Hsbc Cca

[johnnymitch]

btw TNF...... did you send a letter to the CRAs ?

[Guest jsa12]

HSBC do not keep any documents prior to 2003 (I have it in writing) so if your account is from 2003 or before then there is a good chance your agreement went through the shredder

 

well my cca request is outstanding for three months,however the letter i received a month ago states that.

 

"the relevant documentation will be supplied to you when we are in a position to do so".

 

this account dates back to 1996,elsewhere on the forum agreements from that year appear to be non existent "we do not hold a copy",what i find interesting is now they say they can this time.the account went into default in 2005,somethings not right and i hope they are being honest in saying they will supply me with a copy and this is not an attempt to stall/mislead me and possibly others too.

[thirty-n-fat]

It would seem that my letter has completely been ignored. I now have a letter threatening a charging order on my property.

 

I have contacted the ombudsman and consumer direct but heard nothing.

 

Do these people really get away with treating people like this and what can I do?

 

btw TNF...... did you send a letter to the CRAs ?

I didnt do this yet, as I though that I should ensure this was cleared up and back to hsbc first. Bad idea?

[johnnymitch]

I think the CRAs need to be made aware that their is a dispute over the bank defaulting you ........ they probably won't do anything other than 'tagging ' it .... but you'll have gone on record , so that if FOS tells the banks to remove it ..the CRAs can't say they didn't know it was in question ..... they just accept blindly what the banks tell them.... and need to be ordered to remove a default before they'll comply ........

[johnnymitch]

It would seem that my letter has completely been ignored. I now have a letter threatening a charging order on my property.

 

As for this threat , I seem to remember hearing they're not going to be allowed to do this now , under a certain (ginormous) amount ....

 

Maybe someone else can enlarge on this aspect ..........

 

Meanwhile , you could try 'Googling' Charging Orders ...... that will give you loads of info .....

Edited July 12, 2010 by johnnymitch
afterthought .........

[InformedSearcher]

I think the CRAs need to be made aware that their is a dispute over the bank defaulting you ........ they probably won't do anything other than 'tagging ' it .... but you'll have gone on record , so that if FOS tells the banks to remove it ..the CRAs can't say they didn't know it was in question ..... they just accept blindly what the banks tell them.... and need to be ordered to remove a default before they'll comply ........

 

Hello,

With respect you have 'words' with CRA and enter a dispute.

They contact bank who replies with 'this is correct' (amazingly always in time!)

CRA takes no action telling you what the bank says and gives you a copy.

CRA is happy, bank is happy, you are not!

'Impasse' unless there is another way short of court action?

 

Michael

[johnnymitch]

I hear what you're saying Michael , - but i think it was pete (castlebest ) who said on one of his threads that the CRA acknowledged the request for removal of the Default and said they would 'tag' the file until the dispute with the bank and FOS had bee resolved ....

 

If I'm wrong , no doubt pete will come on and tell us ............

 

Thing is , if you go to court to try to get a default removed , at least the judge knows you have taken all steps to try to get it sorted yourself ....... they place great store by that .......... you have exhausted all other avenues before resorting to court action .....

[thirty-n-fat]

Just as a quick update to this and thanks to all for the support so far, I have contacted FOS who sent me an authoriseation pack which I have signed a returned. Not sure from what i have read that this will help at all?

 

I have recieved letters following this including a final demand from MCS, should I expect them to send me random threats from time to time or should I take these letters seriously and respond? The account is in dispute and the hsbc documentation backs up the lack of signed agreement, however is seems that MCS wont accept this.

 

I have managed to save some money by not making payments, should I use this to make them an offer of 1p in the pound to see if this will put this to a stop?

[Old Cogger]

Probably get a threatogram from DG Solicitors (the table opposite or next door when HSBC staff get back from Tea Break), make sure correspondence in writing only, they will try for CCJ regardless of your response but fight them, even letter told me they had a CCJ against me so watch them as they did not get one - case was stayed but nobody told me as they could not get their paperwork right, only found out 6 months later after chasing court for info.

[ConsumerMark]

appreciate their tactics and only to be expected.

