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001

I might of balls this up but I got a ticket... please help....

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I received this on my car one day......

 

 

"and I sent them this reply but I wasn't educated enough I didn't think I have to be.. the guy only waited 1 minute. I was in a parking bay where you need a pay & display, I went to the shop to get change what wasn't too busy & by the time I got back I had that on my car..."

 

 

this is what I sent just with out the fake name and doh postcode...

 

 

 

 

(my 1st reply)

 

 

"jonny smith

666 trying to shaft me

col d sack

london, croydon

no ple

 

PCN: 00000000000

 

reg: 000000

 

 

hello sir/miss

 

I am appealing this PCN

 

I was only at the shop getting change as the machine dose not have the facility to take notes, so I had to go to the shop to get change

 

what makes me annoyed is that the guy did not wait any time at all

 

from 13.52 to 13.53

 

so to my understanding is that he did not give me enough time

 

this is a complete rip off and a [problem]"

 

.........

 

 

 

I got the reply letter im posting it now

 

 

 

 

pictures of the letter/reply here now in full perfect size :)

 

http://img44.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=30480957.jpg

Edited by 001

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can't read them

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Top left says "PENALTY CHARGE NOTICE" and was issued by Croydon Council.

That's all that I can make out. I've tried enlarging them but the detail is not there to start with.


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man these people just wont give up but nor will I.... I need some help to wright to them as my reply to the leeches.....

 

 

their reply to me 2#

Edited by 001

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how come they comming out so small

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Hang on. I am just on the phone to NASA to see if I can borrow the Hubble radio telepscope. I might then be able to read what you have posted up!

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Upload the images to Photobucket or Imageshack. (Google for the sites).

Then post a link to the images.


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thanks will do

Edited by 001

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Try attaching the documents........

 

See this thread for details.......

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/welcome-consumer-forums/107001-how-do-i-dummies.html#post1151870


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I got an image shack thing here look

 

 

ImageShack Gallery

 

 

p.s thanks every one

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sorry editd

 

basically their saying they didn't see me going to the shop lol...

 

sorry my wringing and spelling is very bad I have a spell check and everything

Edited by 001

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sorry my wringing and spelling is very bad I have a spell check and everything

 

Look at the top of the text editing box. Over on the right-hand side, you'll see the spellcheck icon..... spelling.gif

Click on that. It will give you the option of downloading the spellcheck dictionary. Once you have installed that, you just need to click on the icon to spellcheck any post.

I have been using it for a few years and it works well.

 

Regards, Rooster.


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Sorry, but they are correct. There is, in law or regulation, no allowance to get change for a meter or p&d machine.

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Sorry, but they are correct. There is, in law or regulation, no allowance to get change for a meter or p&d machine.

so is it a mistake I have made, I i parked out side the box on the yellow line I would of had 5 minutes????

 

so do I have to pay this can I not fight still>?>?

 

I didn't have change and their was nobody around to get change, the machine dose not give change or take notes what was I meant to do?

 

do I have to change the angle or my next reply?

 

is their any templates???

 

thanks

Edited by 001

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i just sent them this reply

 

 

hello sir/miss

 

I am appealing this PCN and acept your notic

 

like I said I was only trying to get change so I can place in the meeter, I only had a £5 note. I see the gentlemen on mopeds theses days so it was impossible for me to talk to him and explain, I was only away for less then a moment... I had to get change and I had no other option but to go to the shop/means of a way to get change. I did pay after as I had an oppointment for that day at the job center for an 40 minuit interview & can prove this,,, so I did pay & display I did not intent to just go to the shop sir/miss. I alway always always pay & display it would be stupid not to. I know I should of had change with me and normally do but this time I had none just a £5 note only and not enough change on me, I asked a passer by but they didn't have enough on them to change a £5 note for me.

 

I do not have my car any more and had to cancel the insurance policy as I have lost my job. also I had to take out a crisis loan from the job center today that I can also prove to you. I am totally broke and would like to fight this please as I always payed and displayed even on this day in question...

