Help Unenforceable credit card contracts

[Matheram]

Hi im staring this new thread as i know there is so many out there already on this subject but i really need to start from the beginning:( i have a Barclaycard wich i have had for some years now and want to find out if this is unenforceable. i have looked through hundreds of threads but im afraid to say i find it very complicated when it comes to seeing if the contract i have is good or bad? i have copied the helpful letters and am going to send off a request for a copy of my full original signed document which from what iv been reading i find hard to belive they will be able to produce after 5 years approx. but even if they did after reading through the threads and seeing scanned images im really not sure what i would be looking for!

 

So in short i wanted to start this thread for anyone like me and if it does turn out to be unenforceable i can get guidance along the way and other people like me can get guidance step by step and hopefully get a possitive result

 

how do i find out once i get some correspondence if mine is unenforceable?

[rickyd]

It depends why you are doing this. Are you seeking to prove unenforceability because you are in dispute over charges etc or are you trying to dodge repayment of a balanceof spending?

 

If its the former reason, there are loads of people with good advice on here who will do as much as they can to help you. If its the latter you could be in for a long wait.

[Matheram]

I would say it is a mixture of both to be honest there have been charges on the account over the years, granted i would say there have not been alot. I understand from a solicitors i have been in contact with that there is currently a case going through the courts which depending on how it goes could mean un enforceability could be at an end, or that it will become easier for people to get these things done faster obviously this depends on the outcome of the case.

 

But in my eyes a contract that is improperly exicuted should be unenforceable regardles if people pursue this action because they have been hit through various charges or they have just had an old credit card that may in effect not have the proper legalities attached to it ?

[rickyd]

I agree.

 

If for example you had applied for a loan and they got your address wrong but approved the lend, they would be able to quote that the loan was not executed correctly as the basic details were incorrect and you wouldn't be able to hold them to the deal.

 

It gets a bit more more tricky where the money (or credit facility) has been made available to you, the cancellation period has passed and you start using the agreement. Any subsequent problems could lead to you claiming it wasn't properly executed therefore is invalid and the implied terms - interest and fees etc could not be applied, but the actual debt (that which had been spent or supplied to you) would still be repayable.

 

Improper execution doesn't mean the debt dissappears - just that the lender cannot enforce the terms of the contract.

 

If the debt was cancelled it would be like a gift, a lovely idea but can't see the courts ever granting that!

[Matheram]

No i agree but for instance on my card i was grabed by some guy in the airport and he filled in a quick application for a platinum card i told him at the time when it asked if i earned over 25,000 a year i didnt but his response was ill get it through for you and im also sure you had to be older than i was at the time but in a rush to get my flight i kind of left it with him and surly enough it came through to my supprise!

 

looking at it i have charges for drawing cash i have charges for the odd late payment i have intrest on cash, intrest on the balance which has all over the last 18months ramped the balance up considerably! not to mention payment protection which is on there of two different sorts????????

 

to be honest if i could get the charges and intrest and any payment protection back the balance would be considerabily reduced and i would probabily clear it in short order! but as most people with credit cards find out once you reach a certain point you end up paying more in interest than you do in actualy reducing you said balance!

[dx100uk]

I would say it is a mixture of both to be honest there have been charges on the account over the years, granted i would say there have not been alot. I understand from a solicitors i have been in contact with that there is currently a case going through the courts which depending on how it goes could mean un enforceability could be at an end, or that it will become easier for people to get these things done faster obviously this depends on the outcome of the case.

 

But in my eyes a contract that is improperly exicuted should be unenforceable regardles if people pursue this action because they have been hit through various charges or they have just had an old credit card that may in effect not have the proper legalities attached to it ?

 

the court case is nowt to do with credit cards, its just bank charges.

 

 

dx

[Matheram]

No there is also a case being dealt with at the moment to deal with this issue with credit cards i have beeen advised of it today by the solicitors

[rickyd]

If you do nothing else, get the PPI cancelled right away (unless you actually want it of course) as the monthly premiums make interest look like good value!

 

I'm bemused that you managed to get one the card when you felt you didn't qualify on age or income grounds, but they've made their money out of you since so it looks like a good decision from their side to give you the card.

 

The maximum charges have been reduced to £12 but cash withdrawals are still expensive compared to other methods and all these add up.

 

The latest from matheram is interesting, we'll need to watch and wait.

