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GAP insurance

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Hi All (think this is the first time I've ever set foot in this forum)

 

This post is on behalf of a friend, who bought a car last year (before I met her). She's not very good with money etc, and ended up being sold GAP insurance along with her car. The dealership 'helpfully' arranged a loan with Barlcays Finance for her too, and she's paying quite a lot in interest.

 

 

With the GAP insurance (provided by AA Warranty), she had agreed to 5 years of cover, and has effectively paid up front, since this had been added to her loan.

 

We'd like to cancel the GAP (for a start, if she really wanted it, she could get it cheaper by buying directly from the AA). Given that the dealership will almost certainly have made commission on the selling of it, there may be grounds to claim it has been missold; but at the moment I'm simply asking for the insurance to be cancelled, and the remaining 4 years to be refunded.

 

Naturally the dealership say we can't do this, and it's up to the AA anyway. The AA are trying to fob me off, saying that if I believe the policy was missold, I should speak to the dealership.

 

The AA have refused to either admit or deny the existance of any secret commission, and I've pointed out to them that - since there are grounds for considerting legal action - I would be entitled to use CPR 31.16 to get this information. I've also made it clear than I'll escalate the matter to the FOS if necessary.

 

They're still refusing to budge. Any thoughts please? Who should I be going after? The AA or the dealership?

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Guest Old_andrew2018

Sounds reasonable however I'm no expert so my reply will at least BUMP your thread.

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I've been through the internal complains procedure of both the AA and the dealership. Both have stated that they do not believe the GAP insurance was mis-sold, and are refusing to refund it. I've now submitted a complaint to the FOS re the AA.

 

One thing which slightly surprised me ... in the dealership's final response, they made reference to one of the letters which I had sent to the AA. I suppose it would have been naive to think that they weren't in communication with each other discussing me, but for them to state this was a surprise. Are the AA allowed to pass on my letter to the dealership without my consent?

 

I suppose I should now make an FOS complaint about the dealership, but to be honest I'm feeling a bit deflated. I'm not sure if I even have a case to argue, and to some extent I was hoping that a formal complaint (with the threat of a complaint to the FOS) might be enough.

 

If the FOS don't decide favourably, I don't feel that I'm on strong enough legal ground to take any form of court action (for a start, it seems that cases such as this are judged very much on their own merit, rather than their being hard and fast rules)

 

Any thoughts on how to procede would be much appreciated

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Ok

 

First Thing

 

Demand From The Dealership A

 

Statement Of Price Ref The Selling Of This Gap Nsurance

 

Its Taken Two Years To Finally Nail Welcome Finance With There Undisclosed Commission Payments, Its The Holy Grail As It Would Invalidate The Finance Agreement.

 

SO IT WILL BE A SLOG WITH THIS LOT

 

Wilson V Hurstanger

 

 

The Other Way Is A Disclosure Order Through The Court

You Might Request The Fos To Get The Underwriting Sheet Which Will Show Any Commission Payments

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Does it automatically invalidate the the agreement? From what I've read, the presence of a secret commission is only an issue if you have paid the dealership a fee to arrange the insurance. In these situations, they are acting as a broker and have a duty to look after your best interests - which would create a conflict if they were taking commission.

 

The docs from the dealership state 'we do not charge a fee for arranging this service' ('this' referring to the host of extra packages they sell). Perhaps this is to protect them being seen as a broker in the eyes of the law.

 

However, they did charge 800 pounds for 'doc and interest fees', which could just be a means of making a bit of money. I asked them to provide a breakdown of this, which they didn't do

 

I'll scan a few docs in tomorrow ....

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Yes It Does Invalidate As It Calls The Whole Agreement Into Question

 

Any Commission Payments Passed On To A Third Party Has To Be Disclosed On The Agreement

 

Why Would You Pay A Dealership To Arange Insurance

 

The Dealership Makes There Money On Commission On Selling The Insurance

 

The Commission Payments Are Normally Worked Underhand Back Into The Agreement So The Customer Gets Shafted Twice

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I don't believe this will be easy - it is just as easy for them to claim it was 'mis-bought'. You've not stated why you no longer want it. Sure, it may cost more from that particular supplier, but there is free choice. Tesco are not going to refund me because I can buy the same items in Asda for less.

