

 

Anyway, you can read and enjoy;

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/dca-legal-successes/90012-just-been-court-cl.html

 

 

Fill your boots,

 

Jeff.

[sunflower99]

Hello sunflower,

 

 

I have found the thread mentioned in one of my previous posts. I got it slightly wrong in that it was a copy of a statement that the O.P. altered to show that it belonged to the sols. This was because they couldn't produce a CCA containing all the prescribed terms and so tried to say the statements proved the alleged debt was owed.

 

Anyway, you can read and enjoy;

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/dca-legal-successes/90012-just-been-court-cl.html

 

 

Fill your boots,

 

Jeff.

Hi Jeff

Thanks for link to thread! will be reading with interest!

[debt4get]

Like I said Pinky, I don;t intend to turn up out of the blue. It's 'gesture politics' if you like. I will invite them to let me see the original documents. If they refuse then it won't look very good on them if they then produce the same if they take me to court.

 

I just wonder if anyone has done this before. I'd be very surprised if it hasn't happened.

 

Regards.

 

Fred

there was a thread on here about barclaycard and their agreements caggers tried to arrange for people to go and look at agreements barclays declined saying' I am sorry we are unable to accomodate people to view their agreements' if they have the agreement they should have sent it too you however I wouldnt hold my breath

[Fred Bassett]

[Fred Bassett]

This is the 3rd, identical, letter I've had from Cabot. What they really mean to say is this:

 

Please call us on 0845 0700 116 (Minicom: 01732 524630) urgently, and speak to one our paid thugs about your account. It is vital to us that you do this because we have f*** all chance of frightening you in writing without giving you the sort of evidence that you could take to Channel 4 Dispatches.

 

It is our aim to lie to our "customers" as to the kind of powers we actually have, especially in regard to the accounts where no provable agreement exists in order to maximise our profits from accounts that we purchased for 10p in pound.