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    • i would suggest you look at the dates of posts on those other forums paypal do not sell debts and even if they do, there is stuff and all any debts buyer could do yo you in the UK. forget it, or even better go complaint to your bank and tell them paypal did not advise you £1200 would come out of your a/c, which they should do, and that it was the result of fraud. you don't have to tell them any details.   as for the rest of your debts..   debt IS NOT A CRIMINAL OFFENCE IN THE UK..where the beep did you get that from!!   pers i'd be opening a parachute account and getting asll your income paid into that so NO-ONE can get their hands on it. cause NW are just about to introduce 40% OD int rate and they will forever be draining you of money   get OUT NOW from them.   dx      
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    • Is this any better?  I've resigned myself to losing. Admittedly, I don't quite know what I'm doing. I just hope I get a remote hearing, that should save me some embarrassment.      1) The Claimants pleaded case is that the Defendant entered into an agreement with Provident subsequently assigned to Vanquis Bank Limited under account reference xxx.    2) It is admitted I have had financial dealings with Provident in the past. However, have no recollection of the alleged reference number the claimant refers to.   3) In February 2019 I made a formal written request to the Claimant for them to provide me with a copy of my Consumer Credit Agreement as entitled to do so under sections 78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.    4) On the 21 June 2019 the Claimant sent a response which enclosed a reconstituted copy of an agreement, default notice, notice of assignment Provident to Vanquis, notice of assignment Vanquis to Lowell. [EXHIBIT x, x & x].   5) On 30/07/19, I received a claims form from the County Court Business Centre, Northampton, for the amount of £369.84. The claimant contends that the claim is for the sum of £369.84 in respect of monies owing under an alleged agreement with the account no xxxx  pursuant to The Consumer Credit Act 1974 (CCA).   6) Contained within the claimants particulars the claimant states that the account was subject to assignment from Provident to Vanquis. The claimant states a further assignment to them occurred on 12/06/2017 with notice given.    7) It is denied notice of assignment from Provident to Vanquis and subsequently Vanquis to Lowell were ever received.    😎 The claimant states documents were received at both addresses. The claimant doesn’t appear able to confirm my address and therefore cannot say with certainty said documents were received. Furthermore, the client did not issue said documents and therefore cannot prove delivery.     9) It is denied any communication took place with myself and Vanquis Bank Limited. Any alleged legal assignment to part of the “Fresh Start” initiative had not been informed. I have no previous knowledge.   10) Under the consumer credit act 2006, until debts have been repaid, there is an obligation to send statements and notices to the debtor at prescribed intervals at no more than 12 months. The statement should explain the money borrowed, money paid, interest in all cases and the outstanding amount. Consequences of failing to make repayments and the opportunity of making minimum payments should be informed. The Claimant has submitted a statement of accounts dated March 2019. This having followed my request for a credit consumer agreement. It is denied this document and any such required statement of accounts required under section 77A during the alleged agreement were ever received.   11) The claimant states that a default notice was issued on 18thJanuary 2017. The payment date requested by Vanquis Bank Limited on said document is  28thFebruary 2017. The formal Notice of Default that was accompanying this letter displays a requested payment date, 28thFebruary 2019. (Exhibit x, x)   12) I argue that this is not in fact a COPY of an original default notice, that they state was issued during February 2017, but that this is a fabricated version of a default notice created by Lowell. Either way the default notice was not issued by the assigned creditor (Vanquis).   13) It is therefore contended that the original creditor failed to serve a valid Default Notice pursuant to section 87(1) Service of a notice on the debtor or in accordance with section 88 (a “default notice ”) is necessary before the creditor or owner can become entitled, by reason of any breach by the debtor of a regulated agreement.   14) The Claimant states a default notice was not required. If there is a default in payments during the fixed term a default notice must be issued. The Claimant states they were informed a default notice was sent on 18thJanuary. The Claimants case relies upon being informed and does not constitute fact.   15) It is denied a default notice was ever received.    16) It is admitted I responded to the Claimant’s pre-action protocol letter addressed in my name. I indicated I did not know if I owed the debt. I indicated as such having no recollection of affiliation with Vanquis nor Lowell. A default for the allege debt appearing on my credit file only November 2019.    17) I understand that the claimant is an Assignee, a buyer of defunct or bad debts which are bought on mass portfolios at a much reduced cost to the amount claimed and which the original creditors have already written off as a capital loss and claimed against taxable income.   As an assignee or creditor as defined in section 189 of the CCA this applies to this new requirement on assignment of rights. This means that when an assignee purchases debts (or otherwise acquires rights under a credit agreement) it also acquires certain obligations to the borrower including the duty to comply with CCA requirements (such as the rules on statements and notices and other post-contractual information). The assignee becomes the creditor under the agreement. This ensures that essential consumer protections under the CCA cannot be circumvented by assigning the debt to a third party.   18) Under Civil Procedure Rule 16.5 (4) Where the claim includes a money claim, a defendant shall be taken to require that any allegation relating to the amount of money claimed be proved unless he expressly admits the allegation. Therefore, it is expected that the Claimant be required to prove the allegation that the money is owed as claimed.
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Hi, We've recently moved out of a rented flat. The tenancy agreement said we had to give a months notice. When my husband went to do this the landlord was all, "no no don't worry move out when you want I'll refund you any overpayment in rent." Thinking ourselves lucky to have such a nice landlord we duly moved out 10 days early.

