Urgent Help Needed - Court Says Pay £15,585.59 now to Funding Corporation

[novemberj]

I've just found this site by googling 'help with the Funding Corporation' so please accept my apologies for my first thread being an urgent request for help!

 

My sister had what she thought was a car loan with the Funding Corporation. When her husband lost his job and they missed a payment the FC asked for the full amount plus horrendous interest. She sought advice from CAB and Trading Standards but because it was a Bill of Sale not a loan no-one could help.

 

The original loan was for £8,000. The FC wouldn't accept any offer of payment and repossesed the car selling it for £3,000. This apparently leaves a debt of £15,584.59.

 

The FC have taken my sister and husband straight to court. My sister sent a budget to the court showing they could afford to pay £5.00 per month. CAB agreed that this budget was correct.

 

My sister and husband have now had the following letter from the court:

"Judgement for the claimant (after determination))

 

To the defendent

Before the proper officer sitting at ****** County Court apon the claimant not accepting the defendant's offer of payment.

 

To the defendent

The claimant has objected to the rate of payment you offered. The court has therefore decided the rate at which you should pay. You must pay the claimant £15,584.59 for debt (and interest to date of judgement) and £225.00 for costs. You must pay the claimant the amount of £15,809.59 forthwith.

 

Warning

Note to claimant and defendent. Either of you may object to the note of payment fixed. You must apply to the court with reasons within 16 days. A form is available from the court. A hearing may be arranged and you will be told when and where it takes place. If judgement is for £5,000 or more the claiment may be entitled to further interest and costs."

 

Obviously my sister is going back to CAB. She is now very worried that they will lose the house which is the only thing of value they own ...... this would make them and their children homeless. She was expecting to hear about a court date not to get a letter from the court saying that they would have to pay the full amount and presumably will have to object as they haven't got this money.

 

I think it is absolutely disgusting that companies like this can act in this way. A £8,000 'car loan' costing over £15,000 and not being a loan at all but a Bill of Sale. And the fact that because it is a Bill of Sale they cannot get any free debt or legal advice. They can get free advice now hopefully it is a matter of dealing with the court but they couldn't on dealing with the Bill of Sale itself and were advised to just 'accept the debt' unless they could afford to pay a solicitor to fight it .... which obviously they couldn't

 

Any help or advice much appreciated. They were told by a debt advisor that there was a possibility they could lose their home over this as they have a small amount of equity in the property and it is the only asset they have!

[debtdeception]

It is highly likely that FC will go for a charging order on their house and then seek a forced sale. Really they must get proper legal advice. You should post this thread again in the legal advice section I think there may be more help there. Sorry I can't be of more help but I have not come across this situation before whereby you have a Bill of Sale when you thought you had a loan. It sounds like a nice loophole for the lender.

 

Please pass on any information you get from anywhere else. Also if you don't find the answers here, check out the CCCS (Consumer Credit Counselling Service) cccs.co.uk and look at the monaysavingexpert.co.uk site, maybe there are some resources there.

[saintly_1]

thread moved to legalities

[novemberj]

It is highly likely that FC will go for a charging order on their house and then seek a forced sale.

Can they do this even though the Bill of Sale was secured to the car and the car has now been repossessed and sold? Surely they should get time to pay this debt back as you would with any other loan that isn't secured on your home?

 

They can only access free legal advice as they have no money for a solicitor. They are going to try again with CAB etc but have been hitting a brick wall throughout with debt advice as it is a Bill of Sale not a loan and told the only way to fight this is if they could afford a solicitor as it is complicated.

 

Thanks for posting I've already posted on moneysavingexpert as I've been on that site a while. I think CCCS is one of the sites they phoned before and they can't really help because the Funding Corporation wouldn't accept their offer of payment.

[nicklea]

Read this link:-

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/log-book-loans-bills/112358-bill-sales-repossession-goods.html#post1102655

 

It will tell you everything you need to know about bills of sale

[novemberj]

Thanksnicklea

 

I can't find anything on that thread though to do with court cases and Bills of Sale. Repossession of goods has already taken place and presumably the court has already accepted the Bill of Sale as they have said the defendent (my sister & husband) must make payment. It seems the only option they have is to go back to court and object to the rate of payment

[gillypam]

Hi novemberj.get your bill of sale checked because if it has not got the stamp or seal at the top of the high court it could be void.TFC as admitted ours is void .if it is then l don,t think the courts can action what they are saying but its something to look at.good luck

[trooper68]

Hi novemberj.get your bill of sale checked because if it has not got the stamp or seal at the top of the high court it could be void.TFC as admitted ours is void .if it is then l don,t think the courts can action what they are saying but its something to look at.good luck

 

sorry to hear that buddy

 

True, time line is a must have. From the time the bill of sale is signed they have 7 days (not working) to be effective. It must be correct. Check the Bill of Sale, check the date signed to the date stamped.