 

he only observed from 13.52 to 13.53 and I know you have explained this to me that their is no time limit.

 

I dont understand the letter sent to me also I am very unclear on that matter.

it didnt have not regulations or terms and condisions, I dont feel it is fair also as I dont understant my rights.

 

also on the yellow ticket I wanted to know what the word "act"of 2004 means please

 

thank you

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The PCN is slightly flawed as it doesn't say when the PCN was served, the signage is incorrect as it has no time of operation and the letter is wrong as its not a pay and display its a shared use bay so you should have been allowed time to get a permit.

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they scare you with the money to with make some words bold like MUST and FULL lol these people truly are rip offs.

 

its an independent agency meaning a business/company with shareholders

so i belive anyway

 

i hope im doing the right thing as im stinking BROKE

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they scare you with the money to with make some words bold like MUST and FULL lol these people truly are rip offs.

 

its an independent agency meaning a business/company with shareholders

so i belive anyway

 

i hope im doing the right thing as im stinking BROKE

Not sure if you're getting confused here, but it's a Council PCN you have received, NOT a PPC invoice. This one needs to be defended properly, not just ignored. Can't really offer any other advice as i'm not an expert. Also, no offence meant, but your posts are badly constructed and tricky to understand.

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Not sure if you're getting confused here, but it's a Council PCN you have received, NOT a PPC invoice. This one needs to be defended properly, not just ignored. Can't really offer any other advice as i'm not an expert. Also, no offence meant, but your posts are badly constructed and tricky to understand.

 

 

 

I know I am sorry for that I tried to deleted some posts as at I had problems uploading pictures.....

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I have to disagree with 001 when he suggests you write to them. If you do, you will just get a reply advising you to wait for a Notice to Owner and then make a formal representation. It's not worth the bother - if you want to take this further, just wait for the Notice to Owner - but be aware that if you do, you would forfeit the chance to pay the discounted rate.

 

In deciding whether this is worth fighting, a little homework would be useful. It's true that there is no requirement for a waiting time in this situation, and they expect you to have change ready.

 

The outcome of a further challenge will hinge on whether they normally give a discretionary period, for example in case you were out of sight but at a different P&D machine when the attendant turned up (phone the local authority and politely enquire as to how they work this), and also whether it is reasonable for you to assume the machine might take bank notes (do others in the area? again, ask them).

 

G&M makes a very good point in that this was a shared use bay. If there is facility for you to go inside and fetch a permit to display, then there should surely be an observation time allowed - also the loading argument might come into play, depending on the local regulations.

 

I assume that this was your first P&D ticket of the day for that location - you weren't 'topping up' an existing one for a longer stay. (If you were, that changes things.)

 

If these enquiries turn out in your favour, I think you ought to fight it. If not, your case isn't too strong legally - but clearly the moral argument is on your side.

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just out of learning and interest i was on another site and they told me this....

 

hope it helps this thread......

 

 

http://web.mac.com/rmbscarb/iWeb/rmbconsul...0challenge.html should give you all the information you need - clearly the bay is a hybrid of the 1028.4 and 1032 markings. Unless specific authorsation has been obatined from DfT for those markings, then the parking restrictions are unenforceable.

 

Go to the Council and ask for the Traffic Order relating the the bays - you have a right to view this so don't go the Freedom of Information route, it will just delay things. Maybe ask the Council's Highway Manager (or similar) for the ahorisation from DfT for the use of non-prescribed markings on the bays

 

DO NOT allow yourself to be fobbed off, you are on pretty solid ground here and need to be forceful with the Council. Make sure they understad that you will not pay this and will appeal to the adjudicator if they fail to cancel the charge.

 

 

 

 

 

OK this is very good. I suggest this appeal:

 

(Don't bother with the sir/miss bit)

 

I am writing to appeal against PCN number XXXXXXXX, which was affixed to my vehicle on 03/06/09 by CEO number 345.

