What are my chances?!

[barty9]

Hi,

 

I would just like to say what a fantastic website first off, truly fantastic and long may it continue!

 

I would like to know from readers if they think i stand a good chance of winning at employment tribunal (or out of court settlement) for the following case of what i believe to be unfair dismissal....

 

I was told on the 8th of July by a line manager that i just wasn't needed anymore and that they were really sorry that things had not worked out for me and that i was free to leave. (which i did with little fuss due to the shock!)

 

i then received a letter dated on the 6th of July (two days before being 'released') to which it stated that the MD was very thankful for all my hard work and that he was sorry that things did not go ahead as planned. and that i would be paid until the end of the month.

 

I was keen to move on but then just two days later i received ANOTHER letter saying that i had been dismissed for gross misconduct! i was really shocked and decided that i really had better appeal against the decision. - due to it being completely untrue. (not managing a contract to the standard expected even though my job role was loosely linked to the contract but certainly not to manage it)

 

i had the appeal meeting yesterday whereby i was told that i could have the misconduct charge quashed in return for me not moving forward with legal proceedings, however if i decided to move forward with a tribunal case then the misconduct wrap would still stand!

 

I have nearly had one years service close to three days and i think that the the only reason i have been let go by the firm is because i wouldn't take part in any fraud to improve the financial status of the company. (this has been refuted at appeal) surprise surprise

 

i have spoken to a lawer who is keen to move forward but i would like to hear opinions on the case and would welcome any thoughts.

thanks

[shifty50dog]

Hi,

The lawyer wants to take on the case then go for it he or she would not bother if they thought they would lose.

[barty9]

Hi thanks for the response, I'm trusting the lawyer but understand that it is my decision. I feel very strongly that it needs to be taken further to get the correct result.

[madari]

If you have not completed a full 12 months service then you can not take your employer to a tribunal.....be carefull if these employment lawyers they are all in it for themselves.

 

Good luck

[barty9]

i started work for the company on the 13th July 2008 and was told to leave on the 8th of July 2009 and was first told that i had a one week notice period. but due to the gross misconduct allegation i am short of the one years notice. i am very confused but my lawyer has informed me that in this circumstance it should be OK to move forward with a claim through ET.

[mariefab]

i think that the the only reason i have been let go by the firm is because i wouldn't take part in any fraud to improve the financial status of the company

 

Who asked you to take part in this fraud.

[mariefab]

I'm not just asking because I'm nosy.

 

You may be protected under the whistle- blowing rules, in which case less than 12 months service doesn't apply.

 

Protection of whistleblowers : Directgov - Employment

[Ell-enn]

If you were "let go" on 8th July with payment to the end of the month, then the lawyer is working on the theory that your notice period takes you passed the 12 month mark. Also, if it looks like the employer has tried to "manipulate" your departure to avoid your achieving 12 months service then you can claim unfair dismissal.

 

As said above, if the lawyer is confident you have a case then you should be OK. Has he taken your case on a no win no fee basis?

 

Ell-enn

[madari]

To be on the safe side i suggest you put in a claim to the employment tribunal and let them decide....that way you will know where you stand,

 

I would do this without the lawyers assistance...get it done by the Citizens advice bureau.

 

Good luck.

[barty9]

hi mariefab it has been 5 members of the management team contantly asking me to forge signatures which i have been very reluctant to take part in. my lawyer has suggested that the Protection of whistleblowers : Directgov - Employment will come into play due to the short 12 months service

[mariefab]

As long as you told someone senior to you in the company about your unwillingness to forge signatures (excluding the 5 members of the management team involved) you should be OK.

 

Just to be clear by, 'which i have been very reluctant to take part in'

you mean did not take part in, don't you?

[barty9]

Hi, thankfully I did raise my concern with other senior members of staff which they agreed it was wrong at the time but did little about to change.

[barty9]

I have since been told that I should expect to wait 21 days for a full investigation to be carried out! I am very much sure that this is simply delaying time and perhaps they think this will all just go away in time!

[mariefab]

I'd write to them,

1. Agreeing to delay taking further action until 21 days from the appeal meeting (17/08/09?).

2. Asking for a copy of their notes of the appeal meeting.

3. Ask what exactly they are investigating.

Sent it recorded delivery and keep a copy. (for the tribunal)

 

It would be normal for them to send you a final decision within 14 days of the appeal meeting. Agreeing to the extension not only makes you appear reasonable it also makes them look 'guilty' (for want of a better word).

 

They wouldn't need 21 days to investigate whether you'd managed a contract to the required standard. They would however need the time to investigate your whistleblowing if that was the real reason for your dismissal.

[barty9]

thank you Mariefab. I have chased them up.

[barty9]

I have finally received a copy of the appeal minutes which I requested nearly three weeks ago! Does anyone know how much weight these have at Tribunal?

Surprise Surprise my last employer has written to me stalling the appeal decision to add another 3 weeks! They will have had 6 weeks to make a decision against my appeal! Any thoughts?

[mariefab]

Firstly, what do the appeal notes say?

[barty9]

They are reasonably close to what was said during the meeting, 7 pages long.

[mariefab]

Do they include this part:

 

i had the appeal meeting yesterday whereby i was told that i could have the misconduct charge quashed in return for me not moving forward with legal proceedings, however if i decided to move forward with a tribunal case then the misconduct wrap would still stand!

[mariefab]

barty

I've read your pm of the 'minutes'

 

I asssume that their notes are a slightly cleaned up, in their favour, version of the meeting?

 

Did you mention at the meeting that you felt that the real reason you were dismissed was your unwillingness to take part in the fraud?

[barty9]

Yes I did. The comments have not been recorded in the minutes. But I was told that they would strongly deny any such allegation.

[mariefab]

If they've asked you to sign a copy of their 'minutes' and return it to them, don't.

 

You have been sufficiently patient.

 

Send this to the person who held the Appeal meeting:

 

Your address

Date

 

Dear Sir,

 

I received on (date) your abridged notes relating to the Appeal meeting held on 27th July 2009.

I notice that there are several omissions.

In particular there is no reference to my stating that I felt that the real reason for my my dismissal was my refusal to participate in the fraud taking place within the Company that I had brought to the attention of ...(Name of person you informed).

 

I informed (Name) *****

 

I understand that you also wish to delay making a decision for a further three weeks.

In the circumstances, I do not find this reasonable.

 

If I do not receive your decision by Friday 28th August I will be compelled to persue further action.

 

Yours etc.

 

Where it shows ***** explicitly describe the fraud in as much detail as possible.

 

Amend where appropriate.

Make two copies, keep one for yourself and send the other by recorded/special delivery.

 

They will be aware that even though they have carefully omitted the reference to the fraud this letter effectively brings it out into the open as you can use it at a tribunal.

[barty9]

Thanks Mariefab,

 

I have sent this an await a response. I will not be holding my breath, but we shall see.

Thank you so much for your help.

[Tom&Jerry1]

Best thing to do is request copy of all notes made at these meetings. Employment law according to the Citizens Advice says " If an employer has excepted poor standars in work previously then it is classed as unfair dismissal"

 

If no previous warning has been given then again it is unfair. They seem eager to stay out of a tribunal & if you win the tribunal can request the charge to be removed.

 

Good Luck. Power to the People

[barty9]

Date now set for hearing - March 2010! My employer have denied most of my points raised and stated that I have received adequate training to complete my previous role..... which I disagree of course! It seems at this stage it will be my word against theirs so now I will prepare and sit tight until March.

I welcome any suggestions.

Happy Christmas