[Matheram]

yes i intend to do so asap to be honest they charge a fourtune for any sort of payment protection ! but i would still like to get a hold of my original contract and see how enforceable it is.

 

at the end of the day it would take a few years to pay it as current intrest on it is completly crippling so far as removing anything from the actual balance!

 

which to me means if it is un enforceable and i took the plunge and challenged it as well as with the other points i mentioned even if it didnt dissapear the debt as i know it wouldnt i wouldnt be too fussed.

 

as they could chase as much as they wanted to be honest if legaly they can not have the money. even if it affects my credit raiting it is more likely this would be repaird before i would of been realisticaly paid this credit card off!

[dx100uk]

well you wont get a CCA out of barclays anyhow.

they never send them. [see the barclaycard forum].

 

i'd get that ppi back + int + 8% stat, then make a very low F&F.

 

dx

[Matheram]

Sorry dx100 what is a F&F???????

 

LOL isnt that the point that they wont or cant provide a CCA despite having to do so by law in itself is an offence???????

 

reading various barclays fourumsthey seem to take it right untill a court date then either dont turn up or settle out of court but either way your in for a long bumpy ride!

[dx100uk]

F&F full and final [to close the A/C for good]

 

dx

[Matheram]

yes from what i have been reading it seems they are not very forth coming with that f&f not that you can blaim them but at the end of the day neither are they with the CCA. And lets be honest when someone asks for one they must know the way that its headed so they hedge there bets and hope

 

A) That the person concerned will be fobbed off

 

B) That if they leave it long enought they will lose intrest

 

if this dosent happen then they threaten and chase to try and get people to back down

 

because at the end of the day to date it could turn out very costly if it turns out to be un enforceable

 

which is why i belive they dont give them out even when requested and legaly obliged to do so

 

just my opinion from what research iv done so far:)

[rickyd]

Can't argue with any of your logic.

 

All of the above are probably true, plus they may be in total disarray after taking on all the Goldfish customers, who had previously taken on Morgan Stanley's cardholders.

 

I had a Morgan Stanley card and was happy with their service, especially the cash back feature. Unfortunately it became Goldfish then I got a Barclaycard which I've never used because I loathe and despise them.

 

Imagine the amount of data that must have landed in Barclaycard's HQ as a result of all of this and you get some idea why they are cr*p at providing agreements.

Edited July 29, 2009 by rickyd
typo

[Matheram]

how is it i go about getting the charges and payment protection back then DX100 is this a similar process of letter writing etc?

[dx100uk]

i should think you can gather that from the barclays forum easy enough

1st ports of call is an SAR unless you already have all of your statements.

 

as for the PPI - SAR helps there too.

have a read in the guidence notes at the top of the PPI forum.

 

dx

[Matheram]

Thanx D i will have to take a look ! hoping the solicitors will get back to me before the end of the week and take a look at my agreement and give me an idea as to the enforceability of it so fingers crossed !

[car2403]

Moved to the debt forum - you'll get more exposure here

[Jeff2000]

Hi Matheram, subbing.

 

 

Have you sent for a copy of your credit agreement yet?

 

 

Jeff.

[Matheram]

Yeah sent it off today so im hoping that they will get back to me but who knows ! i have a follow up letter ready though

[Jeff2000]

Yeah sent it off today so im hoping that they will get back to me but who knows ! i have a follow up letter ready though

 

 

 

If you do receive anything from them, scan it and post it in this thread. (Minus your personal details of course).

 

You will then get more feedback and hopefully some more assistance with your next step.

 

 

Jeff.

[Matheram]

Yep will do jeff ill need someone to have a look and give me advise on it so ill get it on as soon as they send me anything !

[Jules55]

I heard that the easiest way is to contact the CFA's an tell them the goldfish data is incorrect and unlawful and ask the CRA's to contact Barclays the owners of Goldfish. its highly unlikley they can find any old data as I heard the whole system is in a right mess lol! Therefore they will come back saying they can't locate the data, then you tell the CFA's they must remove the data as it must be inaccuarate and unlawful, I think you will find that the CFA's will soon remove the data!

[Matheram]

My card isnt with goldfish its just with Barclaycard and surly the cfa will want to know why i feel the data is incorrect? also do the CFA have the power tell barclays to remove my data based on the fact they cannot find it ? also what if they do find it send it to the cfa and it is simply unenforceable? only a judge can do that i have been told?