1st Credit - Edited CCA

[robjam1969]

Hi

 

After a 7 week delay received an 'edited' copy of my CCA relating to a Citi Loan that has now been assigned to 1st credit. Mostly looks in order apart from the fact the reference number has been hand written (assume this is what is worrying them!) Unable to post up as rely on work computer.

 

Loan was for about 2K set up in 2007.

 

They have asked me to confirm the signature on it is mine and if I provide them a copy of it they will send me a complete copy of the agreement.

 

They seem to be asking very nicely with just the one paragraph inviting me to discuss payment proposals.

 

Am I right in thinking I can refuse this request - I suspect they don't have an unedited version!

 

Thanks

[alfwithhair]

Don't send them anything with your signiture on, or confirm anything.

If you consider what they have sent does not fullfill your request, send the 'account in dispute' letter.

 

DO NOT speak to them on the phone or aknowlegde the debt the them or their client

[accesspwd]

Please DO NOT send anything with your signature on it. Or do a mickey mouse one lol

 

Be very careful, sounds like they could be upto something

[ScarletPimpernel]

This appears to be Worst Cretins standard response to CCA requests. I suspect it's an attempt to claim that you acknowledge the debt even if the paperwork is defective.

 

There is, of course, no legal requirement for you to provide a signature. The only conclusion that can be drawn is that 1st Credit aren't sure of your identity; but wait! They must be, otherwise they wouldn't have sent all those demands - because that would be contrary to the OFT Guidance.

 

I have challenged them on just this point (on behalf of a client). I wrote to them in February, and they did not respond. I reminded them in April, and got a holding reply, grandly informing me that I should expect a reply from 'the relevant department'. I'm still waiting, although 1st Credit keep leaving messages on my premium rate answerphone number; when I rang and reminded them that they'd agreed (in writing), to do everything in writing, they suddenly discovered that 'another department is dealing with this now - sorry we called'.

 

All very odd.

[robjam1969]

Thanks for replies so far.

 

I am going to send standard you have failed to comply letter, does anyone have a copy of this I can copy into word. For some reason can't open the docs in the template library.

 

I will just tinker with it to let them know that I am not obliged to provide them with signature etc.

 

Also is an e-mail a reasonable way to deliver this to them?

 

Thanks

[babybear39]

Send them this, amend to suit, do not sign print your name, send recorded keeping a copy with your postal receipt:

 

Account In Dispute

 

Ref:

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Thank you for your letter of xx/xx/xx, the contents of which have been noted.

 

You have failed to respond to my legal request to supply me a true copy of the original Consumer Credit Agreement for the above account.

 

On **DATE** I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8. A copy of which is enclosed for your perusal and ease of reference.

You have failed to comply with my request, and as such the account entered default on **DATE**.

 

The document that you are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and was signed by both your company and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, you are also obliged to send me a copy of that document.In addition a full statement of this account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account.

 

Furthermore

 

 

You are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before your client enters into a default situation.

 

This limit has expired.

 

As you are no doubt aware section 77(6) states:

 

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)

 

(a) He is not entitled , while the default continues, to enforce the agreement.

 

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

 

As you have Failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, Failed to send a full statement of the account and Failed to provide any of the documentation requested.

 

Consequentially any legal action you pursue will be averred as both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

 

Furthermore I shall counterclaim that any such action constitutes unlawful harassment.

 

Please note you may also consider this letter as a statutory notice under section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect.

 

This means you must remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with any credit reference agencies.

 

Should you refuse to comply, you must within 21 days provide me with a detailed breakdown of your reasoning behind continuing to process my data.

 

It is not sufficient to simply state that you have a ‘legal right’; You must outline your reasoning in this matter and state upon which legislation this reasoning depends.

 

Should you not respond within 14 days I expect that this means you agree to remove all such data.

 

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY

Action against an account whilst it remains in dispute.

 

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

* You may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

* You may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

* You may not pass the account to a third party.

* You may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

* You may not issue a default notice related to the account.

 

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities as I see fit.

You have 14 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter which is now a formal complaint.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

 

I look forward to hearing from you in writing.

 

Yours faithfully

[robjam1969]

Thanks BB

[robjam1969]

A nice copy of first cretins complaints proceedure received. Wasn't expecting that. Maybe they are pretending to be professional!

[babybear39]

Awww...Someone there must have pressed the right key on the threatomatic

[cerberusalert]

Awww...Someone there must have pressed the right key on the threatomatic

 

No.... someone stamped on them from a great height; The Office of Fair Trading: OFT imposes requirements on 1st Credit over debt collection practices

[babybear39]

No.... someone stamped on them from a great height; The Office of Fair Trading: OFT imposes requirements on 1st Credit over debt collection practices

 

Yes, I know cerbs, but 1st crud seem to be on a suicide mission 8)

[cerberusalert]

Yes, I know cerbs, but 1st crud seem to be on a suicide mission 8)

 

I know you know, but it gives me a nice warm feeling when I get the chance to remind people that !st Credit are on the OFTs radar.

[babybear39]

I know you know, but it gives me a nice warm feeling when I get the chance to remind people that !st Credit are on the OFTs radar.

 

Ah yes, sorry my humour isn't good at the mo due to a nasty case of shingles. You've cheered me up now though by pointing that out

[cerberusalert]

my humour isn't good at the mo due to a nasty case of shingles.

I've suffered from that twice....not nice.

[babybear39]

Plus I'm getting carpet fitted...

 

Oops. We're not sposed to chatting we're sposed to be helping

[cerberusalert]

Plus I'm getting carpet fitted...

 

Make sure it's loosely fitted otherwise you'll be in agony.

[babybear39]

[robjam1969]

Received a response to my dispute letter. They state that their client accepts not currently enforceable but debt remains due and payable. also lots of waffle about not having to remove default notices and what part of s10 I am relying on under data protection act.

I am starting to wonder if they have a copy of the CCA - surely they will have one for a December 2007 loan? if they have it why hold it back?

 

will sit back and wait- they havnt asked for a payment in two months now!

[cerberusalert]

They've admitted the don't have an enforceable CCA when they said "their client accepts not currently enforceable but debt remains due and payable."

 

The debt still exists but they cannot enforce it. They can ask you nicely to make payment but equally you can tell them to go forth & multiply.

[robjam1969]

Funny enough since finding CAG I now realize how little power they have over me! As you say they can go forth and multiply. I havnt forgotten how they spoke to me the first time they rang me- like a piece of dirt! I now know not to speak to them but can understand how they would intimidate some.

[robjam1969]

Hi All

 

7 weeks and nothing at all from them!

 

Surely they are not going to just go away?

[babybear39]

Enjoy the peace while it lasts

[cerberusalert]

Hi All

 

7 weeks and nothing at all from them!

 

Surely they are not going to just go away?

 

Their attentions will be focused on other victims in the hope they won't fight back.

[ScarletPimpernel]

1st Credit finally answered my complaint about the 'edited CCA' response. They claim that it was 'necessary to ensure that they were sending confidential documents to the right person'. I have pointed out to them that if they were not certain of the individual's identity, then sending demands for payment was contrary to the OFT Guidance, so either way they were non-compliant. They've gone all quiet now...

[babybear39]

Uncle Bob's having a strop I expect lol...