 

Check out was completed, agreed no defects and deposit would be refunded in full. Duly received, banked, cleared. Still no 10 days rent. So we wrote and asked for it. LL claims to have found teeny weeny burn mark in kitchen worktop next to cooker and has produced quote for £130 for replacement of whole thing and on that basis is witholding refund of rent.

 

I would say defect not detected at check out - can't prove we're liable (fair wear and tear anyway after 4 years?) and he should still adhere to arrangement to refund overpayment in rent. What would anyone more knowledgeable say?

 

Thanks x

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I would say what you say - check out inventory done and dusted, signed by both parties, I hope, that's an end to it.

 

I should send him a letter before action asking formally for the return of your monies as agreed. However, how was the agreement arrived at? Verbal or written, because if verbal its his word against yours unless your husband had a credible witness with him when this was said. If written, well, he released you early!

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Thank you (and sorry for late reply - been away).

 

We issued proceedings via MCOL. He has entered counter claim - so it looks like we're going to Court...

 

Agreement was verbal but he confirmed it in writing. Only problem is the letter seems to have gone astray in the move.... I'm thinking though, I know he copied it to the managing agents - can I subject access request it out of them do you think?

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Yes, do an SAR request and see what comes back, hopefully it will be in time for the Court date. Just say that you wish to have a copy of their file, including all data they hold so on and so forth, but I wouldn;t specifically refer to this letter at this stage, see if it comes back with the info first. Either hand deliver it or send it registered.

 

Also have another very good look for the original, it has to be somewhere if you know you don't generally bin things like that.

 

Your defence will be that there were no problems or damage afterwards; you have signed and dated documentation to this effect, and have received your deposit back. You were unaware of any mark or chip in the worktop, and you certainly didn;t cause it. You cannot be responsible for what happens in the property after you have vacated. You agreed to leave early with the landlords good wishes and you have this in writing (we hope!). Of course, don't forget to say that you went to give the correct notice, and only left early because he was agreeable to that.

 

What happens next is up to the judge but without that letter, you left early, and were liable for the last bit of rent on the face of it. So you need to obtain it. If you can;t find your copy, and the agents don't come up with the goods, no harm in putting in your defence that you are waiting for a copy of it from the managing agents/they have ommitted it from your SAR - and then you'll need to take that up with themif you want to.

 

Don't worry about going to Court, its a matter of being prepared and a bit of deep breathing beforehand. Its only County Court, very informal, but just take a breath before you speak, and run quickly through yourmind what you want to come out of your mouth, stay calm, and don;t feel intimidated, the judge will help you. You should be in and out within about 10 minutes with luck.