 

The main thrust of the argument (to me) appears that someone has paid more money (in hindsight) for the supply of a service. There is no 'fit for purpose' argument, and the policy, as it was fully paid for in advance, is a done deal, and expecting a refund because of a later change of mind - you would need to be guided by the terms of the policy, what does IT state you can do where the policy is cancelled? It may be that the policy is - after 28 days - deemed to be formally in force, and in the case of cancellation, NO REFUND is due. If so, then you don't shout wanting cancellation, as if the policy is cancelled with no prospect of any rebate is the equivalent of shooting yourself in the foot. Far better to learn and move on, with the cover still in force.

 

As for who pays how much to whom and for why - all this depends on when the agreement was reached, but not a foundation stone for trying to seek cancellation with a refund. The commission is paid for the purposes of 'selling' the service or product to the customer. They did this - so stating a change of mind is not enough for the fee to be rebated, there would have to be offering incorrect or misleading advice - and cost does not enter into this.

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Can You Post Up The T&c Of This Gap Policy

 

Ive Seen Some That/ Well Most Of Them Are Not Worth The Paper Written On

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Perhaps - but like most things, that's not an excuse for a refund either!

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most of the ones ive seen have a limit you can claim of a thousend pounds

 

that wont cover labour let alone parts and some of these agreements cost 500 quid

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And the point is? If it is why pay £1000 for a policy that can only pay out £1000. I agree. However isn;t that kind of question better put to the customer? Why on earth would they sign up to such a carp policy? It's a fact of life we have to take account for the actions we take - not seek to pass the blame on to someone, anyone once there has been time to reflect.

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Here we go. Signatures etc were blanked out by me, highlighting was added by them:

 

 

http://consumeractiongroup.co.uk/stoneacre.jpg

http://consumeractiongroup.co.uk/stoneacre 001.jpg

http://consumeractiongroup.co.uk/stoneacre 002.jpg

http://consumeractiongroup.co.uk/stoneacre 003.jpg

http://consumeractiongroup.co.uk/stoneacre 004.jpg

http://consumeractiongroup.co.uk/stoneacre 005.jpg

 

buzby: I appreciate your arguement. Certainly she should have read through the paperwork thoroughly and not signed if she wasn't 100% happy. But the other side of the coin is that she's very inexperienced in these matters, and was easily talked into it by the salesmen. No doubt they saw her coming, and were more than happy to take her money. Don't forget that although the regulars on here might be pretty savvy about these things, a good chunk of the public are very intimidated by finance agreements and the like.

 

Regarding your Tesco/Asda arguement, if you bought a TV from Tesco for 500 pounds, then found that the same model was on sale in Asda for 250, simply because Tesco had added on 250 pounds for a bit of extra problem, you wouldn't be happy. You may not legally be entitled to a refund, but it wouldn't stop you from kicking up a fuss and complaining to Tesco

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most of the ones ive seen have a limit you can claim of a thousend pounds

 

that wont cover labour let alone parts and some of these agreements cost 500 quid

 

As far as I understand it, GAP insurance only covers the shortfall if your car is an insurance write off. So say I have £10,000 left to pay on my agreement and write the car off but the insurance only pays out £5,000, The GAP insurance would cover the remaining £5,000.

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As far as I understand it, GAP insurance only covers the shortfall if your car is an insurance write off. So say I have £10,000 left to pay on my agreement and write the car off but the insurance only pays out £5,000, The GAP insurance would cover the remaining £5,000.

 

 

yep

 

you are correct

must be tired

 

i was thinking of that other con

 

mechanical breakdown insurance

 

 

and a point to remember

 

gap only covers the car, not those mick mouse insurance on the agreement

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Ohh - thatsent a shiver! Mechanical Breakdown. I got suckered with this back in 1972. They really only pay for the most limited issues, and a dealer friend said he'd only known of 1 case out of 100s of claims, that they paid up!

 

If GAP specifically covers the disparity between the actual amount owed and the insurance write-off value, I have to admit in a good number of cases this would be quite useful for the initial part of the loan, especially where the amount owed is far in excess of what the car is actually worth. For this reason I don;t see this as being mis-sold OR mis-bought (at least until the book value = the outstanding loan or is greater).