 

The reasons for my appeal are as follows:

 

The bay in which my vehicle was ticketed is wrongly marked, and does not conform to any diagram specified in the TSRGD 2002. Specifically, the bay purports to be a 1028.4, but features the bay dividing lines such as are featured in a 1032 bay. Conversely, if the bay purports to be a 1032, it should feature double termination lines. This makes the bay in question a hybrid, and as such it fails to convey a restriction. I have included a picture that illustrates this discrepancy.

 

At the time of ticketing I was getting change for the parking meter. This activity took no longer than two minutes, and I went directly to the closest shop to get change, and directly back to my vehicle. I can provide a signed statement from my passenger to this effect if neccesary. The ticket shows that the car was observed from 13:52 to 13:53. This shows that the observation time was at most 60 seconds, and at least 1 second. This observation is not long enough for the CEO to ascertain whether a motorist is in contravention in the case of paid-for parking.

Should this appeal not be upheld, take this as a formal request for this information:

-Copies of CEO 345's notes in relation to my vehicle

-Details of any and all training that CEO 345 has undergone

 

If this appeal is not upheld, I will have no hesitation in taking my appeal to the independant adjudicator. I will also initiate and follow up a complaint and investigation into why Croydon CEOs are not trained to employ a reasonable observation time.

 

 

 

 

this site that gave me that advise was

PePiPoo: Helping the motorist to get justice

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I see no shop. How far was this shop? The whitgift centre?

 

As Pat says, there is no allowance to get change. Up to you to carry it.

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just out of learning and interest i was on another site and they told me this....

 

hope it helps this thread......

 

 

http://web.mac.com/rmbscarb/iWeb/rmbconsul...0challenge.html should give you all the information you need - clearly the bay is a hybrid of the 1028.4 and 1032 markings. Unless specific authorsation has been obatined from DfT for those markings, then the parking restrictions are unenforceable.

 

Go to the Council and ask for the Traffic Order relating the the bays - you have a right to view this so don't go the Freedom of Information route, it will just delay things. Maybe ask the Council's Highway Manager (or similar) for the ahorisation from DfT for the use of non-prescribed markings on the bays

 

DO NOT allow yourself to be fobbed off, you are on pretty solid ground here and need to be forceful with the Council. Make sure they understad that you will not pay this and will appeal to the adjudicator if they fail to cancel the charge.

 

 

 

 

 

OK this is very good. I suggest this appeal:

 

(Don't bother with the sir/miss bit)

 

I am writing to appeal against PCN number XXXXXXXX, which was affixed to my vehicle on 03/06/09 by CEO number 345.

 

The reasons for my appeal are as follows:

 

The bay in which my vehicle was ticketed is wrongly marked, and does not conform to any diagram specified in the TSRGD 2002. Specifically, the bay purports to be a 1028.4, but features the bay dividing lines such as are featured in a 1032 bay. Conversely, if the bay purports to be a 1032, it should feature double termination lines. This makes the bay in question a hybrid, and as such it fails to convey a restriction. I have included a picture that illustrates this discrepancy.

 

At the time of ticketing I was getting change for the parking meter. This activity took no longer than two minutes, and I went directly to the closest shop to get change, and directly back to my vehicle. I can provide a signed statement from my passenger to this effect if neccesary. The ticket shows that the car was observed from 13:52 to 13:53. This shows that the observation time was at most 60 seconds, and at least 1 second. This observation is not long enough for the CEO to ascertain whether a motorist is in contravention in the case of paid-for parking.

Should this appeal not be upheld, take this as a formal request for this information:

-Copies of CEO 345's notes in relation to my vehicle

-Details of any and all training that CEO 345 has undergone

 

If this appeal is not upheld, I will have no hesitation in taking my appeal to the independant adjudicator. I will also initiate and follow up a complaint and investigation into why Croydon CEOs are not trained to employ a reasonable observation time.

 

 

 

 

this site that gave me that advise was

PePiPoo: Helping the motorist to get justice

 

 

Obviously the 3 grounds for cancellation I gave you were not good enough? :rolleyes:

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