 

Fingers crossed and I hope all goes well.

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Hi pink1,

 

I am not a betting man but if I were I would back you to win this case. As jackieandwayne have already stated, the check out is what its all about and if no burn mark was detected at that point then how on earth can they prove it was you that did it? In addition, burn mark in a kitchen could reasonably be considered fair wear and tear - lots of hot pans, kettles, etc it is certain that it would happen at some point.

 

TFT


09/07/09 :)Business Studies BA(Hons) 2:1:)

 

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Thank you, both, feeling a bit calmer about the prospect of court now....

 

Haven't received the allocation questionnaire yet - subject access request sent today. Fingers crossed the timings work out and I guess I'm spending my weekend unpacking those last few boxes in the spare room!

 

Do you think it's worth subject access requesting the LL directly too? He's an officious so and so - sure he'd keep copies of all his letters!

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Well, you could, but if it were me I wouldn't want to give my defence away at this stage. I'm hoping the agent won't tell the landlord about your SAR - they really shouldn'.t

 

On the other hand if the landlord realises what your defence will be, he may well see the error of his ways and give you your money back.

 

Its your call - you know him!

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Didn't mean defence, I meant case! LL is the defendant!

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So we've received the details of his counter-claim :lol:.

 

Firstly - and most interestingly - he admits that he agreed to refund the rent for the period in question!!

 

Secondly - and less interestingly - he is claiming £680.79!! This is made up of £138 for the replacement of the entire kitchen worktop (really? for one little burn mark??) which we were expecting but also £542.79 in rent!! He says we "deliberately ignored the contract terms of giving written notice which if it had been adhered to the notice to leave would have been 9th June 2009. The loss of rent equates to 26 days" Not sure how he works this out...

 

Having calmed down and put my rational head back on surely the salient facts remain that the "damage" was not detected at the "check out" and as for the rent issue the tenancy agreement was terminated with the full refund of our deposit (right?), surely he can't go back and change his mind now?

Edited by pink1

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So now I'm thinking - given that he admitted that he agreed to refund the monies to us has he infact entered an admission and a counter claim? He (and the court) are calling it a defence and a counter claim but he doesn't defend our claim for the repayment in the rent... Should I ask (can I ask?) for the status of what he has entered to be altered?

 

I am worried though about the prospect of facing a £600 claim against us. We can't afford it... The man is (IMHO) a bully (I, in fact, left the checkout in tears) and we don't want him to get away with this as a matter of principle though. I'm not worried about the claim for the worktop because as jackieandwayne and TFT say it wasn't detected at the checkout - it's the rent bit that's bothering me. Rationally I'm sure he can't change his mind now and he's just trying to make us withdraw, but I'd really appreciate it if someone more knowledgebale could let me have their thoughts please?

 

Thank you x

Edited by pink1

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Ok, as i read it, he admits your claim. So he will be ordered to pay you.

 

If you click on the warning triangle this will alert the site team that you need a legal eye cast over this - as i am not a lawyer, just a HO.

 

However, your claim is to do with the rent (a money claim), whereas his counter claim is to do with the deposit (which should have been protected). Now this is where I am not sure, but I would imagine the judge will just disregard it or whatever, (a) because he released your deposit in full to you, on the back of an agreed satisfactory check out inventory and (b) issues to do with tenancy deposits are a different matter and dealt with in a different way, (I think) and there is no issue with the deposit since he has returned it to you in full.

 

I'd love to know if I am right, but if the site team are unavailable for any reason, then you can pop along to your local Shelter office for advise - they'll soon put you straight with this.

 

Post back if you do go to Shelter, your experience will help lots of people on here.

 

And, always remember, you cannot get blood out of a stone, so if the landlord should win (I doubt) then tell the judge that you can only afford a quid a week!

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"If you click on the warning triangle this will alert the site team that you need a legal eye cast over this"

 

When I do that it says, only to use it to report abusive posts etc? Being a newbie I don't want to do anything too naughty...

