Was paying for years

[calmlikeabomb]

Hi all,

 

This is my first post having stumbled across these forums and it looks really helpful having read a few of the posts.

 

Can I just get some advice from any of you on my situation?

 

The dates will be a bit vague as I havent had any paperwork for years for reasons of moving or working away.

 

About 10 years ago I had a loan and a credit card with MBNA and all was well. Then as often happens I hit some hard times and defualted etc. It culminated with me speaking to them about 6 or 7 years ago and agreeing to pay £50 per month for each. Now at the time I was told it was at a low interest rate to assist in the repayment, however as I discovered recently it was only for the loan it would appear.

 

I paid the £100 for about 6 or so years and never received any correspondence about balance or any statemants whatsoever, however as I previously mentioned I was moving around a lot (although for the first two years I was contactable). Earlier this year I rang MBNA and they couldnt find my loan account, however my credit card balance had gone from about 3.5k down to 2.7k which came as a bit of a shock that it was so high. I immediately cancelled the £100 per month with my bank as I was infuriated that they were only reducing the debt by about £8 per month and didnt have a clue what had happened to the loan account, which I was still paying towards.

 

Now a few months later those lovely people at Capquest have been in touch demanding the balance.

 

What I would like to know is in your opinion what is my best course of action from here? Bearing in mind i dont know a great deal about this kind of thing?

 

Any help or pointers greatly received.

 

CLaB

[Blondmusic]

Send them a CCA request to see if they hav an enforceable agreement. The template is below. Edit the letter to suit, DO NOT SIGN IT, enclose a £1 Postal Order and send Recorded or Special Delivery.

 

Please ammend paragragh 1 to suit. ie s77 Fixed sum credit such as loans, s78 Running account credit such as credit cards & catalogues and s79 Hire agreements.

 

 

Your Address

 

Date

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Re:− Account/Reference Number xxxxxxxxxx

 

This letter is a formal request pursuant to s.77(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. I require you to provide me with a true copy of the credit agreement relating to the above account, together with any other documentation the Act requires you to provide.

 

I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit. You are reminded that should you fail to comply with my request, the provisions of s.77(6) will apply.

 

(DELETE THIS BELOW IF YOU ARE SENDING THE LETTER TO THE ORIGNAL CREDITOR AS OPPOSED TO A DEBT COLLECTION AGENCY)

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA 1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties.

 

Your attention is drawn to ss.5(2), 3(b),6 and 7 of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUTR).

 

I enclose a postal order in the sum of £1.00, which is the statutory fee. Note that these funds are not to be used for any other purpose.

 

If you are unable to comply fully and properly with this request, you should confirm this in writing at the earliest opportunity, and certainly within the statutory time limit for compliance, and return the fee.

 

We look forward to hearing from you.

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

print your name

[Undercover-Elsa]

Hi and welcome to CAG,

as Blondmusic says, send a CCA (Consumer Credit Agreement) request for both the loan and card to these robbers. Send by recorded delivery with £1 POSTAL ORDER per request.and definitely do not sign..just print your name.

They have 12 days + 2 working days to come up with them, after which you can legally stop paying and put the account in dispute until they produce it.

Keep us posted on what happens and shout if you need more help

The template letters in my signature.

Time to take control

All the best

Elsa xx

The links have changed, so here's the template: http://www.consumerforums.com/resources/templates-library/86-debt-collectors/581-cca-request-letter

Edited July 20, 2009 by Undercover-Elsa
Update links

[calmlikeabomb]

Hi there,

 

Thanks for the replies. Sorry to sound an idiot but the only one they are chasing is the cc agreement so that letter above goes to capquest right? Also is there any way I can get details from MBNA? I dont have the loan account number or anything relating to it but it would be nice to see if its paid off.

[Blondmusic]

Yes it goes to Capquest. If you get any letters regarding other accounts just amend the letter to suit your needs, enclose another £1 postal order and send it off.

 

Golden Rule

Never speak to Debt Collectors on the phone.

[calmlikeabomb]

Thank you, I shall not ring them then

[Blondmusic]

They might phone you so just refuse to answer security questions and tell them everything in writing only.

[Undercover-Elsa]

Hi again,

Re getting details from MBNA, you'd need to send them a Subject Access Request letter asking for ALL data they hold on you. They'd need the address you were at when the account/s were active.Obviously it would help to have the account numbers but hopefully your name and address should suffice.If not they should return the £10 fee.

The template is below, amend it to suit. Again, print your name, send by Recorded Delivery with a £10 postal order.

The next bit depends on whether Capquest BOUGHT the debt or are still referring to MBA as "clients"...if CQ now own the debt, then you'd also need to send a Subject Access Request to them, to see just what they've been playing at with your money over the years.

Elsa xx

[calmlikeabomb]

Hi there

 

Just a little update in that I have lots of paperwork back dating back to 2005. Included on there was some payment protection insurance which I remember cancelling with them in around 2006 as I wasnt aware I had it on there.

 

It seems that they purchased the debt from MBNA.

[calmlikeabomb]

Just got a copy of the original credit card agreement through, but its only the copy, not the one I would have signed.

[debt4get]

Just got a copy of the original credit card agreement through, but its only the copy, not the one I would have signed.

you can send them this

 

Your ref

 

Re: my request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974

Thank you for your recent letter sent to me, the contents of which are noted. I appreciate your quick response to my original letter. However, the reply received by me does not fulfill your requirements under the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

The Act demands that I be supplied with a true copy of any properly executed credit agreement that exists in relation to the above account. I may ask for this on demand providing that a fee of £1.00 is paid. This fee was sent with my original letter.