 

how should i play this though, am i better to ignore this and stay under the radar, after all they appear to ignore everything i say to them!

 

or should i be sending a response to each letter they send?

[thirty-n-fat]

HELP!

 

I have now recieved a very official looking cca from the courts and have spent the last 2 days on here reading about what to do next.

 

Surerly if they have addmitted they have no cca they cannot do this?

 

Can anyone help? Not sure that I can cope with going to court!

[the_shadow]

HELP!

 

I have now recieved a very official looking cca from the courts and have spent the last 2 days on here reading about what to do next.

 

Surerly if they have addmitted they have no cca they cannot do this?

 

Can anyone help? Not sure that I can cope with going to court!

 

CCA from the court or County court claim????

 

No doubt they will rely on a reconstruction if they dont have the original. Can you post up the Particulars of claim leaving out anything that personally identifies yourself. You need to acknowledge online IF you wish to defend which will give you longer then to file a defence

 

S.

[thirty-n-fat]

thank you for the kind offer of help, I dont have a scanner or any fancy it gizmos but I can type the important looking parts...

 

The claimants claim is for the balance outstanding under a credit card agreement dated **1998** and numbered ******* regulated by the consumer credit act 1974. The Defendant has failed to make payment of the arrears of instalments as required by the Statutory Default Notice served by the Claimant dated **February 2010**.

 

And the claimant claims:

 

1. *** More than 5000 ***

 

2. Interest pursuant to Section 69 of the County Court Act 1984 at a rate if 8% from the date hereof at a daily rate of 1.64 to the date of the judgment or sooner payment.

 

 

I was hoping that I could use the cca route to pay off the debts quickly as the circa 26% would make this impossible for me, now I am not sure what to do? I have confirmation via data protection SAR that the agreement doesnt exist and have put the account into dispute so cannot see why they are doing this?

[the_shadow]

Hi TnF you need to keep an eye on the dates and quickly decide the way you wish to go.

 

If defending then you need to acknowledge service and then send off a CPR 31.14 request for the agreement and a copy of the default notice both of which have been mentioned in the POCS and you are entited to see. This would be the agreement they are relying on in court which may or may not be a reconstruction.

 

I'll move this thread to the legal forum for more advice. Please let us know if you wish to defend and we'll post up a cpr 31.14 letter.

 

S.

[thirty-n-fat]

mr shadow, thank you again!

 

i am sure that i should defend this and appreciate your advice on CPR 31.14

[the_shadow]

Ok CPR 31.14 letter:-

 

Dear Sir,

 

Re: (Claimant's name) v (Your name) Case No:

CPR 31.14 Request

 

On (date) I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the (Name) county court.

 

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

 

[Prior to the issue of proceedings I had delivered a request for the production of the agreement mentioned in the Claim Form and on which you rely. That request was ignored][delete if no such request was delivered]

 

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of [each of the following / the] document(s) mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

 

1 the agreement. You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

 

2 the default notice

 

[Although your claim is for a sum which is not more than £5,000.00 and will in all likelihood be allocated to the small claims track for determination upon my delivering a defence, at this moment in time I have not delivered my defence and the case has not been allocated to a track. In consequence the provisions of CPR 27(2) are of no effect and you should not seek to avoid compliance with your CPR 31 duties by claiming otherwise]#

 

# delete if claim for a sum exceeding £5,000.00

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the document(s) I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter. Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

 

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

 

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

 

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In addition your statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extension of the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not less than 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my request and you must state the new date for filing my defence.

 

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

 

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, fail to request more time or fail to agree to an extension of time for the filing of my defence, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order.

 

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you.

 

yours faithfully

[the_shadow]

Ok, delete the red bits if they dont apply and take out the underlined bold sentence starting with #delete.

 

You need to sign it, and send it to issuing solicitors by either recorded delivery or special delivery ASAP

 

You also need to post up on this thread when you received the claim and the date of the claim, normally its allow 2 days for service and then 14 days from date of service to either defend or acknowledge the claim, if you acknowledge the claim online then you get a further 14 days to file a defence. This 28 days period is why its so important to issue a CPR 31.14 letter quickly.