 

As to the 'inexperience' of the purchaser. Whilst I have sympathy, we all need guidance with big purchases, so it could be said the purchaser was reckless in trying to do it all herself. GAP meets a need and desn;t scream [problem] in the same way Mechanical Breakdown cover works, but these are warranties, the GAP scheme is insurance/risk based.

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Finally had a preliminary decision from the FOS.

 

Last year an adjudicator ruled in our favour (partially) and stated that the AA should honour our request to cancel the GAP insurance, and refund the remaining amount. The adjudicator didn't feel that the insurance had been mis-sold, but felt it unfair that the AA should refuse to allow a partial refund - my friend had paid for 5 years insurance up front, and was less than 1 year into it. The AA's arguement that she had missed the 14 day cancellation period was rejected.

 

Naturally StoneAcre/AA appealed, forcing the complaint to be passed to someone higher up at the FOS. After almost 2 years of waiting, they have reached a decision, which is:

 

* The ombudsman disagreed with the adjudicator's earlier decision that there was no evidence to say the GAP insurance had been mis-sold.

* The ombudsman agreed with the adjudicator's earlier decision that the non-cancellation provision of the GAP policy was a "highly significant restriction" which should have been highlighted prior to sale.

* Ombudsman found no evidence that this restriction had been brought to my friend's attention.

* Ombudsman decided that on the balance of probabilities the insurance had been mis-sold, and that my friend would not have bought it had she understood the terms (as I had pointed out, the insurance cost over 700 pounds from the dealership - buying it directly would have cost around 100).

* StoneAcre charged 215 pounds for "interest & doc fees"; both the FOS and I had requested StoneAcre to provide details of these 'fees' - they refused.

 

So, the ombudsman is awarding a refund of the policy (717 pounds), the "interest & doc fees" (215 pounds), 150 pounds in compensation for 'distress and inconvenience', and interest on the first two items.

 

Am I the first person to have a positive experience with the FOS? (even if it did take 2 years)

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Hi All (think this is the first time I've ever set foot in this forum)

 

This post is on behalf of a friend, who bought a car last year (before I met her). She's not very good with money etc, and ended up being sold GAP insurance along with her car. The dealership 'helpfully' arranged a loan with Barlcays Finance for her too, and she's paying quite a lot in interest.

 

 

With the GAP insurance (provided by AA Warranty), she had agreed to 5 years of cover, and has effectively paid up front, since this had been added to her loan.

 

We'd like to cancel the GAP (for a start, if she really wanted it, she could get it cheaper by buying directly from the AA). Given that the dealership will almost certainly have made commission on the selling of it, there may be grounds to claim it has been missold; but at the moment I'm simply asking for the insurance to be cancelled, and the remaining 4 years to be refunded.

 

Naturally the dealership say we can't do this, and it's up to the AA anyway. The AA are trying to fob me off, saying that if I believe the policy was missold, I should speak to the dealership.

 

The AA have refused to either admit or deny the existance of any secret commission, and I've pointed out to them that - since there are grounds for considerting legal action - I would be entitled to use CPR 31.16 to get this information. I've also made it clear than I'll escalate the matter to the FOS if necessary.

 

They're still refusing to budge. Any thoughts please? Who should I be going after? The AA or the dealership?

 

Hi I have only just seen your question so i guess you have sorted it out by now.

 

I work for an insurance company and there are clear rules and regulations that the dealership must have followed. That said you friend will of had to sign to say that she understood all the rules and been given all the relevant documentation.

 

In this case it is not the AA's fault.Sorry It is the dealership that she bought the policy from. You are totally correct in what you say the AA or their underwriters acting in good faith would supply the dealership with the policy for a set price. The price that the dealership charges will vary I understand that the average is around £395. The difference is the dealerships profit ( less insurance premium tax) .

 

Ok so legally after 14 days your friend has no redemption on the policy but and it is a big but I would contact the dealership and make the prove that all the paper work is in complete order. Chances are it will not be and in it is not then you will be in a very strong position. They will not want the FSA involved so they should just settle.

 

Good Luck

 

Sorry its all a bit late.

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Wow good for you! and well done for taking forward too many people just let it lie. Just a shame you had the stress of taking it that far. & No if in doubt the FSA will always air on the side of the customer after all if the dealership had done everything correctly then your freind would have know exactly what they where getting and for how much.

 

Well done

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