 

whereas his counter claim is to do with the deposit (which should have been protected)

 

Don't think so - it was paid over four years ago...

 

Thank you so much for your continued help with this - I'm off to find Shelters's website!

 

Px

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Pink1,

 

Looks like the advise that has been given is all good, thats why I havent chipped in. Chances are your LL wont even turn up in court!

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Thank you. I wondered, from some of your other posts, if you might help me with the more legal slant jackieandwayne suggested I get... I have e-mailed Shelter but they can take 3 days to reply and I am stressing a little...

 

given that he admitted that he agreed to refund the monies to us has he infact entered an admission and a counter claim? He (and the court) are calling it a defence and a counter claim but he doesn't defend our claim for the repayment in the rent... Should I ask (can I ask?) for the status of what he has entered to be altered?

 

What do you think?

 

Also are my instincts right about him changing his mind about the rent and notice period etc? Is it that he is estopped from enforcing the term of the tenancy requiring a month from the commencement date or is is that given that the tenancy agreement no longer exists the terms of it are no longer enforceable?

 

Thank you so much,

Px

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Tipping the warning triangle is to alert the site team to abuse etc., but also just to alert them that you need a little more help. It's ok - they haven't bitten me yet!

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Site team aware. When does your defence need to be in by ?


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Wow thank you. Allocation questionnaire and defence have to be with the court by a week today (Friday 31st).

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It seems pretty clear-cut to me:

 

1. He agrees he let you leave early so the stuff about a month's written notice is nomesense

 

2. You have the signed check out sheet sayong no defects.

 

He hasn't a leg to stand on IMO. Just hold on in there and make these points in your statement of case and in court.

 

In fact, you could go one better, you could apply for his defence to be struck out on these 2 bases under CPR Part 3.4 (2)(a) as defence discloses no reasonable grounds for defending the claim nor for bringing a counter claim. Include that in the apprpriate place on the AQ - you could do it in 'other information' - something like

 

"the defendant, on his own admission in his defence, released me from the requirement for 1 month's written notice and, further, signed an inventory on termination of my lease agreeing that there were no defects in the property. On this basis I request the court to issue an order stiking out the defendant's defence and counter claim under CPR part 3.4(2)(a) as disclosing no resonable grounds for defending the claim nor for bringing a counter claim"


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Thank you so much - huge relief. Will do as you say re: AQ but please coud you just clarify "CPR"?

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Shall I enter a defence as well just to be on the safe side?

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Yes, your defence would be based on the same 2 points.

 

('CPR' = Civil Procedure Rules - see PART 3 - THE COURT'S CASE MANAGEMENT POWERS - Ministry of Justice)

 

PS - I have recently helped someone else win a case based on a verbal agreement for over £50k as a litigant in person


Steven

 

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Ahha! Shall I ask the Court to make a consequential order for him to pay up? I'll work on a draft over the weekend...

 

Is there a thread for your amazing sounding win?

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Is there a thread for your amazing sounding win?
Unfortunately not. It was pretty simple really - my freind's company did some urgent work for another company without a written contract ('cos it was urgent, see), sent an invoice and then the other comapny refused to pay them on the basis that their end-custimer hadn't paid them.

 

Tough, I said. We started a claim in the County Court based on e-mails which showed that the other company has requested work, had accepted work as being acceptable, had refused to pay. Once we sent copies of these e-mails to their solicitors they advised their client they hadn't a hope of winning so they paid up.

 

The admission in the defence and the signed inventory correspond to the e-mails in the above case.


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Nice :D

 

What do you think about the "consequential order" - is it as self explanatory as it sounds?

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I'm not sure what it means TBH


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Brighthouse Won unconditionally August 2007

Goldfish Won unconditionally April 2008 (including CI on the basis of Sempra)

Clydesdale Financial Services (now BPF) Won unconditionally February 2008

 

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. Do not take any legal action on my advice alone. Almost everything I know concerning the law I learned from this site.

 

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