 

trooper68

[novemberj]

Thanks Gillypam and Trooper

 

My sister took the Bill of Sale to Trading Standards quite a while ago before it went this far. It is non valid due to some of the wording. However Trading Standards told her that no-one has ever challenged one in court due to the cost of doing so. He also said that it would be up to an individual judge whether or not the fact is was not valid counted.

 

Presumably the court has accepted the Bill of Sale in this case as the court official made the initial judgement they should repay in full. My sister did mention in her correspondence with the court that the Bill of Sale wasn't valid as it wasn't completed properly.

 

I would also like to add that the original loan was for £8,000 plus interest. My sister has paid nearly £6,000 back (including repossession and sale of car). The amount of over £15,000 due now is for 10 years interest, 5 of which are 'up front' (for a period of time after the defaulted payment) which equals £10,000 plus £3,000 for PPI. So she owes £2,000 plus £10,000 interest plus £3,000 for PPI.

 

Update is my sister phoned the court today. They said the initial determination was because her offer of payment was too small as it would take hundreds of years to pay back at the rate she offered. The Funding Corporation is therefore after a charging order on the house.

 

The court advised my sister to write to ask for a redetermination at which she will have to make a higher offer of payment. They also advised her to write to the Funding Corporation with a higher offer of payment but to be honest that seems pointless as the FC has ignored all offers and all correspondance to date. They obviously know what they are doing in taking this straight to court because my sister and husband own a house - the property is in joint names and has enough equity to pay this back and the loan is in joint names. I should add they only have a small house and not enough equity to do much more than pay back the money owed if it was sold and this would make them and their children homeless.

 

My sister has written today asking for the redermination and for this case to held at a court near them.

 

The court when she phoned were very helpful. However she did say it would be up to a judge to say whether or not any new offer of payment was accepted or not. She also said the Funding Corporation couldn't go ahead with the charging order until after redermination. Then they could go for the charging order and probably would as there was a lot of these cases now. If there was a charging order granted it would be up to a judge whether or not their home has to be sold so the Funding Corporation get paid.

 

I would say I am speechless that this can happen but from the start it has seemed like the Funding Corporation knew exactly what they were doing once the payment was missed.

 

I've just done a google for charging orders and apparently they are for unsecured debts. So we are also at a loss why the Funding Corporation can apply for a charging order on a debt that was secured on a car they have repossessed? Unless it is because there is a remaining amount after repossession and sale and that is unsecured?

 

We would all be most grateful if anyone knows anyone who can help in any way. My sister is now looking into her work contract to see if she is allowed to go to the press for non work related matters as maybe that way she could get some help by a paper taking this on

Edited July 28, 2009 by novemberj

[gillypam]

Hi noemberj.l feel so sorry for your sister and husband ,we are in the middle of taking tfc to court. with tfc admitting bos is void and my silicitors have told us that the credit agreement as got some flaws in it so will have to wait and see to see what will happen.tfc are a **** company to deal with all it would take is for them to loose 1 case then the doors would be wide open.we can not let them get away with treating desent people like this.

[novemberj]

Hi again gillypam

 

Wishing you every luck with your court case. I so hope you win. When is your court case? Do keep me posted.

 

I so agree with you that they shouldn't be allowed to treat decent people like this. I can't believe something can be allowed to escalate like this just because someone loses their job and misses one payment. Companies should have to negotiate and respond to people etc rather than being allowed to take them straight to court. And people should be able to get free legal representation for cases like this not be stuck if they can't afford legal bills on top of the debt.

[gillypam]

HI novemberj.we have,nt got a court date yet were still trying to sort things out with tfc.we are on a no win fee ie if we win then tfc will have to pay for all cost,its a shame you did,nt put a tread in when all this started.alot of people mite have been able to help.but give stephensons solicitors tell them whats happening they mite be able to help with tfc phone 01942 774086 give them a ring they are helping us.

[overdone]

HI novemberjwe are on a no win fee ie if we win then tfc will have to pay for all cost,phone 01942 774086 give them a ring they are helping us.

Do you mean to say no win no fee? If you win then it is normal for the other side to pay costs. If you lose, you may have to pay theirs. The Funding Corp sold my debt on to Cabot and that was for £15.000 odd outstanding. I did not get the problems you are getting.