My request remains outstanding. The documents, like the one you sent in your reply, does not constitute a true copy of any credit agreement that may or may not have been signed by me on the opening of this alleged account. These documents neither confirm that I am liable for any alleged debt to you, nor gives me any chance to evaluate whether any original agreement was ‘properly executed’

I still require you to send me a true copy of the original credit agreement that you allege exists. As you will know, under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, a judge is not permitted to make any enforcement order unless the creditor can provide a true signed copy of the original credit agreement. This means that unless you can produce such an agreement, this alleged debt is not enforceable in law.

You had until xx/xx 2009 (12+2 working days after the request was made) to provide me with the true copy I requested. You will then be in default of my request. Any account I hold with you is now in legal dispute. Whilst the account remains in dispute, you are not permitted to ask for any payment, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you. Furthermore, whilst the dispute remains, you are not entitled to charge any interest on the account, nor make any further charges to the account. Additionally, you are not entitled to register any information on this account with any credit reference agency.

To register information with a credit reference agency, you must have written consent from the customer to collate and share such information. This consent is given in the form of a signed credit agreement, so until you produce such an agreement, you may not do this.

The requirement for consent to share data is a clear requirement of the Data Protection Act 1998. Any such attempts to share my data without my consent will be met with a complaint to the Information Commissioners Office the time limits, which are laid down in the Consumer Credit (Prescribed Periods for Giving Information) Regulations 1983 are clear. You must supply an executed credit agreement within 12 + 2 working days of a proper CCArequest. If you fail to comply with a legitimate request the account enters a default situation.

To sum up, I will not be making any payments to you until you provide me with the document I have requested. Whilst you remain in default of my request, you are not permitted to take any action against this account. This includes adding further charges and passing any information to the credit information industry.

I expect you to write to me confirming that the account has been closed and no further action will be taken.

I look forward to your reply.

 

Yours faithfully

[calmlikeabomb]

Many thanks for that Debt4get, I shall get that off recorded delivery however can I just confirm that its ok even though the copy they sent has my name and address on it, it isnt the actual signed copy.

 

I think I may have made a mistake in my above post.

 

Sorry to sound naive, but looking at the timescales involved did they act in the correct timeframe? Reding some other posts it looks like they had one month plus 12 days?

 

Timeline:

 

Letter dated 22nd Jul, they confirm receipt of my request and place account on hold for 28 days.

 

24th August, a letter from MBNA stating Capquest have been assigned the debt plus reams of paperwork as detailed above.

 

Letter dated 4th Sept copy of my credit agreement arrives shortly after.

[debt4get]

no that was before the act was changed I believe sometime last year. in actual fact they can come up with the cca at any time, what happens after 12+2 days is the account goes into default where they may not ask for payment nor do you have to offer payment.

the cca must be signed by you just cos its got your name and address on it dont mean a thing, they could have made that up a week ago.

[calmlikeabomb]

Hi all,

 

Got a reply from Capquest stating that they are satisfied that the copy of the agreement is enforcable.

 

Any advice on what my next move is? All help still greatly appreciated.

[Undercover-Elsa]

Hi

They would say that, regardless.

We need to see the agreement they've sent you, so we know how best to respond.

Could you scan it, blank off any personal details, and upload it to Tinypic.com, then copy the link it gives you and paste the link on here,

Regards,

Elsa xx

[babybear39]

You should ask your local TS to have a look at it as well. They may refer to LACORS for an opinion though. Push them if they stall

[calmlikeabomb]

Hi

 

Sorry for the delay in replying. Elsa the links are as follows:

 

http://i37.tinypic.com/2eeagp5.jpg

http://i36.tinypic.com/i5n8us.jpg

http://i33.tinypic.com/iedo9l.jpg

http://i33.tinypic.com/awrsb6.jpg

 

Babybear, Im not sure what a TS or LACORS is, I will look them up in a bit

 

As a point of interest I used to have payment protection insurance on there that I wasnt aware of (I had a period out of work when I could have used it as well), can I go after them on those grounds, although too be honest I dont really want anything out of them, just to get them off my case.

[babybear39]

TS = Trading Standards

 

LACORS = The Local Authorities Coordinators of Regulatory Services

[citizenB]

The documents you have scanned in are Terms and Conditions. What you want is the agreement/application form that has the prescribed terms and your signature.

 

You will find examples of MBNA "agreements" in the CAG library

 

http://www.consumerforums.com/resources/templates-library/86-debt-collectors/609-mbna-agreementsapplication-forms

 

You will also see a few links at the top of the page in the link above, which will guide you through what is required on an agreement for it to be compliant with the laws.

[citizenB]

http://www.consumerforums.com/resources/templates-library/86-debt-collectors/582-possible-letter-when-a-questionable-agreementapplication-is-sent

 

Link above to a letter you can send in respect of the information they have sent.

[calmlikeabomb]

Many thanks, will get onto that.

[wendella]

subbing...

[calmlikeabomb]

Ok the latest is a solicitors letter claiming they will take action as I havent responded to their letter from July, which I obviously have. They still havent replied to my letter I sent them re: the signed copy of agreement.

 

Im guessing its just a waiting game now?

[babybear39]

Yes, if you've put the account in dispute in writing.

[calmlikeabomb]

Still no response to my last letter however I have now received the pre-action letter threatening court, bailiffs etc.

 

Can I write to them and point out they havent responded to my request?