 

S.

[thirty-n-fat]

hello, thanks for your help.

 

i sent the letter you advised on monday by recorded post.

 

the ccj is dated the 20th and was received on the 27th - our postman was on holiday and we didnt have post every day that week if that makes a difference.

 

from what you say, i should go online now and transmitt my intentions.

[thirty-n-fat]

evening all.

 

the ccj is dated the 28th so I think that I must loginto moneyclaim by the end of this week.

im assuming that I dont contest jurisdiction? and should I wait until the last day to submit?

 

Reading the other threads, I expect that hsbc may not supply any requested paperwork but this doesnt always go in my favour.

[thirty-n-fat]

as an update, I have filed a N9 acknowledgement to the court. My understanding is that I now have 14 days (29th) to file a defence.

 

As you may expect, I have had no response to my CPR 31.14, the deadline has passed. Should I follow this up and does the lack of anything from them help my case?

[thirty-n-fat]

Hello and good evening!

 

I am plannign to use the defence here... http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?276581-Urgent-help-needed-had-a-claim-form-from-northampton-county-court&p=3150537&viewfull=1#post3150537

 

I have requested documents under CCA and SAR and now CPR31.14

 

They have admitted following the sar that the documents dont exist, I fail to see how they can now use them to support the ccj.

 

Should I mention cca and sar and letter in my defence as i feel this is an important point???

[the_shadow]

Hi TnF,

 

Please please stop calling this a CCJ, a CCJ is what you receive if you LOSE, this is a county court claim

 

If I were you because of the postal mix up, I'd phone the Northampton court and a) Get them to confirm the acknowledgement has been filed and b) when the defence is due according to them.

 

If 7 days have passed since sending the CPR 31.14 I would re-send also recorded or at least signed-for a letter stating you await a response to your CPR 31.14 and until you receive that information you are unable to defend properly and will indicate to the courts and the judge how the claimant is not conforming to CPR.

 

I dont believe you've told us who is taking you to court?

 

S.

[the_shadow]

....and have a read of this thread, mainly the posts by PT2537

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?241827-Legal-Action-how-to-start-off.-IMPORTANT-IF-YOURE-BEING-SUED

 

S.

[thirty-n-fat]

If 7 days have passed since sending the CPR 31.14 I would re-send also recorded or at least signed-for a letter stating you await a response to your CPR 31.14 and until you receive that information you are unable to defend properly and will indicate to the courts and the judge how the claimant is not conforming to CPR.

 

I dont believe you've told us who is taking you to court?

 

S.

 

Will send a letter tommorow, hopefully I can find one here somewhere.

 

The claimant is HSBC BANK PLC and the documents all go to DG Solicitors who I beleive are HSBC.

[the_shadow]

Will send a letter tommorow, hopefully I can find one here somewhere.

 

The claimant is HSBC BANK PLC and the documents all go to DG Solicitors who I beleive are HSBC.

 

Ok, doubt you'll find a template letter so just go with your own words...

 

Something like...

 

Ref: Claim xxxxxxxxxxxx at xxxxxxxxxxxxx County Court

Dear Sir,

 

I sent on xx/xx/xxxx a request under CPR 31.14 for disclosure of the documents mentioned in your particulars of claim, I gave you 7 days from the date of service to supply said documents. To date you have not forwarded the requested information and as such I am at a disadvantage in this matter. I enclose a copy of the letter sent.

 

If you do not propose to supply these documents then I may be forced to apply to the court for disclosure as without these requested documents I will be unable to plead my case properly.

 

A copy of this letter is being sent to the court and put on file.

 

Regards

 

Ensure you make a copy and CC the court quoting your court case with a covering letter just asking them to put this letter on file with your claim. Send the copy to the solicitors with a copy of the previous letter sent, remembering to get at least proof of postage if not signed for or recorded delivery.

 

AND **dont** forget to check with the court for the date of filing the defence, that is a deadline you CANNOT miss, as soon as we know the deadline we can formulate some kind of defence even without the documents.... and if you can read the first couple of posts on that thread I put up it would be advantagous to you too.

 

S.