 

Have a look at this thread.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/186644-can-anyone-recommend-decent.html

Edited July 28, 2009 by overdone
add info

[Dougal16T]

Good morning,

Just a very quick thought....I note that original the hearing was not before a District Judge, but an officer of the Court.

 

Am I being thick...but I thought that a JUDGEment could only be given by a District/Circuit Judge...?

 

I am sure Stephensons would (should?) have picked this up, and I look forward to hearing what was said in this respect.

 

My learning of the law is limited, but I am almost certain that a Judgement can only be given by a Judge!

 

Your 'Judgement' does not refer to a District or Circuit Judge, and I note that later on in the posts you state that the Court told you 'it is up to a District Judge to say whether or not any new offer of payment was accepted or not.'

 

Kind regards

 

 

Dougal

[novemberj]

Good morning Dougal and thank you for your post.

 

Unfortunately she was advised by all the debt advisors, CAB etc that unless she could afford a solicitor she had no choice but to accept the debt and make an offer of payment. At the time as they had only her part time income they were living on less than income support. Therefore as she 'admitted' the debt (under protest admittedly) there was no need for a hearing. There could only have been a hearing if she could have afforded the costs and potential costs of one.

 

The creditor, the Funding Corporation, didn't agree to the payment plan she offered. Therefore it was up to the court to set the payment level which they set at payment in full immediately.

 

They now have to either pay in full (impossible) or ask for a redetermination which is what they have done. Obviously they have to pay for the court costs of this.

[gillypam]

Hi overdone.if we win they pay for the costs of the case if l loose l don,t have to pay.thats what it means no win no fee.

[overdone]

Hi overdone.if we win they pay for the costs of the case if l loose l don,t have to pay.thats what it means no win no fee.

Which means they have confidence with your case.

[Dirtball]

Hi overdone.if we win they pay for the costs of the case if l loose l don,t have to pay.thats what it means no win no fee.

This could of course just relate to your solicitor's costs and not that of the funding corp. Just something to bear in mind.

[debtdeception]

Often the no win no fee means that you still have to pay the costs of the winning side if you loose. It all depends on the insurance that your solicitors take out. They will insure their costs, i.e. no fee from them if you loose, but usually the cost of insuring both their fees and the other sides is not something they want to cover. It is only in cases where the likely costs could be high and the opposing side demand to see evidence that you can cover the costs if you loose. In these situation the solicitor will insure both sides to allow the case to proceed.

[Gazza112]

Hi novemberj

 

I noticed in your thread, they was asking £3,000 fo PPI.

Surely your sister was protected if there trying to reclaim that amount.

If your sister was insured and misold a PPI, that that could be an angle of attack in reclaiming.

 

Gaz

[novemberj]

Thanks Gaz. I'll give her a ring and ask her about the PPI and why the insurance didn't kick in :? I can remember her saying something about she was told she had to take it out but not the details.

[Gazza112]

Hi novemberj

 

Just wanted to ask, when was the load taken out with your sister.

Firstly your sister will need to CCA the company just to see what the agreement.

Secondly your sister would need to do get the case set aside.

Then you can challenge them for the PPI's and any charges they put on the account.

As was said in an earlier thread you can contact a No Win No Fee Solicitor but there very few that like taking Consumer Law on.

Hope this helps!!!

 

Gaz

[postggj]

ime glad i found this thread

 

the funding co are the same as welcome in the mick mouse car finance racket.

the only difference is they use bos as security.

 

most of these docs are flawed in one way or another

 

sending an cca request will do no good as a judgement has been awarded.

you need to send the funding co an sar by recorded delievery

 

did the cagger get a default or termination notice

prob not

 

these reasons alone can get a ccj set asside

 

we need to see what docs are in the sar

[postggj]

does the cagger still have the original agreement also

[novemberj]

Secondly your sister would need to do get the case set aside.

Then you can challenge them for the PPI's and any charges they put on the account.

I've just spoken to her and apparently it wasn't PPI. Sorry my mistake. It was compulsory insurance that would kick in if the car was stolen or damaged in which case the cost of the debt was covered.

 

Unfortunately I don't think they can get the case set aside as she was told by advisors to make an offer of payment (accept the debt) unless she could afford a solicitor. She couldn't get a solicitor willing to take it on without solicitor's costs.

 

She's had no response from the Funding Corporation regarding her letter to them saying she is asking for a re-determination (as advised by the court). They did however send her a letter saying they are adding 8% interest to the debt

 

Can they set their own interest onto a debt that has been subject to a court determination?