Close Possession

[hallowitch]

form 4 complaint your next move

 

below was posted by tomtubby

My comment is made on the basis of experience of the many cases that are being made to the Courts which are being rejecting on the basis that a Form 4 is the wrong course of action as the company should have first been given the opportunity to correct any mistakes.

 

A Form 4 Complaint is a serious matter and if the court agrees that the complaint is serious enough he can ultimately take away the bailiffs certificate which will lead to him being unemployed and this is possibly why some courts consider that the compliant should first be taken up with the bailiff company.

 

For the collection of council tax, if a person is "aggrieved" at a levy made by the bailiff, Regulation 46 of the Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) Regs 1992 provide that an application should be made to the MAGISTRATES COURT .

 

The following is a TEMPLATE of such a complaint and in all cases that we have advised on, it is recommended that a copy is sent to the LOCAL AUTHORITY and the bailiff company before being sent to the Magistrates Court.

 

Any questions, please post back...

 

 

Mr Jo Blogs

1, High Street

Anytow

Post Code.

 

The Chief Clerk[/font]

xxxx Magistrates Court[/font]

 

 

 

Date:

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Council Ref: xxxxxx[/font]

 

I am writing to request that you issue a Summons against xxxxxxx Council by virtue of Regulation 46 Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) Regs 1992 as a matter of urgency.

 

 

 

 

I am aggrieved by the levy carried out by Mr Smith of ABC Certificated Bailiffs on (enter date) for the following reason:

• The bailiff visited my premises and he has provided a Notice of Seizure of Goods & Inventory advising me that he has levied against a vehicle that was outside/on the drive of my home.
  
• This vehicle is not owned by me. I do not know the owner of the vehicle and it would appear that the bailiff has assumed that this is my car because it was parked close to my home.
  
• The bailiff in seizing this vehicle, has charged me a levy fee of £50 together with an enforcment fee of £150 and I am advised that unless I pay the amount of the Laibility Order of £xxx together with the charges associated with this levy, that the bailiff will be attending at my property to remove this vheilce to satisy my council tax arreas and in addition I will also be liable for further charges for "attending to remove" and I could also be in position of being personally liable to the owner of the vehicle.
  
• I have written to the bailiff company and the local authority concerning this levy but my complaints have been ignored.
  

I trust that this information will be sufficient and please do not hesitate to contact me if you require any further information.

Yours faithfully

[Guest janensteve]

i have complained to the council, not to the baillif. the council have requested a full report from the baillif is that sufficient for the courts, seems daft complianing to both and having differing outcomes.

[lets fight bailiffs]

It would also be wise to send a letter to the bailiffs office so they can't say you have not tryed every avenue.sorry also put complaint at the top of every letter as to avoid any doubt

Edited July 30, 2009 by lets fight bailiffs
more info

[Guest janensteve]

Statutory Instrument 1992 No. 613

The Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) Regulations 1992

SCHEDULE 5Regulation 45(2)(b)

 

 

CHARGES CONNECTED WITH DISTRESS

D. For the possession of goods as described in paragraph 2(3)—

(i) for close possession (the man in possession to provide his own board);

£4.50 per day.

 

2. (3) An authority takes close or walking possession of goods for the purposes of head D of the Table to paragraph 1 if it takes such possession in pursuance of an agreement which is made at the time that the distress is levied and which (without prejudice to such other terms as may be agreed) is expressed to the effect that, in consideration of the authority not immediately removing the goods distrained upon from the premises occupied by the debtor and delaying its sale of the goods, the authority may remove and sell the goods after a later specified date if the debtor has not by then paid the amount distrained for (including charges under this Schedule); and an authority is in close possession of goods on any day for these purposes if during the greater part of the day a person is left on the premises in physical possession of the goods on behalf of the authority under such an agreement.

 

No Agreement = No Close Possession. Also i don't recall the bailiff walking around with a board saying "the end is nigh"

[Guest janensteve]

ignore the above, i beleive that it has been superseded .

 

does anybody know which is the latest regulations ?

[hallowitch]

The Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) (Amendment) (No. 2) Regulations 1993

 

(2) An authority takes close or walking possession of goods for the purposes of head E of the Table to paragraph 1 if it takes such possession in pursuance of an agreement—

(a) to which the debtor is a signatory;

(b) which is made at the time that the distress is levied; and

© (without prejudice to such other terms as may be agreed) which is expressed to the effect that, in consideration of the authority not immediately removing the goods distrained upon from the premises occupied by the debtor and delaying its sale of the goods, the authority may remove and sell the goods after a later specified date if the debtor has not by then paid the amount distrained for (including charges under this Schedule),

and an authority takes close possession of goods on any day for those purposes if during the greater part of the day a person is left on the premises in physical possession of the goods on behalf of the authority under such an agreement

[hallowitch]

how long was the bailiff in your house

 

and an authority takes close possession of goods on any day for those purposes if during the greater part of the day a person is left on the premises in physical possession of the goods on behalf of the authority under such an agreement

[Guest janensteve]

from 10:30am to no more than 2 hrs later. the receipt for the credit card will confirm this. 2 hours in my books is not for the greater part of a working day nor a calendar day.

[Guest janensteve]

i am struggling to find the latest schedule of charges on statutory instruments.

[tomtubby]

get a complaint into the council and the bailiffs and then file a form 4 complaint

 

 

Becuse advising further can you let me know what items were listed on this form?

 

 

PS: A bailiff can be left on the debtors premises guarding the goods as a "possession man".

 

Nowadays the cost and staffing problems associated with close possession and the very small fee allowed by statute law mean that "close possession" is "virtually never used"....

Edited July 31, 2009 by tomtubby

[hallowitch]

from 10:30am to no more than 2 hrs later. the receipt for the credit card will confirm this. 2 hours in my books is not for the greater part of a working day nor a calendar day.

 

 

not in my book either

 

 

The section that says "I request that they be held for a minimum period of 5 days abd until suitable sale date can be arranged" was deleted and across the entire document its says "VOID

 

 

i would also say thet he cant manipulate a document to suit his needs

[tomtubby]

Becuse advising further can you let me know what items were listed on this form?

 

 

PS: A bailiff can be left on the debtors premises guarding the goods as a "possession man".

 

Nowadays the cost and staffing problems associated with close possession and the very small fee allowed by statute law mean that "close possession" is "virtually never used"....

 

 

Bump

[Guest janensteve]

so is it the case, that if niether a walking possession was entered into, nor a close possession was entered into, that effectively, there was no levy ?

[Guest janensteve]

The Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) (Amendment) (No. 2) Regulations 1993

 

doesn't apply in my case, this is non-domestic council tax.

[Guest janensteve]

i meant, my debt is non-domestic council tax

[Guest janensteve]

hallowitch,

 

the Bailliff wrote void across the inventory before he handed it to me. i then struck out The section that says "I request that they be held for a minimum period of 5 days abd until suitable sale date can be arranged"

 

I think it is clear for the world to see that as the heading says

"Inventory of Goods Seized /Removed"

and as the seized bit was deleted by the bailiff. so that the heading says

2Inventory of Goods Removed", then for the purpose of an close possesison agreement or a walking possession agreement, the inventory is of no legal validity.